Stop Using Food Banks Says Tory

[Tonkers]

Such hubris.

Your job might never disappear, but your ability to perform it might.

You, like everyone, are one faulty car brake, one bacterium, one black swan phone call away from a life-changing event that could render you unemployed or unemployable.

Dwell on that.

I took that comment light hearted but you are spot on here, some events you think you would handle can tumble together and completely distort the ability to cope.

I owe much to good friends.

[Tonkers]

I never stated those things could not happen. My original point was I do not like paying for ******wits to have kids; I stand by that point. This does not mean that I think there should not be a safety net for the sick.

For fun, how do we weed out the ******wits?

[alexw]

I am sure I will be ok. It would pretty much mean the end of civilisation for my job to cease to exist

Your a prostitute?

Sorry I could not resist....

[happy_renting]

I never stated those things could not happen. My original point was I do not like paying for ******wits to have kids; I stand by that point. This does not mean that I think there should not be a safety net for the sick.

You 'pay for ****wits to have kids'.

There are so many things wrong with that claim I hardly know where to start.

Benefits, as they are, are there as a safety net. And, with rising cost of living of the essentials in life, it is becoming inadequate.

They are not being 'paid to have kids'.

I guess you just despise humanity.

[doomed]

You 'pay for ****wits to have kids'.

There are so many things wrong with that claim I hardly know where to start.

Benefits, as they are, are there as a safety net. And, with rising cost of living of the essentials in life, it is becoming inadequate.

They are not being 'paid to have kids'.

I guess you just despise humanity.

If you think there are not people having children due to the benefits on offer you are deluded. I have had this situation occur close to home and I'm from a city where it is commonplace.

[Hectors House]

Can we have some surveys done to see food bank users in more detail:

- how many drive there

- how many smoke

- how many have a phone on contract or top up regularly

- how many drink, go out,

- how many have sky tv

- how many wear designer brands

- how many have kids who have designer brands, fancy parties, and mobile phones

If access to foodbanks is unlimited for people then they will never learn to cope. And I'm not talking about people who've been left floating by the system not paying them out for a fortnight.

I find it really hard to feel sorry for people who just do not want to cut some non-essentials out.

A food bank shouldn't just be about feeding people, it should be an opportunity to educate people - how many give budgeting help to assist them long term?

if you give a man a fish he is hungry again in an hour; if you teach him to catch a fish you do him a good turn.

Very patronising misinformed and ignorant post

I suspect Sarah Bell you consider yourself to be a Tory supporter, the thing is a real Tory would probbaly sneer down at you, that's the problem with the UK though, too many people think they are some middle class elite when in fact they are in reality working class, I bet you are Sarah Bell. There's nothing wrong with working hard and enjoying the benefits but some people get dealt a bad hand.

What did David Cameron do on his first day in office? Made sure the wine cellar was restocked at taxpayer expense - we are all in this together!

IDS gets EU farming subsidies around £135K a year (that's really a benefit for rich farmers paid for by taxpayers

I could go on, yes New Labour were a corrupt bunch of morons, the Conservatives are just as bad, look how much they wasted on Margaret Thatchers funeral? the woman was a liar, her and Francis Pym were trying to give away the Falklands between 1979 and 1982 to Argentina. The Argentine leadership only made the decision to invade to look powerful and have prestige when in reality they were in dire straights! Thatcher wrecked business in the UK, We are suffering the consequences of her as much as Blair, Brown or Cameron.

1. how many drive there Some people have no choice were they live, not everybody lives in towns or cities with good public transport

2. how many smoke (see my comment about designer brands - not many but then smoking is a minority thing)

3. how many have a phone on contract or top up regularly

4. how many drink, go out,

5. how many have sky tv The old ignorant argument about driving round a "council estate" and see how many Sky aka Freesat dishes you can see!

