Bruce Banner Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 40 minutes ago, nightowl said: In the aftermath of the 2019 GE it was assumed after such a beating Labour are dead and buried. In the heat of the moment many commentators forgot by 2014 Brexit will in principle have been done and bojo and co may well be redundant having carried out that task. Labour may find losing 2019 was a good thing and their potential in 2024 were better than claimed even before the covid aftermath begins. By that time, if they carry on the way they have been, they may be so unpopular that a new government will be elected on a mandate to reverse everything enacted by the BJ regime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 Labour will get in, at some point.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_British_governments In 2024, the Conservatives will have been in for 14 years which is close to the maximum you can expect considering recent (since WWII) governments. Labour was 13 before that, and the Tories 18 before that. So, if Sir Keir does not win in 2024, then Labour have just had the longest losing run in history ? Well, after a quick browse in the link above, the 1830s ? The best Labour can hope for here, is for the next election to revert to historical norms. It's not certain though, and the longest losing run is looking very likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msi Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 4 minutes ago, Huggy said: So, if Sir Keir does not win in 2024, then Labour are on course towards have just had the longest losing run in history ? There, fixed for you. Notwithstanding snap elections, no confidence votes, civil unrest, referendums etc. Personally, I don't want Labour to win - the Tories need to be on the hook for it all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 3 minutes ago, msi said: There, fixed for you. Notwithstanding snap elections, no confidence votes, civil unrest, referendums etc. Personally, I don't want Labour to win - the Tories need to be on the hook for it all Yes, thank you, those dastardly black swans notwithstanding! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simhadri Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 1 hour ago, Warlord said: No... Trust me. Starmer is Blair 2.0. Most people will not look beyond him and will vote for him in their droves. The lunatics will hang on to his coat tails and will end up in power or having a big say over policy as you suggest. Starmer doesn't have the charisma of Blair. Momentum has damaged Labour's credibility which takes few more years to build before they fight back to No 10. I will be happy if Labour ends up in No 10 without those communists. But if they use Starmer as a shied and end up in government, they might lose next election as White Van Man can't take higher taxes and low productivity economy. Blair wanted David Miliband as his successor. Not sure about Starmer as he hasn't yet made his stand on taxation, anti-semitism, trade with china and some other issues on which he will be pestered by Tories. Remember when David Cameron was leader of opposition, he took a memo from education secretary and tried to blame Labour on it. In less than a minute, Blair fought back with detailed statistics on amount of funding given by New Labour indicating Tories allocated less funding for education compared to New Labour. We need such leaders from Labour who can beat Tories at policies, not a rabble-rouser communist protesting outside the very parliament he was supposed to lead. We need labour leaders with problem solving ability, not just complaining. I voted Labour in the past and happy to do it in future IF they reinvent themselves to why they exist and for whom they exist and what policies they stand up for. Until then, momentum idiots will keep giving Tories term after term. Remember how George Osborne was happy when Corbyn replaced Miliband ? Tories can't even hide their happiness that their luck with Momentum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightowl Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 34 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said: By that time, if they carry on the way they have been, they may be so unpopular that a new government will be elected on a mandate to reverse everything enacted by the BJ regime. Even if you don't approve of Brexit itself, don't bank on it being reversed now based on covid performance. Labour are very split on the issue (hence their confused 2019 campaign) and will know GE2019 was the unofficial 2nd referendum so would do well to let that sleeping dog lie anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 15, 2020 Author Share Posted June 15, 2020 Boris might nit last if things get worse and believe they will. Once he is consistently behind Labour in the Polls (not there yet) I expect the tories to give him the boot. They can be ruthless and lust for power more than anything else so they may ditch Boris and install a yes man like Michael Gove Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 On 14/06/2020 at 12:14, Warlord said: The tories are going to have to expose the other MPs for the loonies they are. I think Starmer is like another Blair . He iis competent and what not and if he does half as well as Blair (3 General elections in a row) then im sure Labour members will be happy On 14/06/2020 at 12:21, Bruce Banner said: Both lawyers, but Blair was a "rock star", whereas Starmer is a grownup politician. Perhaps Starmer is more comparable to John Smith. