Who wins trump or Biden?

[Chunketh]

 

The evidence is all over twitter look up @project_veritas 

Exactly what I said, self appointed "election monitors" making stuff up.

Hows that Virginia/Wisconsin/"insert state" here claim that more votes have been cast than voters stacking up? Oh that's right it isn't, its ********.

 

[Warlord]

 

Ironically, the alt-right are the sheeple now, following blinding and barking when told to bark. They don't realise it yet but they will eventually.

At the very least if Biden does manage to steal it the Senate is in Republican hands (I predict) and nothing will get done. No left-wing rubbish and a more pro-capitalist agenda. Yipee!  

[satsuma]

 

HPC is a different place to how it was before. It has always had an alternative view and people willing to dig deeper but some posters have gone off the deep end now. I don't know if they realise their decisions were all wrong and they've decided they just want to watch the world burn and will support anything that is anti-mainstream or if it's just part of the global swing towards anti-intellectualism. 

Take Boris the liar. No self respecting HPCer would have supported this buffoon 10-15 years ago. He would have been everything they despise, a rich, lying, corrupt toff, the embodiment of the establishment trying to make excuses for the failures. But somehow they've swung. He has now managed to convince these people that he is the solution to the problem and the problem is always outsiders, liberals, foreigners, pikininis, letter-boxes, etc. 

Ironically, the alt-right are the sheeple now, following blinding and barking when told to bark. They don't realise it yet but they will eventually.

It’s all part of the plan to dumb down society and turn people into pliable morons.  Part of this is providing two flavours of vanilla when it comes to voting.  

[Chunketh]

 

At the very least if Biden does manage to steal it the Senate is in Republican hands (I predict) and nothing will get done. No left-wing rubbish and a more pro-capitalist agenda. Yipee!  

Don't forget, no dip**** narcissist either.

[miguel]

 

Not that its likely to affect me, but my mates have kids and I would rather they have a chance to not see the horror show that Trump and his ilk want to see.

Trump is still in 1970. I have a friend who's a life long Tory. 25 years ago any green issue was a commie bstrd plot favoured by tree huggers. He was also vehemently opposed to the introduction of the minimum wage. He is now heavily in favour of both, although still a Tory. He hates the idea of some form of UBI, dead against it. Might take another 20 years but it's coming. It's inevitable. No one can stop it.

The world moves on. 

[Warlord]

 

Exactly what I said, self appointed "election monitors" making stuff up.

Hows that Virginia/Wisconsin/"insert state" here claim that more votes have been cast than voters stacking up? Oh that's right it isn't, its ********.

 

 

[Chunketh]

 

 

Cant find anything specifically countering that one, but other claims of dead people voting have already been rebutted.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/detroit-voter-roll-lawsuit/

I am sure there are probably isolated cases of fraud going on, it happens every year.

Do you think every single case of fraud is benefitting the democrat side? I bet you do.

[14stFlyer]

 

Take Boris the liar. No self respecting HPCer would have supported this buffoon 10-15 years ago. He would have been everything they despise, a rich, lying, corrupt toff, the embodiment of the establishment trying to make excuses for the failures. But somehow they've swung. He has now managed to convince these people that he is the solution to the problem and the problem is always outsiders, liberals, foreigners, pikininis, letter-boxes, etc. 

I agree with you dugs. It is astonishing that normal people in the US and U.K. are voting against their better judgement, best interests, and (in my view) moral values and supporting people like Trump and Johnson.
 

In the U.K. we have the former “Red Wall” voters, and in the US, Low paid workers in the likes of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania and  Phoenix, Arizona.

I can only explain their support for their natural enemies by pointing out that previous leaders who should have been improving their lives (like Blair in the U.K. and Obama in the US) have sold them down the river in favour of Bankers and the global liberal elite. 

[Young Turk]

 

Biden is also on track to receive the MOST votes EVER for ANY presidential candidate in history if you believe these results.  That is laughable . 

