Coronavirus - potential Black Swan?

[Riedquat]

3 hours ago, Bruce Banner said:

I can't agree that one needs to be qualified to read a scientific article. Although such prohibition would be convenient to discredit anyone with the temerity to question official vaccination policy.

If you're not reasonably knowledgeable in the field you likely won't have a clue what a scientific paper is on about. There's a level below that, more general scientific articles suitable for people with a good general scientific background (at a level I believe most people could manage with a bit of effort) but they're not usually very easy to find.

[Bruce Banner]

2 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

If you're not reasonably knowledgeable in the field you likely won't have a clue what a scientific paper is on about. There's a level below that, more general scientific articles suitable for people with a good general scientific background (at a level I believe most people could manage with a bit of effort) but they're not usually very easy to find.

The trick is finding articles that you can digest and making sure that you're happy with the source, something I was used to doing when I was in business. 

 

[Riedquat]

2 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said:

The trick is finding articles that you can digest and making sure that you're happy with the source, something I was used to doing when I was in business.

Sure, they're out there if you've got a reasonably good grounding and have some idea where to look. That's not most people unfortunately.

[Ah-so]

3 hours ago, Bruce Banner said:

Are you really trying to tell me that a GP needs to know and understand the chemical composition of a drug before prescribing it to a patient? Or that an electronics design engineer needs to understand the working of a microprocessor at substrate level?  

If I want to learn about something I can generally find well written articles that give me the knowledge I require in language that I can understand.

That is precisely what I am not saying - non-experts (and for this purpose I am placing GPs as highly informed generalists), do not need to know the underlying detailed research - they can rely on the opinion and research of experts. Those who try generally end up embarrassing themselves (like Donald Trump's alien sex doctor). 

But when you get the badly informed, unqualified members of the public trying to review technical papers, you can end up with them misunderstanding the conclusions, particularly when they start out with a strong contrary predisposition against elements of medical science. 

I see on this site what some people do with fairly basic statistics, which you don't really need much training to do, and they jump to quite erroneous conclusions. And some of these same people are trawling through papers where you do need a degree of qualification to understand, and  yet think that they are properly able to draw different conclusions from it. 

[Ah-so]

45 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

Sure, they're out there if you've got a reasonably good grounding and have some idea where to look. That's not most people unfortunately.

Which for an average person will mean reading New Scientist magazine, where someone kindly does the legwork of summarising research.

But you won't read articles that say that the entire medical establishment has overlooked the possibility that PCR tests can't be used to detect COVID and that no one working in the field has noticed.

At least not until it was brought to their attention by a guy with no scientific qualifications who apparently spotted the flaws that they had all overlooked. 

[Bob8]

1 minute ago, Ah-so said:

Which for an average person will mean reading New Scientist magazine, where someone kindly does the legwork of summarising research.

But you won't read articles that say that the entire medical establishment has overlooked the possibility that PCR tests can't be used to detect COVID and that no one working in the field has noticed.

At least not until it was brought to their attention by a guy with no scientific qualifications who apparently spotted the flaws that they had all overlooked. 

That is so utterly mind-numbingly moronic and arrogant, that is rather across the rubicon of people deserving decent manners.

[Bruce Banner]

25 minutes ago, Ah-so said:

That is precisely what I am not saying - non-experts (and for this purpose I am placing GPs as highly informed generalists), do not need to know the underlying detailed research - they can rely on the opinion and research of experts. Those who try generally end up embarrassing themselves (like Donald Trump's alien sex doctor). 

But when you get the badly informed, unqualified members of the public trying to review technical papers, you can end up with them misunderstanding the conclusions, particularly when they start out with a strong contrary predisposition against elements of medical science. 

I see on this site what some people do with fairly basic statistics, which you don't really need much training to do, and they jump to quite erroneous conclusions. And some of these same people are trawling through papers where you do need a degree of qualification to understand, and  yet think that they are properly able to draw different conclusions from it. 

I must admit that I don't bother to read posts that go into details that I don't understand, preferring to stick to what I do.

[vadst43]

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2782900Myocarditis and Pericarditis After Vaccination for COVID-19Myocarditis and Pericarditis After Vaccination for COVID-19

Myocarditis/Pericarditis post Covaxx

[Arpeggio]

32 minutes ago, Bruce Banner said:

I must admit that I don't bother to read posts that go into details that I don't understand, preferring to stick to what I do.

Always a good starting point and underrated, in my opinion.

Ninety percent of Covid deaths are in countries with high obesity rates, study finds

UK Govt Hopes The Offer Of Fast Food Will Help The Young Overcome Vaccine Hesitancy

Hey, but you know....."Science!"

 

5 hours ago, Ah-so said:

meaningless to me:

"Analysis of the morphology, crystalline phase, and chemical
composition of the Fe(OH)3/Fe2O3@Au composite
nanocatalyst. The chemical composition, crystalline phase and the morphology of the prepared Fe(OH)3/Fe2O3@Au nano-composite were characterized by XPS, XRD, EDX and TEM.

