Will Russia invade Ukraine and what happens if it escalates with NATO/US getting involved

[MonsieurCopperCrutch]

Despicable. 
 

 

[Lucky Larry]

4 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

There were no profits! The neocolonial misadventures in Iraq and Afghanistan left a $5 trillion hole in the ground, contemporaneously added to the US and UK national debts.

UK tag-a-longs are really only there to provide Washington with the fig-leaf of multilateralism.

Well it was about control of assets and installing puppet regimes to keep control and gain territory for military bases and all done by printing funny money . Of course it's a gamble and it backfired in Afghanistan in particular but their arrogance led them to believe they were invincible . I should have said potential gains rather than profits

[byron78]

3 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Of course we should be able to criticise Israel, and with many good reasons.

But what about the Rohingyas?

And the disappeared of Chile under Pinochet?

And the Yazidis of Iraq?

The shipping of millions of African slaves for a couple of centuries?

 

 

The other issue of course, is that he's largely spouting the narrative being pushed by a bloody dictator in Putin.

Irony free seemingly as well.

Oh dear...

[Lucky Larry]

2 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Of course we should be able to criticise Israel, and with many good reasons.

But what about the Rohingyas?

And the disappeared of Chile under Pinochet?

And the Yazidis of Iraq?

The shipping of millions of African slaves for a couple of centuries?

 

 

History is littered with such instances and our Govts cherry pick which ones to ignore or highlight and support , we live in a deeply unjust World and all cases of injustice should be challenged . The biggest culprit is the military industrial complex that backs and arms most of the dictatorships 

[Lucky Larry]

3 minutes ago, byron78 said:

The other issue of course, is that he's largely spouting the narrative being pushed by a bloody dictator in Putin.

Irony free seemingly as well.

Oh dear...

Didn't you vote for Putin's pal De Pfeffel ? and Pinochet's buddy Thatcher ? and you want to mention irony byron ? were you happy with her support of the apartheid regime in Sth Africa right up to the end?

[Casual-observer]

I see the daily mail are basically tip toeing around the edges and it's basically a message to the western upper echelons that absolutely nobody is buying the theory Russia blew up it's main bargaining chip. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11264547/Who-DID-blow-Nord-Stream-gas-pipelines-Russia-America.html

The comments don't buy it and nor do a lot of other people.

The US blew up the pipelines, no European politician will say this but it was an act of war against Germany/Europe.

NATO just confirmed it's status as an occupying force, you either follow the script or we will blow it all up.

I always wondered what it would be like to feel like an Iraqi, now we know

Edited September 30, 2022 by Casual-observer

[zugzwang]

10 minutes ago, Lucky Larry said:

Well it was about control of assets and installing puppet regimes to keep control and gain territory for military bases and all done by printing funny money . Of course it's a gamble and it backfired in Afghanistan in particular but their arrogance led them to believe they were invincible . I should have said potential gains rather than profits

People are incredulous when you tell them the US is the greatest debtor nation in the world. Its economy held upright by financial tributes from abroad via threat and coercion.

[jonb2]

1 minute ago, zugzwang said:

 

Europe is still using Russian oil if only by proxy through OPEC. 👇

It's up to the Germans to assert their financial independence or end up a vassal state for the rest of their days.

 

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/saudi-arabia-russian-oil-imports-double-discounted

Oil-rich Saudi Arabia doubles import of discounted Russian fuel

 

You and I know that the main cause of poverty is caused by access to energy. You can't progress without it. Even basic stuff like making food. Providing shelter. Not watching Netflix. All the good things of a modern society. The world is having this realisation thrust down its throat. But having an unreliable and unstable supplier is dangerous. If you have a dearth of it, at least you can plan around it.

Getting rid of one dodgy energy supplier at a time is better than all at once.

I've watched Bitterlake. I know it was a deal with the Devil, and very American. It's unfortunate so many of the world's resources are controlled by bad men. Including Texas oil men, and their puppets in Washington.

The Saudi connection has been and is disgusting. But they haven't declared an economic war on the West - yet.

Russia moved, they threw their chances in the bin and have done for decades. There was help by the greed in Wall Street for a while - but mainly, they have nobody to blame but themselves for their unfortunate destiny.

[Lucky Larry]

4 minutes ago, Casual-observer said:

I see the daily mail are basically tip toeing around the edges and it's basically a message to the western upper echelons that absolutely nobody is buying the theory Russia blew up it's main bargaining chip. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11264547/Who-DID-blow-Nord-Stream-gas-pipelines-Russia-America.html

The comments don't buy it and nor do a lot of other people.

The US blew up the pipelines, no European politician will say this but it was an act of war against Germany/Europe.

NATO just confirmed it's status as an occupying force, you either follow the script or we will blow it all up.

I always wondered what it would be like to feel like an Iraqi, now we know

It certainly looks that way 

[zugzwang]

4 minutes ago, Casual-observer said:

I always wondered what it would be like to feel like an Iraqi, now we know

+1

Yes.

[Lucky Larry]

Those claiming we would never deal with Putin again should see how we chose to deal with Gaddafi when it was in our interests to do so , that was before we stabbed him in the **** and destroyed his country of course. 

[zugzwang]

1 minute ago, jonb2 said:

You and I know that the main cause of poverty is caused by access to energy. You can't progress without it. Even basic stuff like making food. Providing shelter. Not watching Netflix. All the good things of a modern society. The world is having this realisation thrust down its throat. But having an unreliable and unstable supplier is dangerous. If you have a dearth of it, at least you can plan around it.

Getting rid of one dodgy energy supplier at a time is better than all at once.

I've watched Bitterlake. I know it was a deal with the Devil, and very American. It's unfortunate so many of the world's resources are controlled by bad men. Including Texas oil men, and their puppets in Washington.

