MarkD Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Vets bills are on the news today. Seems 6 companies have bought up 60% of the veterinary practices across the country and bang, costs have gone through the roof. A chap interviewed whilst walking his dog said yeah the hedge funds have bought up the practices, the vets don’t get any extra, it’s the owners. This chimes with what Gary Stevenson is saying. The rich buy all the assets (vets practices in this case), and we all end up poorer! As a result they [the rich] get richer, and buy more assets! I’m sure there are many other examples. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewy Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Then buy your own assets rather than renting/hiring/borrowing? Just an idea... 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Angry Capitalist Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 5 minutes ago, MarkD said: Vets bills are on the news today. Seems 6 companies have bought up 60% of the veterinary practices across the country and bang, costs have gone through the roof. A chap interviewed whilst walking his dog said yeah the hedge funds have bought up the practices, the vets don’t get any extra, it’s the owners. This chimes with what Gary Stevenson is saying. The rich buy all the assets (vets practices in this case), and we all end up poorer! As a result they [the rich] get richer, and buy more assets! I’m sure there are many other examples. Not really. If they get too expensive I am sure some vets would start their own practice. Entrepreneurs will start up places if there is profit to be had. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Angry Capitalist Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 7 minutes ago, MarkD said: Vets bills are on the news today. Seems 6 companies have bought up 60% of the veterinary practices across the country and bang, costs have gone through the roof. A chap interviewed whilst walking his dog said yeah the hedge funds have bought up the practices, the vets don’t get any extra, it’s the owners. This chimes with what Gary Stevenson is saying. The rich buy all the assets (vets practices in this case), and we all end up poorer! As a result they [the rich] get richer, and buy more assets! I’m sure there are many other examples. Furthermore, the new veterinary businesses will take custom away from the monopolies who charged higher prices making the formerly rich owners poor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkD Posted March 12 Author Share Posted March 12 1 minute ago, The Angry Capitalist said: Furthermore, the new veterinary businesses will take custom away from the monopolies who charged higher prices making the formerly rich owners poor. Well, it’s not happening. Not really surprised, the big companies always welcome reams and reams of regulation and requirements. Being big they can absorb it, the small players get overwhelmed. Tea rooms for example. Poor old Karen just can’t cope with it all, but not a problem for Costa or Starbucks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desiringonlychild Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 19 minutes ago, MarkD said: Vets bills are on the news today. Seems 6 companies have bought up 60% of the veterinary practices across the country and bang, costs have gone through the roof. A chap interviewed whilst walking his dog said yeah the hedge funds have bought up the practices, the vets don’t get any extra, it’s the owners. This chimes with what Gary Stevenson is saying. The rich buy all the assets (vets practices in this case), and we all end up poorer! As a result they [the rich] get richer, and buy more assets! I’m sure there are many other examples. Same thing with childcare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkD Posted March 12 Author Share Posted March 12 9 minutes ago, The Angry Capitalist said: Furthermore, the new veterinary businesses will take custom away from the monopolies who charged higher prices making the formerly rich owners poor. Just visualising how that would work, Fresh out of university, massive student debt. Renting whilst gaining experience, basically not a lot of spare cash, Buy an existing practice? No chance, big boys outbid you, Start a new practice from scratch? Not impossible, but…….hmmm not going to be easy. Rent space, buy space? Well done to anyone who manages it. Mate of mine did it in the Middle East, god knows how, but he did it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkHorseWaits-NoMore Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Anyone who has danced through the private vet care or pissed about with insurance cover claims, will know what an expensive scam it can be, especially if long term care intervention is required. After experiencing, who the hell would want an insurance based national healthcare system for adults, other than the small minded, selfish and those hosting a nasty personality disorder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 38 minutes ago, MarkD said: Vets bills are on the news today. Seems 6 companies have bought up 60% of the veterinary practices across the country and bang, costs have gone through the roof. A chap interviewed whilst walking his dog said yeah the hedge funds have bought up the practices, the vets don’t get any extra, it’s the owners. This chimes with what Gary Stevenson is saying. The rich buy all the assets (vets practices in this case), and we all end up poorer! As a result they [the rich] get richer, and buy more assets! I’m sure there are many other examples. I wonder how many Tory MPs are behind