First, the electronic states of Au and Fe in the Fe(OH)3/Fe2O3@Au composite nanomaterials were determined by XPS technique. As shown in Fig. 1a, the high-resolution Au 4f peaks near the binding energies of 83.5 and 87.1 eV conrm the zero valent Au element, and the main peaks are attributed to Au 4f7/2 and Au 4f5/2, respectively. The Fe 2p spectrum has two peaks at the
binding energies of 711.0 and 725.2 eV (Fig. 1b), and the main peaks are attributed to Fe 2p3/2 and Fe 2p1/2, respectively. The Fe 2p spectrum indicates that Fe exists in the form of a positive trivalent. Two shake satellites with Fe3+ were found in the XPS spectra of Fe 2p. Fig. S1† shows the chemical composition and crystalline phase of the synthesized Fe(OH)3/Fe2O3@Au nano- composite characterized by X-ray diffraction (XRD). The obvious diffraction peaks of Fe(OH)3 at 2q ¼ 14.2, 36.4, 46.9 and 59.1are well indexed on the Fe(OH)3 standard card (JCPDS no. 38-0032). The obvious diffraction peaks of face-centered cubic crystalline Fe2O3 at 2q ¼ 26.9, 36.2, 48.9 and 54.9 are well indexed on the (002) (020) (113) and (004) planes, respectively,of the standard face-centered cubic crystalline Fe2O3 card (JCPDS no. 34-0394). The diffraction peak at 2q ¼ 38.2 ha..."

The level of radiation required to remove electrons from atoms and the distance between sections of atoms, of both Iron and Gold composite nanomaterials.

 

5 hours ago, Ah-so said:

That's kind of the problem - people believe that they are equipped to read and comprehend things when they didn't even have the basic qualifications to do so, such as a degree in the area.

OK Grandad.

The heavily censored inventor of mRNA technique, Dr. Robert Malone, who is critical of mRNA vaccines has an MA, and came up with it while still a student. Bob8 says he has a PhD so you had better jump off a cliff from a one legged start position while patting your head and rubbing your tummy if he tells you to.

As for Edward Jenner. He had never passed a medical examination in his life. His latest biographer, Dr. Norman Moore, confessed that his qualifications were obtained by fraud.

 

19 minutes ago, vadst43 said:

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2782900Myocarditis and Pericarditis After Vaccination for COVID-19Myocarditis and Pericarditis After Vaccination for COVID-19

Myocarditis/Pericarditis post Covaxx

How dare you post this you scientifically illiterate pleb. Do you not understand what the following really means?

"This study shows a similar pattern, although at higher incidence, suggesting vaccine adverse event underreporting."

It's some kind of code....I think, must be about PCR tests or something.

(kidding obviously)

Edited August 7, 2021 by Arpeggio

[vadst43]

7 minutes ago, Arpeggio said:

How dare you post this you scientifically illiterate pleb

Yes, I am not worthy I dropped biology - all those flower names  + diagrams .God, it  made Latin seem interesting

Edited August 7, 2021 by vadst43
itpo

[Arpeggio]

1 hour ago, Ah-so said:

That is precisely what I am not saying - non-experts (and for this purpose I am placing GPs as highly informed generalists), do not need to know the underlying detailed research - they can rely on the opinion and research of experts. Those who try generally end up embarrassing themselves (like Donald Trump's alien sex doctor).

Here are 1140 comments from Doctors and other medical professionals.

https://www.medscape.com/sites/public/covid-19/vaccine-insights/how-concerned-are-you-about-vaccine-related-adverse-events

"Commenting is limited to medical professionals."

[markyh]

30 minutes ago, vadst43 said:

Yes, I am not worthy I dropped biology - all those flower names  + diagrams .God, it  made Latin seem interesting

I got a CSE 1 in Human Biology, so way more qualified to know this shit. 

[markyh]

6 hours ago, Ah-so said:

Well, you wouldn't want to go to a nasty £6.5k 4-star 14-day all-inclusive holiday would you?

Those are the sub £3k holidays for a family of 4 , in a "3 star" venue. "Shudders, Nasty", the wife would never except it. 

[Will!]

47 minutes ago, vadst43 said:

Yes, I am not worthy I dropped biology - all those flower names  + diagrams .God, it  made Latin seem interesting

And with 88.9% of the adult population having had one dose of the vaccine and 74.1% having had two doses, you still can’t frighten people!

Edited August 7, 2021 by Will!
Numbers

[vadst43]

5 minutes ago, Will! said:

And with 88.9% of the adult population having had one dose of the vaccine and 74.1% having had two doses, you still can’t frighten people!

Let's hope all these good Doctors Do No Harm then

[vadst43]

From Dr Salman Saleem in @Arpeggio's Medscape link

'The strangest thing I've seen is people becoming magnetic, saw rumors of this online so tested it in clinic. I've had 3 pts with metal objects sticking to their limbs...'

[anonguest]

2 hours ago, Arpeggio said:

Always a good starting point and underrated, in my opinion.

