HovelinHove Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, jonb2 said: Over 55% of our trade is to and through the EU. The problem you have is assuming you are governed by competent people that could negotiate new trade deals. Again, the truth is we aren't. Not a chance of anything good for the country coming from Westminster. Surely last night's rubbish was glaring proof of this? Non-EU immigration is going up. Laws like the snooper's charter? Yup we need more of that. Brexit is not for the people. It's for JRM and Co. I hate Westminster just as much as you, but at least we do have the opportunity, if we get our stuff together, to change things. Brexit showed that. We voted for something they didn't want, and if they now don’t deliver then there will be serious unrest in this country. That aside, there is no possibility of our being able to remove Junker or Verhoffstat et al. Our voice in the EU Parliament is small and fractured...the more power that goes to the EU ruling bodies, the less power we have, and the less our vote means. That is what Brexit was about. That is why more than ever I ant out, even if it means I earn less, and have less opportunities...that is just Bread and Circuses, I value freedom and democracy mor than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 44 minutes ago, crouch said: You imply this is a one way process: it isn't. Treaties are entered into because of mutual self interest; you give with one hand and take with another. No, is was refuting the claim that it is unconstitutionsl for the UK to give power to a foreign entity. We do it all the time on the basis that we get something in return. In the case of the EU in return for sharing some powers we got the backing of a 500m strong block for the 95% of cases where the EU votrd to back our position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itssimple Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Irish spat soon? https://www.euractiv.com/section/economy-jobs/news/eu-wants-end-to-member-state-veto-on-tax/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurlerontheditch Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 15 minutes ago, HovelinHove said: The 5th largest economy in world. I think not. I lived in Canada, a much smaller economy than the UK, and they entered trade deals and won much of what they wanted. If they didn’t get what they wanted, they would walk away. The EU has no clout because it can’t agree on anything because French Farmers and German auto makers ill always disagree and dominate. yes of course the UK can get what it wants with small economies, like when May went dancing in Africa. however the US, China and the have way more clout. and the UK economy may well get smaller if a hard brexit occurs. the EU has loads of clout! hence why the US wants the UK to not be aligned with EU standards Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 19 minutes ago, localhero1983 said: I have no issues personally with so many of the Eastern Europeans over in the UK, it was the best move this country made immigration wise in a century along with the influx of more Jews. Sadly Joe Bloggs living in Hitchin or Wisbech just will not see it that way, it's the only channel they have had to express themselves in decades even though they are totally screaming at the moon when it comes to Immigration Yes a protest vote......what makes anyone think the man on the street will have any more power over anything by exiting.......there are millions who were born here that now work and live in Europe, freedom to move safely over a large continent, Brexit can see that only the wealthy and or educated do so in the future...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cock-eyed octopus Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Steve Baker interesting on Sky News just now. He reckons we had a deal ready to be signed off but May & Ollie Robbins scuppered it. He's got a document: https://globalbritain.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/A-Better-Deal-and-a-Better-Future.pdf I'm going to have a bash at reading it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 33 minutes ago, localhero1983 said: I don't belong to any RW party Hairy, and I was only using RW in the way you would use the words in your sterotypical facist way where everyone who dislikes more immigration is racist, are you about to do it yet again with me?... I probably missed that post as I usually just treat your posts with contempt and ignore most of them The only political party I have ever been involved with is in my very younger days and around John Smith's era Hairy You should join one if you believe in RW values... be honest with yourself. I don't recall saying anything to that effect about your current alterego....... CopperCrutch got a good and well deserved dose tho.... I'll be gentle on your new persona.....pwomise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrizzlyDave Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Confusion of VIs said: Why do uou think the financial and betting markets don't believe that. Is the above a secret that only you are aware of. The reality is with well over 400 MPs publically against no deal it is unlokely to happen. The existing legistlation allows for the date to be pushed back by a simple amendment. The only risk is that the EU does not allow the A50 to be extended, this seems unlikely but possible they will lose patience if we want to push the date back just to carry on arguing with ourselves. All I can do is share my thoughts and views as to why. Revoking A50 - needs a reason, just killing brexit dead would cause huge damage between parliment and the people. Delaying leave date - again needs a reason. Extra time to reach a concensus is not good enough. Better to reach a concensus with the pressure of a ticking clock. Let’s assume a Norway concensus can be reached; that would be sufficient for a delay. The WA is dead, so a big alternative is needed. Second referendum - would be good grounds to delay leaving. But what are the choices - Remain/WA? I don’t think so (Parliment won’t vote it through) Remain/WTO? I don’t think so (Parliment won’t vote it through). Remain/Norway? Probably the only credible choice that could be generated by Parliment in order to put it to the people. VoNC - I think may will survive, so unless an alternative brexit option can be agreed in the house and thbn porententially put to the people we leave by default. Edited January 16, 2019 by GrizzlyDave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurlerontheditch Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, Itssimple said: Irish spat soon? https://www.euractiv.com/section/economy-jobs/news/eu-wants-end-to-member-state-veto-on-tax/ the Irish will push back, but the Irish also know that the EU has been very good for them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aheadofthecurve Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Hullabaloo82 said: Yes true. We don't pay the £39bn all in one go if we stay but we will still pay it over x years. The divorce settlement was for this reason; to recognise money the UK was already committed to spending. If we stay it just gets paid as part of our normal expenditure in line with the projects it relates to rather than in a lump sum. Nope. We don't have to pay it. There is no obligation. What are the EU gonna do? Take us to the Hague? Okay they might try to do that but that is the only way they can force us. Even then it's not guaranteed. If they could just take it they would have done already. They don't fool me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 10 hours ago, GrizzlyDave said: [ ] remain a member of the EU [ ] leave the EU with an ‘X’ future relationship* * n.b. Parliment will ignore you if you choose this option because you are a thick racist xenophobic bigot. How could anyone get the idea that someone is thick just because they voted for an...... 'X'....is beyond me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonb2 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 5 minutes ago, hurlerontheditch said: yes of course the UK can get what it wants with small economies, like when May went dancing in Africa. however the US, China and the have way more clout. and the UK economy may well get smaller if a hard brexit occurs. the EU has loads of clout! hence why the US wants the UK to not be aligned with EU standards Yes, rarely does a country get to feck another twice. The USA has had its greedy eye on the UK since they fecked us after WW2. Those that think America is a benign "special relationship" friend need to wake up and smell the coffee (Starbucks of course). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