this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddog Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Are you sure they are too expensive?. I'm sure if an animal was a bit sick in the 70s and 80s, the animal would be "put to sleep". In the countryside they probably wouldn't even bother with the vet. I have a Facebook friend who had their gerbil stay overnight at at a vet. The animal only has a 2-3 year life expectancy, so it does not seem like something someone would have previously done. On this basis, you could say vets are too cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHPCinTheUK Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Vet care is a very first world problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkD Posted March 12 Author Share Posted March 12 57 minutes ago, Si1 said: I wonder how many Tory MPs are behind this. If you look across the pond you’ll see big corporations. They lobby the government, government then clear the way for them. The small players get swallowed up. As far as I can see the same thing is happening here. In terms of how any Tory MP’s ? Probably all of them, it’s how they get the backers they need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 1 hour ago, The Angry Capitalist said: If they get too expensive I am sure some vets would start their own practice. I would be inclined to agree - a hedge fund can own the business, but the employees can still quit and go to work at a newly started practise. Where I think things are more subtle is when you consider the relationship between the customers and the practise separately to the relationship between the practise and its staff. If the practise were to adopt a systematically exploitative stance towards their customers... then profit margins - definitely in the short to medium term - are likely to be eye-popping. Perhaps the staff won't all like their jobs under such a regime... but a proportion will be sufficiently money-motivated... probably including those who could stump up the capital to complete. The significant shift (if there has been one) is that control can be exerted over multiple practises in order to encourage them not to compete to offer the best value to the customer... but to compete to provide the highest profits to the ultimate beneficial owners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Housepricecrash91 Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Yes noticed this to several vets near me. A private equity backed company called IVC Evidensia has bought up independent vets and prices have subsequently increased massively. I think it's worth shopping around as there are still independents out there. I suspect even the independent vets are expensive... there's most likely high costs to entry nowadays Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casual-observer Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 The morals of a lot of Veterinarians also needs to be brought into question after some of the stories I've heard about. Similar to Dentists they've morphed into Victor Frankenstein's, more motivated by money than animal well being. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeanutButter Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Now do nurseries. https://www.theguardian.com/money/2024/mar/12/private-nursery-chains-profits-england Unison’s head of education, Mike Short, said: “There’s clearly big bucks to be made in childcare, but this is all so wrong. Large investors have muscled in on the sector, siphoning off the profit, piling on the debt and forcing smaller nurseries out. This is extremely bad news for infants, parents and childcare workers.” Previous Guardian analysis revealed that the number of nurseries backed by investment companies, including private equity firms, pension funds and venture capital, doubled between 2018 and 2022. Experts worry that lax financial regulation combined with the financial model of these global investors – profit-focused and with high levels of debt – poses a risk to thousands of nurseries that could be vulnerable to collapse. Vivek Kotecha, director of Trinava Consulting, said companies “are comfortable taking on more debt with the expectation that their income and profitability will grow over time due to more places and rising fees”. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbathpc Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 12 hours ago, reddog said: Are you sure they are too expensive?. I'm sure if an animal was a bit sick in the 70s and 80s, the animal would be "put to sleep". In the countryside they probably wouldn't even bother with the vet. I have a Facebook friend who had their gerbil stay overnight at at a vet. The animal only has a 2-3 year life expectancy, so it does not seem like something someone would have previously done. On this basis, you could say vets are too cheap. Yes, friend has spent over £10k on cancer operations for his dog, and is now presented with a few different options for monthly treatment, all at a cost of over £250+ pcm. Even 10 years ago, the dog would have been put down the second you said £10k for a surgery. I'm not sure its ethical for vets to offer these services tbh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sn50 Coif Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 On 3/12/2024 at 9:34 PM, Casual-observer said: The morals of a lot of Veterinarians also needs to be brought into question after some of the stories I've heard about. Similar to Dentists they've morphed into Victor Frankenstein's, more motivated by money than animal well being. I have a close relative who is a Director in a veterinary corporate. Under the newly cropped up corporates, the practice managers and vets are being given financial targets that are marked as personal performance indicators. This is not only instead of clinical performance indicators that would benefit patients, but as you suggest I can confirm that these indicators are being used to push for more expensive and unessecary treatment that in the light of day, is not in the best interest of the animal or the bill payer. Of course, it is very difficult to pin anyone down on this - and it will be the vets that take the fall for their corporate overlords. The trouble is that the RCVS has been 'bought' by the corporates and now serve them instead of having the backs of vets who push back against the moral corruption. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sn50 Coif Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 On 3/13/2024 at 8:38 AM, cbathpc said: Yes, friend has spent over £10k on cancer operations for his dog, and is now presented with a few different options for monthly treatment, all at a cost of over £250+ pcm. Even 10 years ago, the dog would have been put down the second you said £10k for a surgery. I'm not sure its ethical for vets to offer these services tbh On what grounds? If you mean that there are humans who need £10k of healthcare far more that a dying dog then yeah, that makes sense... but otherwise I find it difficult to see how explaining and offering the medical options that are available to the owner is unethical - in fact i'd argue that's what a good vet should do and is what they are paid to do. As for where the money goes, some of these veterinary corporates own their own supply chains now, so profits margins are difficult to define - but the customer facing businesses have been hitting 40% profit margins. Most coporate try to push their profits away from the customer facing bodies though in order to recieve less scrutiny from the public i.e. i'm sure customers are being fleeced far more than 40% all said and done. As for the vets- it's corporate wage surpession for them now - whereas previously the partners of small vet practices were raking in the dough and nobody complained! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sn50 Coif Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 On 3/12/2024 at 9:31 PM, Housepricecrash91 said: Yes noticed this to several vets near me. A private equity backed company called IVC Evidensia has bought up independent vets and prices have subsequently increased massively. I think it's worth shopping around as there are still independents out there. I suspect even the independent vets are expensive... there's most likely high costs to entry nowadays It depends where you live. In corporates pricing increases are forced down from on high and in currently in veterinary are not fully region specific. i.e. in some regions of the country independants will be able to compete better than others because at present there is little to no sensitivity to London vs rural Wales. The individual practice managers only have so much say how they distribute the price rises to hit centerally set targets. I am aware of independant practices, even new startups, that have recently pushed corporately owned parctices 'out of business' in all but name i.e. no clients walking through their doors, empty books and staff sitting around twiddling their thumbs. So far it seems like the corporates are very reluctant to shut down their sites or lower prices - that would equate to a loss of face! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Cash Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 There’s a couple of factors at play here. Some people are treating dogs as if they are human children. All pet costs increased over the last few years - none have come down. You can choose to spend hundreds of pounds on a dog bed etc etc etc. Our vets are still independent and are expensive. Our golden retriever is ill. He’s 12 has cancer (inoperable) and is on painkillers to keep him mobile. He may last another year but gets checked every 2 months. If he’s in too much pain they will advise that he be put down. We only know he has cancer because we thought his hips had collapsed but they hadn’t, he actually had a slipped disc. We had a CT scan to diagnose, whilst doing that the vet found several “old dog” issues. Scan was “only” £1200, plus £250 for follow-ups and medication. Money well spent IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 Had many animals and never had pet insurance... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Cash Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 On 3/12/2024 at 7:39 PM, desiringonlychild said: Same thing with childcare. And care for the elderly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 More people are giving pets human meds, sometimes it is the same.....a risk but not got the money to pay for high cost vet services what to do...... PDSA?......more abandoned animals? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted March 14 Share Posted March 14 (edited) On 12/03/2024 at 19:58, reddog said: Are you sure they are too expensive?. I'm sure if an animal was a bit sick in the 70s and 80s, the animal would be "put to sleep". In the countryside they probably wouldn't even bother with the vet. I have a Facebook friend who had their gerbil stay overnight at at a vet. The animal only has a 2-3 year life expectancy, so it does not seem like something someone would have previously done. On this basis, you could say vets are too cheap. Vets are way too expensive...pet only if rich enough.. Edited March 14 by winkie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.