That's not laughable. Biden has more votes than popular candidates from decades ago (Reagan, FDR, etc.) because the population and hence the electorate is bigger. There were fewer votes for third parties this time, as people were more focused on whether Trump won or lost (sometimes the winner has had a low vote total because there was a popular third party candidate, e.g. George Wallace or Ross Perot). There was a higher turnout. As above, people seem to have been more motivated to vote this time (Trump became more popular with Republicans - 90% of Republicans voted for him in 2016 and 93% this time. Similarly, more anti-Trump people were probably motivated to vote for Biden than did for Clinton.) and there has probably been a bigger voter registration campaign this time and the increase in mail in voting predictably contributed to a higher turnout.

Biden currently has 50.4% of the vote, which is unremarkable. 

 

[ticket2ride]

Orange Adolf still rated a 17% chance to win the election. Anyone tempted to have a nibble?

[Young Turk]

 

@spyguy the Senate looks like it is going to be Republican controlled so if Biden wins he can't do anything.  No Green New Deal, or other left wing crap.

This is ideal for conservatives. Very little will change and if anything goes badly it can be blamed on the Democrats.

 

[PeanutButter]

 

The USSR economy, at its most basic level, failed -  no food on shelves, DRs driving taxis, before there was political collapse.

US are well fed.

[Young Turk]

 

They can. The term (IIRC) is 'faithless elector'.  They can vote for another declared candidate but not a new candidate (Is Kanye West still on the paper?).  The fall back to that is the Senate / House.

 

That would probably trigger a constitutional amendment to fix.

In 2016, one of the Texas electors went Ron Paul and three of the Washington electors went to Colin Powell. Paul and Powell weren't candidates.

[Mikhail Liebenstein]

 

This is ideal for conservatives. Very little will change and if anything goes badly it can be blamed on the Democrats.

 

Some swing states have their Senates elections in 2022 - so Ugly Kid Joe might get a 2 year run.

[msi]

 

In 2016, one of the Texas electors went Ron Paul and three of the Washington electors went to Colin Powell. Paul and Powell weren't candidates.

Thanks, I stand corrected on that point.  Any significant move would still trigger a constitutional amendment.

 

[PeanutButter]

 

I agree with you dugs. It is astonishing that normal people in the US and U.K. are voting against their better judgement, best interests, and (in my view) moral values and supporting people like Trump and Johnson.
 

In the U.K. we have the former “Red Wall” voters, and in the US, Low paid workers in the likes of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania and  Phoenix, Arizona.

I can only explain their support for their natural enemies by pointing out that previous leaders who should have been improving their lives (like Blair in the U.K. and Obama in the US) have sold them down the river in favour of Bankers and the global liberal elite. 

Logic doesn't work on them. 

It just doesn't. I know it seems nonsensical but that's because you come from a mindset where logic can be used to change your opinion. For many (perhaps even most) people this is completely overridden by emotions. Which is why arguments online are futile. 

We're living in a world where conspiracy theories are believed by millions. Antivax and flat earth are popular viewpoints. Our leaders are open liars. Science and fact are endless undermined.

We're post-truth and all that's left are emotive fairytales. Monkey brains in an AI world. 

[wighty]

[wighty]

 

 

Probably some in-bred redneck still claiming welfare for his long dead daddy thinks he can get away with voting Trumpy, lol.  (not that this doesnt happen in UK)

[msi]

 

Logic doesn't work on them. 

It just doesn't. I know it seems nonsensical but that's because you come from a mindset where logic can be used to change your opinion. For many (perhaps even most) people this is completely overridden by emotions. Which is why arguments online are futile. 

We're living in a world where conspiracy theories are believed by millions. Antivax and flat earth are popular viewpoints. Our leaders are open liars. Science and fact are endless undermined.

We're post-truth and all that's left are emotive fairytales. Monkey brains in an AI world. 

Emotion overwhelms facts - I think it's an evolutionary trait (Not sure if there's a tiger in the trees? - trust your gut).

As we evolved we used emotion as a summary screen for facts (I might not understand all the theory behind X, but I trust the folks to be truthful and in our interests). There were enough people that could understand enough to support the emotional response.

I feel we've reached a point where certain forces can short circuit this and directly generate and emotional response to challenge factual positions (AntiVaxx, Voter Fraud etc).  Where in the past this would be challenged by rational discourse and evidence this is now undermined with the  'freedom of speech = equivalence of speech'.  Add in the standard Troll techniques and it just drains any sensible position (with the trolls then declaring 'victory').