Ninety percent of Covid deaths are in countries with high obesity rates, study finds

UK Govt Hopes The Offer Of Fast Food Will Help The Young Overcome Vaccine Hesitancy

 

So....we have too many fat people getting too little exercise. Solution? Offer them taxis and calorie laden fast food!

God give me strength! LOL

[The Spaniard]

1 hour ago, vadst43 said:

From Dr Salman Saleem in @Arpeggio's Medscape link

'The strangest thing I've seen is people becoming magnetic, saw rumors of this online so tested it in clinic. I've had 3 pts with metal objects sticking to their limbs...'

Ever more videos are showing this strange phenomenon. Is everyone faking it?

The infamous spanners, guaranteed to send a couple of posters here apoplectic with disbelief, appear at 2:10 in this one:

https://www.bitchute.com/video/FVz5e3x7Dih8/

[The Spaniard]

Two harrowing anecdotes in this video indicate that MRI scans might be causing extremely damaging reactions in some who have taken the COVID jab.

Such potential problems of interaction with MRI scanners has been raised earlier in this thread, albeit as an argument that the jabs could not possibly contain any magnetic material.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/soSWq0wh3Szr/

 

[Drat]

2 hours ago, vadst43 said:

From Dr Salman Saleem in @Arpeggio's Medscape link

'The strangest thing I've seen is people becoming magnetic, saw rumors of this online so tested it in clinic. I've had 3 pts with metal objects sticking to their limbs...'

OK if people were really magnetic you could test it easily by passing a compass near them and seeing the needle swing, not sticking metal object to them. But no, we see none of that, much harder to fake. Whereas sticking something to your sweaty clammy skin is much easier to do and then claim you are magnetic.

That people believe this rubbish, or that the PCR test doesn't work, or that COVID is just flu, or that there have been no excess deaths, or that the vaccines are not working despite all the masses of evidence that they are, well, that people believe in any of these is a joke against humanity: As a species we aren't as smart as a we like to think we are.

[captainb]

1 hour ago, The Spaniard said:

Two harrowing anecdotes in this video indicate that MRI scans might be causing extremely damaging reactions in some who have taken the COVID jab.

Such potential problems of interaction with MRI scanners has been raised earlier in this thread, albeit as an argument that the jabs could not possibly contain any magnetic material.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/soSWq0wh3Szr/

 

You do realise how many MRI scans are carried out daily on people who have been vaccinated given 80% of the adult population have been....

I guess you think those 10s of thousands have been scraped off the machine, baged up and nobody has noticed. Oh whoops another one. That's 80% of our patients these magnetics who have been shredded 

Utterly ridiculous

Edited August 7, 2021 by captainb

[Will!]

34 minutes ago, captainb said:

You do realise how many MRI scans are carried out daily on people who have been vaccinated given 80% of the adult population have been....

I guess you think those 10s of thousands have been scraped off the machine, baged up and nobody has noticed. Oh whoops another one. That's 80% of our patients these magnetics who have been shredded 

Utterly ridiculous

This is the vicious circle in which the antivaxxers are caught.  As more and more people are vaccinated and completely fail to develop frightening side effects then the antivaxxers have to try more extreme measures to frighten them, but these are too ridiculous to be frightening.

[Confusion of VIs]

2 hours ago, The Spaniard said:

Two harrowing anecdotes in this video indicate that MRI scans might be causing extremely damaging reactions in some who have taken the COVID jab.

Such potential problems of interaction with MRI scanners has been raised earlier in this thread, albeit as an argument that the jabs could not possibly contain any magnetic material.

https://www.bitchute.com/video/soSWq0wh3Szr/

 

🤣🤣🤣 For harrowing anecdotes read BS. No sane person believes this, they are laughing at you. 

What shall we do with our magnetic patient? How about we stick them in an MRI and turn them to mush. 🤣 🤣, 

For your sake, I hope you are just a troll having a laugh. 

[Riedquat]

6 hours ago, Bob8 said:

That is so utterly mind-numbingly moronic and arrogant, that is rather across the rubicon of people deserving decent manners.

I rather assume he meant that you won't read articles saying they're no good in any decent scientific literature (even if aimed at popular science rather than researchers in the field) because such articles don't exist, for obvious reasons.

[FallingAwake]

Vaccinated people make up 75% of recent COVID-19 cases in Singapore, but few fall ill
https://www.reuters.com/world/asia-pacific/vaccinated-people-singapore-make-up-three-quarters-recent-covid-19-cases-2021-07-23/

So while the vaccines do seem to reduce the severity of becoming ill, they don't seem to be doing a great job in the "stopping transmission" department.

I'm wondering whether "vaccine" is the right word to describe them, if they reduce symptoms but don't actually stop you getting or spreading COV? Wouldn't the word "treatment" or "prophylactic" be more accurate?

Especially since, based on what the CEO of Pfizer recently said (i.e. a decline in effectiveness after the 5-6 month mark), I suspect people are probably going to need regular top-ups? This sounds to me a lot like a preventative treatment rather than a vaccine.