localhero1983 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, IMHAL said: You should join one if you believe in RW values... be honest with yourself. I don't recall saying anything to that effect about your current alterego....... CopperCrutch got a good and well deserved dose tho.... I'll be gentle on your new persona.....pwomise. Hey Hairy, don't turn on me for catching you out, a handful of posters informed me who you are ? And you do write in that exact style with the gammon name calling etc and abusing everyone who does not follow your childish mantra, along with all white men are racist attitude, try and lose that chip and maybe you will not be detected so easily. Anyway I am just off to some daily Right wing activity, no time for the wicked, throw a few single mothers onto the street, a few lynchings and then black up with a few friends and watch Love thy neighbour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurlerontheditch Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, jonb2 said: Yes, rarely does a country get to feck another twice. The USA has had its greedy eye on the UK since they fecked us after WW2. Those that think America is a benign "special relationship" friend need to wake up and smell the coffee (Starbucks of course). exactly ken Clarke hit the nail on the head yesterday Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, aheadofthecurve said: Nope. We don't have to pay it. There is no obligation. What are the EU gonna do? Take us to the Hague? Okay they might try to do that but that is the only way they can force us. Even then it's not guaranteed. If they could just take it they would have done already. They don't fool me. We have acknowledged our obligation. If we default no one will trade with us. Your puppet masters must have you on overtime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
localhero1983 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, jonb2 said: Yes, rarely does a country get to feck another twice. The USA has had its greedy eye on the UK since they fecked us after WW2. Those that think America is a benign "special relationship" friend need to wake up and smell the coffee (Starbucks of course). Goodness sake, what a dark untrusting depressing world you live in. OK, the USA is not perfect, but I would much prefer them as allies than many of the other dark corners on this planet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMHAL Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, localhero1983 said: Hey Hairy, don't turn on me for catching you out, a handful of posters informed me who you are ? And you do write in that exact style with the gammon name calling etc and abusing everyone who does not follow your childish mantra, along with all white men are racist attitude, try and lose that chip and maybe you will not be detected so easily. Anyway I am just off to some daily Right wing activity, no time for the wicked, throw a few single mothers onto the street, a few lynchings and then black up with a few friends and watch Love thy neighbour. For a poster who joined in late 2018 - you seem to know quite a bit about Hairy....he is legend I will admit....and I liked him a lot. I, unlike him have never used the term 'gammon' so your research is off. But, like him, I am blessed with being able to detect a RW subversive from a mile off... You being one of CopperCrutch's minions makes sense tho. You are too slow witted to be CC. Edited January 16, 2019 by IMHAL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, localhero1983 said: TM's deal is now totally finished with, that was made clear last night. It is looking like the only way out of this now is Referendum 2 with just two choices 1. Remain 2. Hard Brexit What does hard Brexit actually mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, hurlerontheditch said: exactly ken Clarke hit the nail on the head yesterday Shocking......that will not help with growing obesity and all the problems attach to it, and promoting living a long healthy life we strive for, lowering our food standards to enable us to import cheap food from the RoW.......who will be the people that end up eating that? Not those that can afford not to.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 25 minutes ago, ****-eyed octopus said: Steve Baker interesting on Sky News just now. He reckons we had a deal ready to be signed off but May & Ollie Robbins scuppered it. He's got a document: https://globalbritain.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/A-Better-Deal-and-a-Better-Future.pdf I'm going to have a bash at reading it. I wouldn't bother, it's simplistic, fanciful drivel. Although, I suppose you could amuse yourself by counting the unicorns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 23 minutes ago, hurlerontheditch said: the Irish will push back, but the Irish also know that the EU has been very good for them Maybe, the Irish could do very well out of this. Getting more tax from firms that are already based there, and no incentive for those firms to relocate in search of a lower tax EU state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
localhero1983 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, IMHAL said: I am blessed with being able to detect a RW subversive from a mile off... Those super powers again ?? You remind of the witch finder general, he had about the same accuracy as you as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, jonb2 said: Have you only just realised this? It's been this way for the last 40 years. What, since we joined the EU? That makes sense. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
localhero1983 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said: What does hard Brexit actually mean. Do you know what, that's a good question and yet again proves with enough pounding out constant subliminal messages will eventually become normal volcabulary. Hard Brexit probably just means leaving the EU, nothing more nothing less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confusion of VIs Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 28 minutes ago, aheadofthecurve said: Nope. We don't have to pay it. There is no obligation. What are the EU gonna do? Take us to the Hague? Okay they might try to do that but that is the only way they can force us. Even then it's not guaranteed. If they could just take it they would have done already. They don't fool me. Still trolling? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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