 

Education on Troll techniques, how to validate points, and separating freedom of speech from equivalence are strong tools toward this.  Guess who doesn't like them.

[pig]

 

I agree with you dugs. It is astonishing that normal people in the US and U.K. are voting against their better judgement, best interests, and (in my view) moral values and supporting people like Trump and Johnson.
 

In the U.K. we have the former “Red Wall” voters, and in the US, Low paid workers in the likes of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania and  Phoenix, Arizona.

I can only explain their support for their natural enemies by pointing out that previous leaders who should have been improving their lives (like Blair in the U.K. and Obama in the US) have sold them down the river in favour of Bankers and the global liberal elite. 

Many are simply voting for WWF heroes. Not the skinny boring guy with the glasses with his 'facts and figures', the guy with the crazy hair who jumps up and down megaphoning hate and platitudes in pleasing directions.

[Gigantic Purple Slug]

 

HPC is a different place to how it was before. It has always had an alternative view and people willing to dig deeper but some posters have gone off the deep end now. I don't know if they realise their decisions were all wrong and they've decided they just want to watch the world burn and will support anything that is anti-mainstream or if it's just part of the global swing towards anti-intellectualism. 

Take Boris the liar. No self respecting HPCer would have supported this buffoon 10-15 years ago. He would have been everything they despise, a rich, lying, corrupt toff, the embodiment of the establishment trying to make excuses for the failures. But somehow they've swung. He has now managed to convince these people that he is the solution to the problem and the problem is always outsiders, liberals, foreigners, pikininis, letter-boxes, etc. 

Ironically, the alt-right are the sheeple now, following blinding and barking when told to bark. They don't realise it yet but they will eventually.

Unfortunately this site does not seem to be what is commonly known as an "echo chamber", where endless posts on "the psychology of Brexiters" and "liar politicians" can be met by round after round of backslapping and re-enforcing comments, and anyone expressing any difference of opinion is hounded off the site (I think this is known as a "pile on").

In my view HPC has never really been an echo chamber for anything other than the subject of house prices, and people on here tend to have a very wide diversity of economic and political viewpoints from both the left and right. There is something of an anti-establishment feeling on here, but that is probably to be expected since not buying into the whole "I must buy a house at a ludicrous price" is a pretty anti establishment thing to do.

It's probably better to find one site that caters to anti establishment views, and another to establishment ones rather than to expect one site to cater for both if an echo chamber is what you are after.

[thehowler]

 

Logic doesn't work on them. 

It just doesn't. I know it seems nonsensical but that's because you come from a mindset where logic can be used to change your opinion. For many (perhaps even most) people this is completely overridden by emotions. Which is why arguments online are futile. 

We're living in a world where conspiracy theories are believed by millions. Antivax and flat earth are popular viewpoints. Our leaders are open liars. Science and fact are endless undermined.

We're post-truth and all that's left are emotive fairytales. Monkey brains in an AI world. 

The internet has been co-opted by tech greed to play to base instinct.

[msi]

 

The internet has been co-opted by tech greed to play to base instinct.

Tech Greed is based on click generation - using emotion to keep you going like a crack wh*re.

When you realise and counter this, it is refreshing.  Simply ignoring click bait and emotion baiting posters makes for a lively and challenging discourse with people that want to prove you wrong, not just shout soundbite cr*p about 'hidden forces'.

 

[PeanutButter]

 

Tech Greed is based on click generation - using emotion to keep you going like a crack wh*re.

When you realise and counter this, it is refreshing.  Simply ignoring click bait and emotion baiting posters makes for a lively and challenging discourse with people that want to prove you wrong, not just shout soundbite cr*p about 'hidden forces'.

 

Alas, I see people getting sucked in repeatedly. One day I hope the chat bots can become sophisticated enough to entertain the lunatics while the rest of us live in the real world. 

[Gigantic Purple Slug]

 

Alas, I see people getting sucked in repeatedly. One day I hope the chat bots can become sophisticated enough to entertain the lunatics while the rest of us live in the real world. 

Trust is an issue, but tolerance of other peoples opinions is another. Once everyone you don't agree with is a lunatic then you've already moved a long way  down the slope to polarisation.