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 2 hours ago, nightowl said: Even if you don't approve of Brexit itself, don't bank on it being reversed now based on covid performance. Labour are very split on the issue (hence their confused 2019 campaign) and will know GE2019 was the unofficial 2nd referendum so would do well to let that sleeping dog lie anyway. That split was more between a few Corbynites and the bulk of the party. I am not sure that is significant now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pebbles Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 4 hours ago, msi said: UK policing strategy has evolved from the Miners strikes, Lewisham, Toxteth, Brixton, Broadwater Farm et al. Going in boots first didn't help then and doesn't help now. Kettling and splitting off groups means you stop things getting to critical mass. Oh, but if you think you know soo much better, feel free to run for Police and Crime commissioner - you can canvass votes through Brixton with a 'you loot and I'll shoot placard' Ah equal policing (but more equal for others) strategy; the one that alllows your privilege card - the one that means you can p*ss over a memorial but still be a 'protester'. If you take your fingers out of your ears, you may see you've just proved the BLM point. Sorry but we need equal policing. P*ssing near a s statue and knocking a statue over doesn't come close to the damage done. Both were done by people protesting and if the police didn't abdicate their role when the statues were toppled that individual would be letting BLM get on with making their important point in line with the law. In this country everyone should be obeying the law the same law enforced equally without discriminating through race or pandering to political correctness (letting some groups get away with stuff other groups couldn't do). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 3 hours ago, Huggy said: Labour will get in, at some point.... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_British_governments In 2024, the Conservatives will have been in for 14 years which is close to the maximum you can expect considering recent (since WWII) governments. Labour was 13 before that, and the Tories 18 before that. So, if Sir Keir does not win in 2024, then Labour have just had the longest losing run in history ? Well, after a quick browse in the link above, the 1830s ? The best Labour can hope for here, is for the next election to revert to historical norms. It's not certain though, and the longest losing run is looking very likely. Congratulations, twit. F***ed up the ass for umpteen years and still cheering for more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARTINX9 Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 (edited) 30 minutes ago, zugzwang said: Congratulations, twit. F***ed up the ass for umpteen years and still cheering for more! Average London house price 1997 £94,000 Average London house price 2010 (2 years post crash) £385,000 No of UK buy to let mortgages 1998 - 40,000 No of UK buy to let mortgages by 2006 - 330,000 F**ked up the a**e by Labour for 13 years - the same Blarite crew are back running it now - and you are still cheering for more?!!! Lets just say a party run by the chatterati of Islington and Camden who have been made millionaires by the current set up is never going to do anything much to make housing more affordable either! There was a reason that crowd hated the dementia tax - and it really wasn't because they were overly worried about improving the provision of care for people with dementia merely what they might inherit from them! Edited June 15, 2020 by MARTINX9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 (edited) 37 minutes ago, zugzwang said: Congratulations, twit. F***ed up the ass for umpteen years and still cheering for more! Labour would never allow that to happen! Hang on, you're missing 2001 - 2005 ?? Quite by accident I'm sure. Neither party have been big on an HPC happening. Perhaps you can tell me who I should have voted for to enable this to happen, please, it seems like you might have the answer. If you don't have an answer, that's cool, I think the answer's 'no one'. I will therefore keep highlighting the unnecessary excitement, and occasional mania, to keep the other side grounded. Until someone better comes along. I consider a treacherous, commie-brexit blocking party to be more important to stop than spending more on a house. HPI is a bad thing, but those pieces of s*** are legions worse. Edited June 15, 2020 by Huggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 15, 2020 Author Share Posted June 15, 2020 BOTH parties pander to the HPI forever /mumsnet voter. Because that's where the votes are sadly. Now you know why I can't vote for either them and the LibDumbs are even worse ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 47 minutes ago, zugzwang said: Congratulations, twit. F***ed up the ass for umpteen years and still cheering for more! Here you go, here's a clearer graph, you may remember it from a certain website. Bad