6. how many wear designer brands I helped unemployed people try and find work, no body has designer brands, most were wearing clothes from charity shop

7. how many have kids who have designer brands, fancy parties, and mobile phones You are Katie Hopkins and I claim my £10!

Edited October 3, 2013 by Hectors House

[alexw]

Can we have some surveys done to see food bank users in more detail:

- how many drive there

- how many smoke

- how many have a phone on contract or top up regularly

- how many drink, go out,

- how many have sky tv

- how many wear designer brands

- how many have kids who have designer brands, fancy parties, and mobile phones

If access to foodbanks is unlimited for people then they will never learn to cope. And I'm not talking about people who've been left floating by the system not paying them out for a fortnight.

I find it really hard to feel sorry for people who just do not want to cut some non-essentials out.

A food bank shouldn't just be about feeding people, it should be an opportunity to educate people - how many give budgeting help to assist them long term?

if you give a man a fish he is hungry again in an hour; if you teach him to catch a fish you do him a good turn.

I have no idea, do you? If you don't then how can you possibly make value judgements that basically say "It's their own fault", particularly when we sure as hell know that incomes of those at the bottom are being harshly squeezed via high inflation, falling to stagnant incomes, and unemployment.

Here's some links to the real life stories about those using food banks if you care to read, that tell a different story to your daily mailesque line.

http://birminghamcentral.foodbank.org.uk/real-life-stories

http://www.trusselltrust.org/real-stories

http://news.sky.com/story/1059288/pm-meets-families-facing-poverty-at-food-bank

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/food-bank-britain-a-former-businessman-1481666

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/12/20/food-banks-single-mother-_n_2338433.html

Do you want more?

Frankly, after reading those stories myself just now, your attitude about this topic simply disgusts me.

Edited October 3, 2013 by alexw

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

This tory has mild cerebral palsy and has described disability campaigners as 'extremists'. Seems to feel he needs to be an exaggeratedly 'evil tory' to gain acceptance by the gang, a bit like Maggie Thatcher showing she could be more macho than any man.

[eightiesgirly]

I think he should mind his own business.

Food bank access is only given on referral from a social worker or health care professional on identifying a need. 3 days food is supplied.

These are charitable donations, operated by volunteers not taxpayer funded giveaways. What does it have to do with anyone else but the charity, the donors and the recipients.

[DTMark]

Oh, the clash of left-wing versus right-wing.

I agree with eightiesgirly above.

And whether or not the politician was actually making a serious point, it was horrendously misjudged.

Sarah Bell might just perhaps know one or two people who take advantage, and raises a serious question - poor, or "faux-poor" and is then met with a torrent of bile suggesting she's the most evil thing since Hitler.

We all have our own stories to tell, here in our village three new "affordable homes" were built - and they all have Sky dishes. That's three out of five Sky dishes across 247 properties. And no, in case you wondered, it isn't cabled and the ADSL broadband is barely quick enough to stream television.

They all have cars. In a way, I'm paying for them, yes. There's no "affordable home" for us. Where is the meritocracy? "We need to build affordable homes" - the phrase is comical in itself.

But then, having a meritocracy would involve dismantling the overwhelming majority of the welfare state and that's what our supposedly capitalist system relies on. A system so completely broken and tipping toward fascism it scares me.

Food banks are a sign of the malaise this country is in, and in my view a very significant and very worrying aspect.

[dances with sheeple]

I have no idea, do you? If you don't then how can you possibly make value judgements that basically say "It's their own fault", particularly when we sure as hell know that incomes of those at the bottom are being harshly squeezed via high inflation, falling to stagnant incomes, and unemployment.

Here's some links to the real life stories about those using food banks if you care to read, that tell a different story to your daily mailesque line.

http://birminghamcen...al-life-stories

http://www.trussellt...rg/real-stories

http://news.sky.com/...ty-at-food-bank

http://www.mirror.co...nessman-1481666

http://www.huffingto..._n_2338433.html

Do you want more?

