Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

[dances with sheeple]

2 hours ago, IMHAL said:

Talked to a conservative in a position of 'some' power today. The feeling amongst the rank and file is that Brexit was an unfortunate mistake....a Cameron gamble the backfired. The rank and file fully expect it to fail and the government with it. It's just a waiting game. 

Who cares. Brexit is yesterdays chip paper. People have moved on to a far more heightened state of unease and fear.

[14stFlyer]

17 hours ago, dugsbody said:

17 hours ago, dryrot said:

I should'nt bother, really.

A GE winner is the party with the majority of seats/votes,. (Do you disagree?)

It is almost never an absolute majority of votes cast, tho. No election has been won by a party receiving an absolute majority of voters for yonks. 

(If you want an absolute majority, there was always the 2016 Brexit referendum...  )

I completely agree, our political system is based on seats. And that means that a majority of voters might vote for something but get something else.

Which appears to be what you're saying here. The majority of people voted for non brexit parties (your own admission) but because of how our political system works, they got a brexit party.

 

Agree with dugs on this one.  In my constituency there was just one Brexit Candidate vs 4 Serious Remain candidates. It is perhaps not surprising that the Brexit candidate won. 
 

But this is spilled milk that has gone off, congealed, gone mouldy, and been picked up on the bottom of a sock by now. Let’s move on shall we?

[Bruce Banner]

And so it continues....

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/norway-recalls-new-rules-of-stay-for-british-citizens-after-transition-period/

Norway’s government is urging the public and business community to prepare for the changes that will be applied when the UK’s transitional period comes to an end.

Norway’s government statement has reemphasized that from January 1, 2021, all UK citizens in Norway will be considered third-country nationals, SchengenVisaInfo.com reports.

 

[winkie]

Thousands of British passport holders who are resident in Europe for whatever reason are rushing to get the correct paperwork in place this year so as not to lose all the benefits they enjoy.

[Mikhail Liebenstein]

7 hours ago, dances with sheeple said:

Who cares. Brexit is yesterdays chip paper. People have moved on to a far more heightened state of unease and fear.

No, Brexit is a multiplier of negative outcomes. It remains news, and article 49 will be next on the agenda. I am already stashing Euros ahead of the UK’s almost certain re-entry.

[Mikhail Liebenstein]

1 hour ago, 14stFlyer said:

Agree with dugs on this one.  In my constituency there was just one Brexit Candidate vs 4 Serious Remain candidates. It is perhaps not surprising that the Brexit candidate won. 
 

But this is spilled milk that has gone off, congealed, gone mouldy, and been picked up on the bottom of a sock by now. Let’s move on shall we?

Nope, article 49 is next on the agenda.

Brexit has failed already - the average Brit is now much poorer.

[MonsieurCopperCrutch]

2 hours ago, 14stFlyer said:

Agree with dugs on this one.  In my constituency there was just one Brexit Candidate vs 4 Serious Remain candidates. It is perhaps not surprising that the Brexit candidate won. 
 

But this is spilled milk that has gone off, congealed, gone mouldy, and been picked up on the bottom of a sock by now. Let’s move on shall we?

Why so desperate to close down proper debate and scrutiny when the Brexshit lies are now coming home to roost? 

[dugsbody]

3 hours ago, 14stFlyer said:

Agree with dugs on this one.  In my constituency there was just one Brexit Candidate vs 4 Serious Remain candidates. It is perhaps not surprising that the Brexit candidate won. 
 

But this is spilled milk that has gone off, congealed, gone mouldy, and been picked up on the bottom of a sock by now. Let’s move on shall we?

I'm happy to move on with brexit. It is done and dusted and I'm prepared for it anyway.

But I'm not going to ignore falsehoods, which the brexiter side continue to spread, despite having already achieved their aims.

[dugsbody]

2 hours ago, winkie said:

Thousands of British passport holders who are resident in Europe for whatever reason are rushing to get the correct paperwork in place this year so as not to lose all the benefits they enjoy.

I don't blame them. It doesn't sit well with me that many of these people want to continue to retain the benefits they enjoy but voted to cut these off for future generations. Seems very selfish.

[winkie]

7 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

I don't blame them. It doesn't sit well with me that many of these people want to continue to retain the benefits they enjoy but voted to cut these off for future generations. Seems very selfish.

Will have to wait and see.... democracy, nothing stays the same forever, forever changing and evolving.

[crouch]

10 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

I don't blame them. It doesn't sit well with me that many of these people want to continue to retain the benefits they enjoy but voted to cut these off for future generations. Seems very selfish.

How can it be selfish when they believe that the benefits of leaving will extend to future generations? Like all Remainers you simply assume the decision to leave was wrong and there can be no future benefits; Leavers thought there would benefits so these would accrue to future generations. 

[dugsbody]

10 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

This has got to be the all time ultimate p!ss take.

Chris Grayling closes in on role as chair of UK intelligence committee

 

Shoving brexiters into every position. What is the political term for this sort of take-over?

[dugsbody]

3 minutes ago, crouch said:

How can it be selfish when they believe that the benefits of leaving will extend to future generations? Like all Remainers you simply assume the decision to leave was wrong and there can be no future benefits; Leavers thought there would benefits so these would accrue to future generations. 

