Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 On 12/03/2024 at 19:51, DarkHorseWaits-NoMore said: Anyone who has danced through the private vet care or pissed about with insurance cover claims, will know what an expensive scam it can be, especially if long term care intervention is required. After experiencing, who the hell would want an insurance based national healthcare system for adults, other than the small minded, selfish and those hosting a nasty personality disorder. How do you reconcile this line of thinking with the fact that the same drugs and treatments/investigations are a fraction of the price for animals than they are for people? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 On 13/03/2024 at 08:38, cbathpc said: Yes, friend has spent over £10k on cancer operations for his dog, and is now presented with a few different options for monthly treatment, all at a cost of over £250+ pcm. Even 10 years ago, the dog would have been put down the second you said £10k for a surgery. I'm not sure its ethical for vets to offer these services tbh Lmao how many dogs could you buy for £10k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 On 14/03/2024 at 15:56, winkie said: Yes, unless young and in pain. May I suggest an alternative treatment plan https://www.screwfix.com/p/magnusson-fibreglass-ball-pein-hammer-16oz-0-45kg-/2630v Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 On 17/03/2024 at 00:43, debtlessmanc said: The U.K. national health system needs less administrators and strict checks on who can access it in I feel. Well that's kind of a dilemma, because the checks would have to be implemented and maintained by...administrators. So there is a significant cost right there. Plus the cost of someone becoming preventably ill or dying is actually quite high to society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 20 hours ago, desiringonlychild said: But can't run from the vet bills. That depends how hard-nosed you are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desiringonlychild Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 41 minutes ago, Locke said: May I suggest an alternative treatment plan https://www.screwfix.com/p/magnusson-fibreglass-ball-pein-hammer-16oz-0-45kg-/2630 The pet can be humanely put to sleep but other interventions that people in the past would be regarded as animal cruelty. Brits are known for their love of animals, and they regard their pets as members of their family Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 (edited) 46 minutes ago, Locke said: Well that's kind of a dilemma, because the checks would have to be implemented and maintained by...administrators. So there is a significant cost right there. Plus the cost of someone becoming preventably ill or dying is actually quite high to society. When we were in the EU every single other EU state billed us for treating our citizens. We never billed anyone. All it needs is an NHS or ID card. It’s not complicated. the problem is the staff believe it should be free and “someone else “ should pay. when the same public sector types run a university and their jobs are on the line - it’s pay up front or else Edited March 18 by debtlessmanc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 38 minutes ago, Locke said: That depends how hard-nosed you are. You have not got kids have you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 12 minutes ago, debtlessmanc said: You have not got kids have you? Depending but kids need to learn about death, about something ending and new life begining... Nature is wonderful how it deals with things, better than man. There is no success without failure, and no failure without success......no beginning without end, and no end without a beginning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeanutButter Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 Vets Childcare Care homes Elderly care Dentists half the NHS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 2 hours ago, debtlessmanc said: You have not got kids have you? Two, actually. No pets yet, so I take the point that there can be intense infant pressure to save beloved Moggy. Unfortunately, death is part of life and we all have to learn to accept that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 2 hours ago, debtlessmanc said: the problem is the staff believe it should be free and “someone else “ should pay. Yes, the problem is the weird general attitude of the British public that provision of healthcare is a fundamental human right. We're rapidly running into the problem that implementing that want is ruinous. 2 hours ago, debtlessmanc said: When we were in the EU every single other EU state billed us for treating our citizens. We never billed anyone. All it needs is an NHS or ID card. It’s not complicated. Famous last words. I wonder how much of the billed value actually covered the treatment. I'd be surprised if more than 10% went towards the actual cost of treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 20 minutes ago, Locke said: Yes, the problem is the weird general attitude of the British public that provision of healthcare is a fundamental human right. We're rapidly running into the problem that implementing that want is ruinous. Famous last words. I wonder how much of the billed value actually covered the treatment. I'd be surprised if more than 10% went towards the actual cost of treatment. The best systems seem to be continental ones were some element of insurance is required. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkD Posted March 18 Author Share Posted March 18 2 hours ago, PeanutButter said: Vets Childcare Care homes Elderly care Dentists half the NHS Funeral homes? I.e. cradle to grave! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lagarde's Drift Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_from_Accounts This is rather funny and yes they spend several k Oz to give a disabled dog a wheelchair thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandalorian Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 On 3/16/2024 at 11:05 PM, DarkHorseWaits-NoMore said: It did until the NHS was systematically sabotaged, intentionally forced dysfunction by political choice (dogma) and undermined with private sector parasites in an imposed false market.