Frankly, after reading those stories myself just now, your attitude about this topic simply disgusts me.

All I know is that the last pair of punters I saw on sky moaning about their leccy bills and being in "poverty" were a couple of fatties, they might eat shite, but they eat a lot of shite. I don`t know who qualifies for food banks, but for sure there will be people exploiting the chance of free food? The biggest poverty in the UK is a poverty of mind, too many think Corrie and JK reflect how they should be living? The tories think they are on a winner with all this nonsense, IMO they will fumble the election just like they fumble everything else. Watching Cameron at conference was like watching Spitting Image in the 80`s, the guy is a complete cliché, I don`t think he knows how much of a knob he looks.

[dances with sheeple]

I think he should mind his own business.

Food bank access is only given on referral from a social worker or health care professional on identifying a need. 3 days food is supplied.

These are charitable donations, operated by volunteers not taxpayer funded giveaways. What does it have to do with anyone else but the charity, the donors and the recipients.

Thanks for clearing that up, I thought you might just need to rub talc on your face and make your belly rumble to get some. I will wash my face now, and have a mince pie.

[Kurt Barlow]

Vile.

Food for foodbanks is provided as a voluntary act of charity by members of the public, and businesses. Supermarkets provide food that would otherwise go unsold.

I understand that you can't just stroll up and get food from a food bank, you have to get referred.

All of these Tory policies are negative - the poor will be beaten until they stop being poor.

This nonsense about 'making work pay' is more like 'making unemployment even more dreadful than working for a pittance'. The low-paid and unemployed are being cynically played against each other in a race to the bottom.

I find this trend disgusting and worrying.

+1

[Biggus]

The Tories look less in touch by the day. They are becoming caricatures. First they take away the safety net, then they criticize people for accepting charity because the Conservative party cast them into absolute poverty.

When that horrible specimen Duncan-Smith first announced his welfare reforms I was expecting a streamlined, cost effective, no-nonsense system of aid for the poor. Something like this

Instead he has produced a bullying, nasty, expensive and cretinous pile of slop.

[SarahBell]

The give a man a fish slogan has been behind several worthwhile campaigns.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heifer_International

Is the slogan only appropriate for people in lesser countries than ours?

Are you all really saying it's ok to 'feed a man a fish, day after day until when you run out of fish he's going to starve'?

The Trussel Trust say:

Only four per cent of people turned to foodbanks due to homelessness; 30% were referred due to benefit delay; 18% low income and 15% benefit changes (up from 11% in 2011-12). Other reasons included domestic violence, sickness, refused crisis loans, debt and unemployment. The majority of people turning to foodbanks were working age families.

Nearly 30% of people collecting food are there because they need help managing their money.

Have benefit delays got worse? I think they're probably quicker at sorting out problems now than they were 20-30 years ago.

[Tonkers]

The Tories look less in touch by the day. They are becoming caricatures. First they take away the safety net, then they criticize people for accepting charity because the Conservative party cast them into absolute poverty.

When that horrible specimen Duncan-Smith first announced his welfare reforms I was expecting a streamlined, cost effective, no-nonsense system of aid for the poor. Something like this

Instead he has produced a bullying, nasty, expensive and cretinous pile of slop.

Incredible really, how many years in the making and he has not addressed any of the issues at all.

[winkie]

....everyone has their weaknesses even the rich and powerful, some may say they have more than most.....I would rather give food to someone who has little and I know wastes money but is hungry, than to a satisfied, full government that I know to be rich but wastes money.

[byron78]

Have benefit delays got worse? I think they're probably quicker at sorting out problems now than they were 20-30 years ago.

Spectacularly worse.

I know of a couple of disabled/long-term sick (both genuine with chronic conditions) that have had benefits stopped by ATOS almost a year ago.

No money at all and they really are only being supported by charity (one attempted suicide in the summer).

There is an appeal process and 90% of people appealing the ATOS decision eventually win (or so they're told), but the system/courts are backed up with all the appeals and nobody knows when they'll be heard.