Tories, making that graph go up so very steeply from the late 90s to just before 2010. Do you blame Boris, and Dom, and Don for that too. Thatcher did try and do a big one, bad lady, but the Tories sorted that out after thankfully. Didn't get much thanks for it, poor chaps ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 3 hours ago, Huggy said: Labour would never allow that to happen! Hang on, you're missing 2001 - 2005 ?? Quite by accident I'm sure. Neither party have been big on an HPC happening. Perhaps you can tell me who I should have voted for to enable this to happen, please, it seems like you might have the answer. If you don't have an answer, that's cool, I think the answer's 'no one'. I will therefore keep highlighting the unnecessary excitement, and occasional mania, to keep the other side grounded. Until someone better comes along. I consider a treacherous, commie-brexit blocking party to be more important to stop than spending more on a house. HPI is a bad thing, but those pieces of s*** are legions worse. The 2019 Labour Party manifesto had at its heart a promise to introduce a nationwide general needs social housing program - the most ambitious since the late '40s - as part of a £150bn social transformation fund, both to address the acute demand pressure in the private rental sector and to repair and re-fit existing UK housing stock for the 21st Century. It was all there in black and white. ? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/20/labour-to-unveil-75bn-social-housing-plan-to-build-for-the-many Quote Labour will promise to tackle Britain’s housing crisis by “building for the many”, setting aside £75bn over five years to fund the most dramatic increase in council home construction since the second world war. As he launches Labour’s manifesto, Jeremy Corbyn will pledge that by the end of its first term in office, a Labour government would build 100,000 council houses a year, and 50,000 social homes through housing associations – all of them to high environmental standards. Only 6,287 council homes were built in 2018-19. The rapid increase would be paid for using half of the £150bn “social transformation fund” recently announced by the shadow chancellor, John McDonnell, which will be funded through government borrowing. The shadow housing secretary, John Healey, told the Guardian: “We’re talking about a new era of council housing. “And the significance of it is that building on this scale allows us not just to build for the poorest; but to be able to build homes again for those young people trapped in private renting; young families that want to get a start in life that can’t yet afford to buy; older people that may be in substandard homes that need somewhere more secure and reliably costed.” He added: “We can do in a way that we did by kicking off that great council housebuilding programme after the second world war: we can build for the many.” Healey conceded that to meet the target, Labour would have to rapidly increase the capacity of local authorities, whose planning departments have been hollowed out dramatically as building rates have declined. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 (edited) 33 minutes ago, zugzwang said: The 2019 Labour Party manifesto had at its heart a promise to introduce a nationwide general needs social housing program - the most ambitious since the late '40s - as part of a £150bn social transformation fund, both to address the acute demand pressure in the private rental sector and to repair and re-fit existing UK housing stock for the 21st Century. It was all there in black and white. ? https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/20/labour-to-unveil-75bn-social-housing-plan-to-build-for-the-many I'm surprised a manifesto has been cited as a good source for truth. As mentioned, (and even if I believed they would actually follow through with that manifesto pledge), Corbyn would not get my vote due to the cataclysmic shite storm that would get sprayed at myself and other workers. Also I wanted Brexit. Someone else with a red rosette might at some point get my vote, but having a cheaper house is no compensation for having that treacherous, and expensive turd in charge. To put it another way, I like cake, but I will not have my hand cut off just to eat a slice. That does not mean that I don't like cake, just that I like my hand more. Much more. Also, Boris hasn't actually said that I won't get cake at any point, but he did definitely promise those Brexit sweets. I like sweets and I have a big bag right now. I still want cake as well. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39933116 Brexit section, point 1, first five words. If he hadn't broken that rather big promise, he may have got a few more votes and may have had a chance to build lots of houses. Hence the surprise at bringing up the latest manifesto. Edited June 15, 2020 by Huggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob8 Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 4 hours ago, Huggy said: Here you go, here's a clearer graph, you may remember it from a certain website. Bad Tories, making that graph go up so very steeply from the late 90s to just before 2010. Do you blame Boris, and Dom, and Don for that too. Thatcher did try and do a big one, bad lady, but the Tories sorted that out after thankfully. Didn't get much thanks for it, poor chaps ? Quite. Credit crunch, austerity and brexit seem to be far bigger things for keeping house prices lower. The Tories come out of that quite well, though less well for affordability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 27 minutes ago, Bob8 said: Quite. Credit crunch, austerity and brexit seem to be far bigger things for keeping house prices lower. The Tories come out of that quite well, though less well for affordability. They should have done much more when they could back in 2010. Sadly that bit of politics proves to be a vote winner, for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsieurCopperCrutch Posted June 15, 2020 Share Posted June 15, 2020 5 hours ago, zugzwang said: Congratulations, twit. F***ed up the ass for umpteen years and still cheering for more! #theyknewwhattheywerevotingfor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 11 hours ago, Huggy said: I'm surprised a manifesto has been cited as a good source for truth. As mentioned, (and even if I believed they would actually follow through with that manifesto pledge), Corbyn would not get my vote due to the cataclysmic shite storm that would get sprayed at myself and other workers. Also I wanted Brexit. Someone else with a red rosette might at some point get my vote, but having a cheaper house is no compensation for having that treacherous, and expensive turd in charge. To put it another way, I like cake, but I will not have my hand cut off just to eat a slice. That does not mean that I don't like cake, just that I like my hand more. Much more. Also, Boris hasn't actually said that I won't get cake at any point, but he did definitely promise those Brexit sweets. I like sweets and I have a big bag right now. I still want cake as well. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2017-39933116 Brexit section, point 1, first five words. If he hadn't broken that rather big promise, he may have got a few more votes and may have had a chance to build lots of houses. Hence the surprise at bringing up the latest manifesto. Forget the cake and sweets. Unless the bubble of phantom equity in the UK housing market is extinguished all you'll be enjoying is a diet of sawdust pancakes, nettles and stones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 16, 2020 Author Share Posted June 16, 2020 (edited) So Boris has extended free school meals over the summer after a campaign by a prominent footballer. The cost about £140m . Boris loves to spend taxpayers money..... Is it really the business of government to feed children? What about their parents or charities? Is there no limit to public funds ? Edited June 16, 2020 by Warlord Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MARTINX9 Posted June 16, 2020 Share Posted June 16, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Warlord said: So Boris has extended free school meals over the summer after a campaign by a prominent footballer. The cost about £140m . Boris loves to spend taxpayers money..... Is it really the business of government to feed children? What about their parents or charities? Is there no limit to public funds ? Well to be fair these kids will be paying off all the government debt incurred in the last three months for the rest of their lives - so a few free meals probably is the least we can offer them. The cost of this scheme is equivalent to the annual salary of 12 premiership footballers - so perhaps a supertax on them and the other 300 or so players would help pay the bill? Given the Premier League now supports the end of capitalism and the patriarchy they must surely agree that their players be should be paid no more than the average wage paid to players in the Women's football league which is £27,000 a year. Of course it might be an even better idea if all these kids were back at school including over the summer as they have had 3 months at home anyway since March - that way we guarantee that they do actually get at least one hot meal a day. Edited June 16, 2020 by MARTINX9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warlord Posted June 16, 2020 Author Share Posted June 16, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, MARTINX9 said: Well to be fair these kids will be paying off all the government debt incurred in the last three months for the rest of their lives - so a few free meals probably is the least we can offer them. Of course it might be an even better idea if all these kids were back at school including over the summer as they have had 3 months at home anyway since March - that way we guarantee that they do actually get at least one hot meal a day. I sincerely wish he would tell us what he's going to CUT to fund this expansion of the program and considering the state of the public finances he should be cutting anyway. Sadly this government is doing the exact opposite of what it should be doing and we're going to be worse off because of it . Edited June 16, 2020 by Warlord Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted June 17, 2020 Share Posted June 17, 2020 (edited) NuLabour, or to be precise, their heirs, are still in power. Same policies. Same backers? Government by spads and spin doctors. Edited June 17, 2020 by Bruce Banner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.