Ok, but those benefits come with costs, such as loss of EU rights, that these people are now trying to keep, while denying future generations.

But also, they didn't believe there would be benefits, because they still can't name them.

[crouch]

10 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

Ok, but those benefits come with costs, such as loss of EU rights, that these people are now trying to keep, while denying future generations.

There are pros and cons; there always are. You assume the cons outweigh the pros.

10 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

But also, they didn't believe there would be benefits, because they still can't name them.

Weak argument and in your opinion.

Edited July 10, 2020 by crouch

[winkie]

8 minutes ago, dugsbody said:

Ok, but those benefits come with costs, such as loss of EU rights, that these people are now trying to keep, while denying future generations.

But also, they didn't believe there would be benefits, because they still can't name them.

The benefits sold was more power and control....will see how many will feel they have greater power and more control over their lives.....try before you buy.

 

 

[winkie]

Only a few months to go to get full green card and equality, free health for retired and treated as an equal no matter how wealthy you are, the same of those born and bred....

[pig]

A bit more Brexity nepotism.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/jul/10/firm-with-links-to-gove-and-cummings-given-covid-19-contract-without-open-tender

Quote

“It beggars belief that the government’s desperate defence of handing a contract for daily focus groups on Covid-19 to longstanding friends of ministers is coincidence, and to blame clerical incompetence for the reference to the work on Brexit. They should come clean about the purpose of this project, why this company was chosen without it going to tender and publish the research findings and recommendations for people to see for themselves.”

 

[Bob8]

15 hours ago, IMHAL said:

Talked to a conservative in a position of 'some' power today. The feeling amongst the rank and file is that Brexit was an unfortunate mistake....a Cameron gamble the backfired. The rank and file fully expect it to fail and the government with it. It's just a waiting game. 

May I ask who you are referring to by the rank and file? It seem most members of the Conservative party are still fully behind it.

[Bob8]

17 hours ago, MonsieurCopperCrutch said:

After years of debate about all the pros and cons of leaving the EU these leave voters would have been in full mental capacity and knowledge about what they were voting for. We can no longer pander to their whimsical wishes nor mollycoddle them. They now have to sink or swim under the full knowledge that they, and only they, have to finally man-up and take full responisbility for their own decisions and actions. All I see in that photo are some farmers who have accidentally taken the wrong turning out of their fields and ended up in the heart of London.

#theyknewwhattheywerevotingfor

Once people lose faith in experts and group think, they will rely on thinking for themselves. At this point, the complicated reasons that are not understood will not be believed to exist.

At that point, the problems must be outside bad faith actors and corrupt brainwashed insiders. To take responsibility themselves would therefore be wrong.

Nonsense, of course, but not taking responsibility is a core plank of the approach it seems.

[IMHAL]

9 minutes ago, Bob8 said:

May I ask who you are referring to by the rank and file? It seem most members of the Conservative party are still fully behind it.

The councillors at the grass roots. Of course they see support for Brexit as a way of keepiing power in this climate, the alternative of rejecting the 'project' would be seen as political suicide. However, even this chappy think it will not be long before the tide turns against BJ.

[Bob8]

1 hour ago, IMHAL said:

The councillors at the grass roots. Of course they see support for Brexit as a way of keepiing power in this climate, the alternative of rejecting the 'project' would be seen as political suicide. However, even this chappy think it will not be long before the tide turns against BJ.

I struggle to see a major backlash against him, but that is just me guessing! Not taking responsibility and blaming others of part of the narrative of brexit, so it not working will not undermine it as we might expect.

Thanks, it is interesting to have your insight as I lack that completely

[dugsbody]

2 hours ago, pig said:

“It beggars belief that the government’s desperate defence of handing a contract for daily focus groups on Covid-19 to longstanding friends of ministers is coincidence, and to blame clerical incompetence for the reference to the work on Brexit. They should come clean about the purpose of this project, why this company was chosen without it going to tender and publish the research findings and recommendations for people to see for themselves.”

You would think that because these people (the MPs) are public servants, the work for us, they would listen to us when we ask them to publish details of why they decided to spend our money with their mates' firms. 

But they won't of course.

[pig]

1 hour ago, IMHAL said:

The councillors at the grass roots. Of course they see support for Brexit as a way of keepiing power in this climate, the alternative of rejecting the 'project' would be seen as political suicide. However, even this chappy think it will not be long before the tide turns against BJ.

My understanding is that there is a bit of a split.
The more  ‘traditional’ conservatives have been appalled at what has gone on or been hit by its consequences  Then there are those who are more beholden to SM who will quite happily trot out a somewhat hackneyed defence eg what about Corbyn, it’s the ‘far’ left moaning etc

[Brett]

3 hours ago, Bob8 said:

I struggle to see a major backlash against him, but that is just me guessing! Not taking responsibility and blaming others of part of the narrative of brexit, so it not working will not undermine it as we might expect.

Thanks, it is interesting to have your insight as I lack that completely

Narrative? There is no narrative. Most voters wanted Brexit and they still do. You come across as mentally ill. Using words like 'narrative' doesn't make you sound more intelligent, either. Try harder.

[Dorkins]

Croatia and Bulgaria join ERM II, one of the preconditions of joining the euro:

https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/ip_20_1321