But yeah, it's only fat greedy lazy people with Sky TV using food banks whilst they stand there smoking and drinking lager innit.

If you don’t know what you're talking about I would honestly recommend not talking about it at all.

I'd be happy to refer you to a solicitor friend who deals with ATOS cases daily now. He'd be slightly appalled by your outlook and ignorance, but he'd be happy to let you know just how bad it is at the moment (not for him obviously - the utter clusterf*ck that is ATOS is costing billions in fees/specialists instead of just giving the money to people that need it in the first place).

Edited October 4, 2013 by byron78

[OnionTerror]

Spectacularly worse.

I know of a couple of disabled/long-term sick (both genuine with chronic conditions) that have had benefits stopped by ATOS almost a year ago.

No money at all and they really are only being supported by charity (one attempted suicide in the summer).

There is an appeal process and 90% of people appealing the ATOS decision eventually win (or so they're told), but the system/courts are backed up with all the appeals and nobody knows when they'll be heard.

But yeah, it's only fat greedy lazy people with Sky TV using food banks whilst they stand there smoking and drinking lager innit.

If you don’t know what you're talking about I would honestly recommend not talking about it at all.

I'd be happy to refer you to a solicitor friend who deals with ATOS cases daily now. He'd be slightly appalled by your outlook and ignorance, but he'd be happy to let you know just how bad it is at the moment (not for him obviously - the utter clusterf*ck that is ATOS is costing billions in fees/specialists instead of just giving the money to people that need it in the first place).

I volunteer for a food bank, and its usually the DWP that screw up someone's benefits, the earliest that most people get their benefits sorted, is two weeks.

[winkie]

I think he should mind his own business.

Food bank access is only given on referral from a social worker or health care professional on identifying a need. 3 days food is supplied.

These are charitable donations, operated by volunteers not taxpayer funded giveaways. What does it have to do with anyone else but the charity, the donors and the recipients.

Maybe he wants to brush it under the carpet and hope it goes away, not to be advertised, it gives the country and our social system a bad name, something not to broadcast to the masses when we are supposed to be getting back on track....most supermarkets I visit have a trolley for people to put something in if they choose, they can see it with their own eyes....there are many in our society who have depression, mental health and addiction problems....how great it would be if you could just teach people to manage their money and the problems would all be sorted.

[btl_hater]

Very patronising misinformed and ignorant post

I suspect Sarah Bell you consider yourself to be a Tory supporter, the thing is a real Tory would probbaly sneer down at you, that's the problem with the UK though, too many people think they are some middle class elite when in fact they are in reality working class, I bet you are Sarah Bell. There's nothing wrong with working hard and enjoying the benefits but some people get dealt a bad hand.

I don't want to assume anything about S. Bell, but you hit the nail on the head here with your general point. The majority of people I know (of) who 'vote conservative' are exactly the type of person you describe; think they are posh when they are anything but (basically they don't live in a council house). I can understand the aristocracy voting Tory, that really is in their own interests, but the droves of working class who vote for them I can never understand.

[doomed]

.how great it would be if you could just teach people to manage their money and the problems would all be sorted.

If people suffer no consequence for their poor choices they will not change their ways. We are in the perverse situation now where people are actually rewarded for their poor choices and penalised for making good ones.

[little fish]

.

I deliver food parcels one night a week for a local church. I was asked to do as I don't belong to the church and they felt that the uptake would be greater if anonymity could be assured. How they access need I don't know, I just get parcels and names and addresses. Some of what Sarah has said is correct. There are people receiving parcels who smoke and who drink. There are also people who pay out huge percentages of their incomes to pay day loan companies, credit cards etc. Some of them work full time, some on benefits, some retired and some are young single people on a mixture of income sources. Some have sky and big TV's and some don't. Really what I'm saying is that regardless of drinking, smoking or poor financial understanding, what I have noticed is that all these people have their own stories. I haven't heard all the stories as I rarely have time to stop for long and my run is getting longer every week, so talking isn't my priority. Some stories I have heard are soul destroying and some people are where they are because of poor decisions they have made.