* * citation needed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morty Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 If it were state funded the fat cats would still be making millions, like they probably do with NHS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHorseWaits-NoMore Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 4 hours ago, Mandalorian said: * citation needed Five political decisions that drove the NHS to the brink https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/nhs-crisis-rishi-sunak-conservative-labour-austerity-privatisation/ How the Tory party has systematically run down the NHS The report by the Commons public accounts committee (UK health department played ‘fast and loose’ when awarding Covid contracts to Randox, 27 July) shows how the NHS is let down by this government. The health service has been underfunded since its inception except for the brief period in the first decade of this century when Labour increased funding. Money is an important factor in the NHS crisis, but it is not the only factor. The lack of a workforce plan and the backlog of maintenance, lack of basic diagnostic machines, too few beds, insufficient pay and the completely unnecessary attack on doctors’ pensions all contribute. Liz Truss’s desire to reduce the number of managers, when the NHS spends far less on management than comparable countries and private industry, is illogical. The basic problem is that the Conservative party does not believe in the NHS but dares not say so. By underinvesting, making the jobs unrewarding and creating waiting lists, it hopes to encourage the public to turn to the private sector. The scandalous waste of money during the pandemic, and the party’s insistence on using the private sector for the failed test-and-trace system, which cost £37bn, when the NHS could have done a better job for much less money, is indicative of its ideological approach. There is nothing to choose between the leadership contenders. We must insist that ministers are held to account, that the government puts in the money that the NHS needs, and that it appoints ministers who believe in the service and who can plan for the future, rather than spouting platitudes. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/aug/03/how-the-tory-party-has-systematically-run-down-the-nhs The Tories fear and loathe the NHS, but they know they have gone too far this time https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/oct/11/tories-fear-loathe-nhs-workers-strike https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/nhs-government-jeremy-hunt-labour-steve-barclay-b2224075.html The NHS Is Slowly Dying of Privatization https://jacobin.com/2023/03/uk-nhs-privatization-austerity-wages-deaths-health-care-demonstration Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 4 minutes ago, DarkHorseWaits-NoMore said: Five political decisions that drove the NHS to the brink https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/nhs-crisis-rishi-sunak-conservative-labour-austerity-privatisation/ How the Tory party has systematically run down the NHS The report by the Commons public accounts committee (UK health department played ‘fast and loose’ when awarding Covid contracts to Randox, 27 July) shows how the NHS is let down by this government. The health service has been underfunded since its inception except for the brief period in the first decade of this century when Labour increased funding. Money is an important factor in the NHS crisis, but it is not the only factor. The lack of a workforce plan and the backlog of maintenance, lack of basic diagnostic machines, too few beds, insufficient pay and the completely unnecessary attack on doctors’ pensions all contribute. Liz Truss’s desire to reduce the number of managers, when the NHS spends far less on management than comparable countries and private industry, is illogical. The basic problem is that the Conservative party does not believe in the NHS but dares not say so. By underinvesting, making the jobs unrewarding and creating waiting lists, it hopes to encourage the public to turn to the private sector. The scandalous waste of money during the pandemic, and the party’s insistence on using the private sector for the failed test-and-trace system, which cost £37bn, when the NHS could have done a better job for much less money, is indicative of its ideological approach. There is nothing to choose between the leadership contenders. We must insist that ministers are held to account, that the government puts in the money that the NHS needs, and that it appoints ministers who believe in the service and who can plan for the future, rather than spouting platitudes. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/aug/03/how-the-tory-party-has-systematically-run-down-the-nhs The Tories fear and loathe the NHS, but they know they have gone too far this time https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/oct/11/tories-fear-loathe-nhs-workers-strike https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/nhs-government-jeremy-hunt-labour-steve-barclay-b2224075.html The NHS Is Slowly Dying of Privatization https://jacobin.com/2023/03/uk-nhs-privatization-austerity-wages-deaths-health-care-demonstration daughter wanted to be nurse- applied for work experience in NHS. “Sorry sorry no we don’t do that.” wife at time was working part time in NHS book keeping. “My step daughter wants to do work experience” ”oh family - no problem apply through the website, she can do it” “ but she has been told she cannot do itl” “That’s to put others off, enter me as a contact and she will get work experience” that is corruption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onlooker Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 10 hours ago, debtlessmanc said: daughter wanted to be nurse- applied for work experience in NHS. “Sorry sorry no we don’t do that.” wife at time was working part time in NHS book keeping. “My step daughter wants to do work experience” ”oh family - no problem apply through the website, she can do it” “ but she has been told she cannot do itl” “That’s to put others off, enter me as a contact and she will get work experience” that is corruption. Nepotism rather than corruption. But I agree, both are rife in the public sector. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Cash Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 14 hours ago, debtlessmanc said: daughter wanted to be nurse- applied for work experience in NHS. “Sorry sorry no we don’t do that.” wife at time was working part time in NHS book keeping. “My step daughter wants to do work experience” ”oh family - no problem apply through the website, she can do it” “ but she has been told she cannot do itl” “That’s to put others off, enter me as a contact and she will get work experience” that is corruption. Maybe they’d be inundated with requests and this is just a simple to operate filter. Most people must know someone working in the NHS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandalorian Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 16 hours ago, DarkHorseWaits-NoMore said: Five political decisions that drove the NHS to the brink https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/nhs-crisis-rishi-sunak-conservative-labour-austerity-privatisation/ How the Tory party has systematically run down the NHS The report by the Commons public accounts committee (UK health department played ‘fast and loose’ when awarding Covid contracts to Randox, 27 July) shows how the NHS is let down by this government. The health service has been underfunded since its inception except for the brief period in the first decade of this century when Labour increased funding. Money is an important factor in the NHS crisis, but it is not the only factor. The lack of a workforce plan and the backlog of maintenance, lack of basic diagnostic machines, too few beds, insufficient pay and the completely unnecessary attack on doctors’ pensions all contribute. Liz Truss’s desire to reduce the number of managers, when the NHS spends far less on management than comparable countries and private industry, is illogical. The basic problem is that the Conservative party does not believe in the NHS but dares not say so. By underinvesting, making the jobs unrewarding and creating waiting lists, it hopes to encourage the public to turn to the private sector. The scandalous waste of money during the pandemic, and the party’s insistence on using the private sector for the failed test-and-trace system, which cost £37bn, when the NHS could have done a better job for much less money, is indicative of its ideological approach. There is nothing to choose between the leadership contenders. We must insist that ministers are held to account, that the government puts in the money that the NHS needs, and that it appoints ministers who believe in the service and who can plan for the future, rather than spouting platitudes. https://www.theguardian.com/society/2022/aug/03/how-the-tory-party-has-systematically-run-down-the-nhs The Tories fear and loathe the NHS, but they know they have gone too far this time https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/oct/11/tories-fear-loathe-nhs-workers-strike https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/nhs-government-jeremy-hunt-labour-steve-barclay-b2224075.html The NHS Is Slowly Dying of Privatization https://jacobin.com/2023/03/uk-nhs-privatization-austerity-wages-deaths-health-care-demonstration Now find one from a non-hysterical, independent source. 'Open Democracy', The Grauniad/Independent etc are all left wing/anti Tory foaming at the mouth with outrage organisations Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHorseWaits-NoMore Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Behave, more likely that the bought n paid for right wing media are not interested to educate their readers about such facts. Where have you been living? Open you eyes, the country is a phuckin mess because of our faux democratic system, shielded from uncomfortable truths by the largely complicit propagandised dumbed down media. Next, in the same breath, you'll be crying that you are a patriot for England and (most) of it's fine subjects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHorseWaits-NoMore Posted April 6 Share Posted April 6 (edited) I just got fleeced £120 this week for some flea drops, a weigh-in and some very basic diagnostics of a (9 year old normally healthy) cat with a minor 3 week cough, that recommended next steps a £600-£900 X-ray and taking lung fluid samples under anesthetic, not to mention extra fees for any follow up after care or repeat prescriptions. I waited in reception 5x longer than the 5 minute examination. No joke! When I get a cough, it's a £7 cough mixture over the counter or maybe a course of antibiotics for secondary bronchitis infection. Wow, now I may not be the sharpest knife in the draw but trying to understand the US insurance based healthcare for humans is a crazy mine field for comprehensive coverage. Good luck claiming for something serious requiring open ended treatments. Who the hell would want to inflict this on their country at 3x the cost of the NHS (even in it's sabotaged crippled state)? Edited April 6 by DarkHorseWaits-NoMore typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dweller Posted April 6 Share Posted April 6 https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2024/apr/06/vet-who-really-profits-from-poorly-pets £150 for a dog’s injection. £900 to monitor a rabbit overnight. Thousands for cat surgery. How did pet care become such big business? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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