The Saudi connection has been and is disgusting. But they haven't declared an economic war on the West - yet.

Russia moved, they threw their chances in the bin and have done for decades. There was help by the greed in Wall Street for a while - but mainly, they have nobody to blame but themselves for their unfortunate destiny.

The US has one political party with two right wings - Big Oil (Rep) and Big Money (Dem). Hard to say which is worse.

The Saudis did declare economic war in 1973. Kissinger flew straight to Riyahd and promised to bomb them back to the Stone Age if they didn't get back in line.

[Locke]

1 hour ago, Lucky Larry said:

like Iraq? well those with a moral compass take nothing to do with it and the others like the UK join in so they don't miss out on the profits

I meant, let's say the UK attacked Iraq and in retaliation, Iraq bombed London.

Does that invite other NATO members to attack Iraq?

[Lucky Larry]

10 minutes ago, Locke said:

I meant, let's say the UK attacked Iraq and in retaliation, Iraq bombed London.

Does that invite other NATO members to attack Iraq?

Yes , that's why accusing Russia of attacking the pipeline is very dangerous if they go on to claim it was an attack on German territory . It also shows just how stupid Putin would be to do this as it is an open invitation to NATO for all out confrontation with him . At the moment this is a regional war with a non NATO member and the majority of NATO nations would like to keep it that way . Those NIMBY nations furthest away from Ukraine are the ones banging the war drum the loudest

[nero120]

1 hour ago, Casual-observer said:

I see the daily mail are basically tip toeing around the edges and it's basically a message to the western upper echelons that absolutely nobody is buying the theory Russia blew up it's main bargaining chip. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11264547/Who-DID-blow-Nord-Stream-gas-pipelines-Russia-America.html

The comments don't buy it and nor do a lot of other people.

The US blew up the pipelines, no European politician will say this but it was an act of war against Germany/Europe.

NATO just confirmed it's status as an occupying force, you either follow the script or we will blow it all up.

I always wondered what it would be like to feel like an Iraqi, now we know

100% this. There will be huge blowback for the US for this, it was a stupid act of desperation.

[Lucky Larry]

Top rated comment from the Daily Mail article 

Everyone knows the USA did this. Other "leaders" went along with it. I wish they would stop thinking we are all so stupid.

2140 agree 267 disagree

This is from the right wing Daily Mail readers ? I think that gives a perspective to  our resident neo cons on here . You may shout the loudest but empty vessels tend to make the most noise .  PS even Daily Mail readers think you're stupid 😂

[Si1]

1 hour ago, Casual-observer said:

I see the daily mail are basically tip toeing around the edges and it's basically a message to the western upper echelons that absolutely nobody is buying the theory Russia blew up it's main bargaining chip. 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11264547/Who-DID-blow-Nord-Stream-gas-pipelines-Russia-America.html

The comments don't buy it and nor do a lot of other people.

The US blew up the pipelines, no European politician will say this but it was an act of war against Germany/Europe.

NATO just confirmed it's status as an occupying force, you either follow the script or we will blow it all up.

I always wondered what it would be like to feel like an Iraqi, now we know

This is embarrassing for you.

The Daily mail and its comments section. Yeah right.

Russia did it.

[Lucky Larry]

3 minutes ago, Si1 said:

This is embarrassing for you.

The Daily mail and its comments section. Yeah right.

Russia did it.

looks like you are in a very small minority even amongst your fellow right wing fruitloops

[IMHAL]

4 minutes ago, Lucky Larry said:

looks like you are in a very small minority even amongst your fellow right wing fruitloops

You are very keen on believing the Kremlin line..no questions asked.

What bit of the Russian line don't you believe? 😙

[Grayphil]

26 minutes ago, Si1 said:

This is embarrassing for you.

The Daily mail and its comments section. Yeah right.

Russia did it.

It's impossible to say right now who did it, however the Pro Putin crowd are desperate to have already come to the conclusion that is was the US.

They are trying to make it sound like a fact already.

But its interesting they arent condemning the Russians shelling a humanitarian corridor, or noticing that Russians are again taking a pasting, just salivating that maybe by 3pm today Putin will whip the tactical nukes out.

Which will be justified in their minds cos "America blew up the pipeline"

[Grayphil]

19 minutes ago, IMHAL said:

You are very keen on believing the Kremlin line..no questions asked.

What bit of the Russian line don't you believe? 😙

Remember Lucky Larry is very balanced.

[Lucky Larry]

20 minutes ago, IMHAL said:

You are very keen on believing the Kremlin line..no questions asked.

What bit of the Russian line don't you believe? 😙

I don't listen to the Kremlin line ,I have no idea what he says I look at evidence and listen to my common sense.

Do you really think Putin would destroy his own infrastructure , destroy his bargaining chip and potentially escalate this war from a regional war with a non NATO neighbour to all out war with NATO just to rally public opinion at home ? 

There is nothing in this for Putin , the pros massively outweighed by the cons . Doubling down on your stupidity just makes you look twice as stupid as you did yesterday and that was very stupid

[Lucky Larry]

10 minutes ago, Grayphil said:

It's impossible to say right now who did it, however the Pro Putin crowd are desperate to have already come to the conclusion that is was the US.

When you label the Daily Mail as pro Putin to try and win an arguement you've completely lost the plot

They are literally the Tory Party Fanzine

Edited September 30, 2022 by Lucky Larry

[IMHAL]

9 minutes ago, Grayphil said:

Remember Lucky Larry is very balanced.

Oh yeh.....I keep forgetting

 

[coypondboy]

The next stage approaches as I predicted last month, the big question is will Putin use tactical nuclear weapons in the coming weeks, the battle around Izyum where Russian forces about to be cut off will be an interesting one.