What I have noticed is that, these are all deeply unhappy, stressful households. Many lack hope or any sense of purpose in their life's- they just can't see any way out of their current situation. Depression is common. Lack of hope is becoming embedded in families and extended to communities. The other thing that is clear, is that, regardless of why people are in this situation, none of them want to be there. All are embarrassed and ashamed.

I am sick, quite literally of the attitude shown by the government to the people of this country. The problems are too complex for sound bites and knee jerk reactionary policies. The constant belittling and blaming of the poorest and most vulnerable in society is a disgraceful tactic - all it does is reduce any hope that people have. People are generally resilient and can and will persevere if they have hope in something better for the future. If they don't have hope they have nothing to strive for.

This government is deeply damaging - they are trying to make the country stronger by crippling and dividing the people. How can that work?

rant over - apologies

.

[fluffy666]

I deliver food parcels one night a week for a local church. I was asked to do as I don't belong to the church and they felt that the uptake would be greater if anonymity could be assured. How they access need I don't know, I just get parcels and names and addresses. Some of what Sarah has said is correct. There are people receiving parcels who smoke and who drink. There are also people who pay out huge percentages of their incomes to pay day loan companies, credit cards etc. Some of them work full time, some on benefits, some retired and some are young single people on a mixture of income sources. Some have sky and big TV's and some don't. Really what I'm saying is that regardless of drinking, smoking or poor financial understanding, what I have noticed is that all these people have their own stories. I haven't heard all the stories as I rarely have time to stop for long and my run is getting longer every week, so talking isn't my priority. Some stories I have heard are soul destroying and some people are where they are because of poor decisions they have made.

What I have noticed is that, these are all deeply unhappy, stressful households. Many lack hope or any sense of purpose in their life's- they just can't see any way out of their current situation. Depression is common. Lack of hope is becoming embedded in families and extended to communities. The other thing that is clear, is that, regardless of why people are in this situation, none of them want to be there. All are embarrassed and ashamed.

I am sick, quite literally of the attitude shown by the government to the people of this country. The problems are too complex for sound bites and knee jerk reactionary policies. The constant belittling and blaming of the poorest and most vulnerable in society is a disgraceful tactic - all it does is reduce any hope that people have. People are generally resilient and can and will persevere if they have hope in something better for the future. If they don't have hope they have nothing to strive for.

This government is deeply damaging - they are trying to make the country stronger by crippling and dividing the people. How can that work?

rant over - apologies

Try googling '1930s means test' to see where it goes.

In which families were forced to sell anything of value in their house - inspectors would come around and poke their nose everywhere - before qualifying for the dole. No doubt some people would approve of this, mostly those who profess to be anti-government-interference. The fact that the country is practically overflowing with manufactured stuff and electronic goods nowadays makes it worse.

I think that it needs to be reiterated...

The housing shortage is a political choice.

High energy prices are a political choice.

Mass unemployment is a political choice.

It takes a lot of ongoing propaganda to convince people that somehow our situation is inevitable, and that despite all the gains in technology, productivity and output over the past 4 decades, somehow none of this can end up in the hands of the less well off. Yet people believe it.

[winkie]

If people suffer no consequence for their poor choices they will not change their ways. We are in the perverse situation now where people are actually rewarded for their poor choices and penalised for making good ones.

...some people have very few or no choices because they don't have the capacity or ability to make choices let alone good choices.......so the person collecting rents because the disadvantaged exist don't want to do away with them, they are their livelihood, they can feel entitled to drink, smoke, eat and shop in the finest places because they are deserving and smug because they made good choices only because they had more choices to choose from, and if the choice was bad they get a second or third chance at playing the game......some are not that fortunate.