longgone Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 12 minutes ago, modavid said: You would be extremely lucky if their crap houses last half the mortgage term! They build them to last atleast 2 years - most new houses come with a 10year NHBC guarantee but the builder is on the hook for the first 2 years only. even the crap they build will last more than 2 years. i would not buy one personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rantnrave Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 'New-build homes not fire safe', BBC investigation finds https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48113301 Houses developed by Persimmon Homes and Bellway Homes have potentially dangerous fire safety issues, BBC Watchdog Live has found. New-builds constructed by the firms were sold with missing or incorrectly installed fire barriers, which are designed to inhibit the spread of fire. In some cases, it's thought a lack of fire barriers contributed to the spread of fires that have destroyed homes. Persimmon Homes and Bellway Homes both said they were addressing the issue. Building Regulations require that by law new homes are built with fire protection measures to delay the spread of fire and allow crucial time for escape. In many new builds, particularly timber-framed buildings, fire barriers are a vital part of this fire protection. The barriers are used to form a complete seal between different areas of a home, and without them, experts say, fire and smoke can spread five to ten times faster. "A comparison is if you were to buy a new car and you ultimately found that it didn't have an airbag in it […] It's an integral safety feature within the home," said industry expert Andrew Mellor. Responsibility for ensuring that buildings are compliant with Building Regulations ultimately lies with the house builder. In the cases the BBC has uncovered, serious breaches have gone undetected during construction, leaving homes and lives potentially at risk if fire breaks out. 'It was engulfed in flames' Sarah Dennis is a resident at the Persimmon Homes Greenacres development in Exeter, where, in April 2018, a fire started by a cigarette dropped at ground level spread up to the roof of a house, and then to the adjacent properties. "Neighbours asked if we could smell smoke. Went inside to check on the kids, there was smoke in the bedroom, Firemen arrived within a couple of minutes. Just a bit of smoke coming from the back and the next minute it was engulfed in flames," she said. Subsequent investigations by Persimmon Homes found missing fire barriers at 37% of homes on the Greenacres estate. This triggered a huge inspection programme of thousands of homes across the South West region, where more than 650 homes were found to have missing or incorrectly installed fire barriers. Some of these issues have not yet been rectified - and some homes have still not been inspected. Outside the South West, in Coventry, a Persimmon Homes building containing some 48 apartments was evacuated in 2018, following the discovery of a number of defects including missing fire barriers. Some residents are still living in temporary accommodation while retrofitting and other works are carried out. Persimmon Homes confirmed that, since the issues in the South West came to light in 2018, it has written to 3200 home owners in the region, and has set up a "dedicated team" to carry out inspections. It said that, in total, 2700 properties have been inspected, and remedial work has been carried out at 679 homes. The company said sample checks were also being conducted nationwide, saying "if these inspections indicate that we need to inspect every timber frame property then we will do so." "This should not have happened and we would like to apologise to all affected homeowners and assure them that we are doing everything we can to rectify the issue swiftly," it added. Bellway Homes problems BBC Watchdog Live also uncovered potentially dangerous fire safety issues in developments in Kent and West Lothian built by Bellway Homes. In 2015, a fire took hold in a block of Bellway Homes flats in Canterbury, Kent, and spread through dozens of properties, destroying or damaging 45 of them. Subsequent inspections highlighted concerns over fire stopping in the wall cavities. Residents at the Old Tannery development have since been moved out while "improvement works" to address these fire safety issues are carried out at their homes. In Scotland, BBC Watchdog Live sent its own expert surveyor to a new build Bellway Homes development in West Lothian, to examine the fire protection at four houses, after concerns were raised by one resident whose house had previously been found to have inadequate fire barriers. Surveyor and expert witness Greig Adams, who carried out the testing, found poorly fitted fire barriers at all four properties, with voids and gaps around them that would prevent them stopping fire from spreading. He said that the homes are not fire safe: "What we've unfortunately found is that there are fire breach issues in every house we've looked at. It's a legal requirement that the cavity barriers are to be there. It's not optional- and with good reason: it saves lives" Bellway Homes said it was "committed to improvement". "Mandatory training on many subjects, including fire stopping, has been introduced for all applicable construction staff and we remain committed to building quality homes in accordance with all relevant regulation," it added. Bellway Home also said that until last week, it was only aware of one property on the development in West Lothian where concerns with cavity barriers had been raised. "As a responsible builder, Bellway takes our customer's safety extremely seriously and we will investigate and address any raised concerns immediately, where there is perceived to be an imminent danger to persons or property," it said. It said that the investigation into the fire at the Old Tannery in Kent was "inconclusive"- and that, following the fire, "further remedial works were subsequently identified" at the development, which it is working closely with the National House-Building Council to complete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted May 1, 2019 Share Posted May 1, 2019 (edited) "A comparison is if you were to buy a new car and you ultimately found that it didn't have an airbag in it […] " So something I'd be fairly happy to choose? There are plenty of reasons I wouldn't want to live in a newbuild but the cry of "safety" has cried wolf so often that that isn't one of them. Edited May 1, 2019 by Riedquat Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will! Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 BBC News: Builder Persimmon lacks minimum house standards, report finds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habeas Domus Posted December 17, 2019 Share Posted December 17, 2019 If only there was some kind of professional able to properly inspect and evaluate a house before you commit to spending a life changing amount of money on it. Oh well, I guess that's just a pipe dream. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpg50000 Posted December 18, 2019 Share Posted December 18, 2019 9 hours ago, Ghostly said: Surveyors do f all for the most part, especially on a new build (ask me how I know). They tell you what anyone with functional eyes could tell you. Do tell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 problem is to get a decent inspection you have to take up carpet, get under the floors, look at walls (removing wall-paper) etc etc it would be very expensive, but to be honest even if it was £2,000 for the biggest purchase of my life i would probably pay it. and some things just cant be seen, how well is a house built? bit hard to tell. generally the logic is that if its stood for 100 years, it will probably stand for the next 100 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/man-whose-home-had-hundreds-23453564 And so it begins. Theyll be rebuilding loads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rb391 Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 3 hours ago, spyguy said: https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/man-whose-home-had-hundreds-23453564 And so it begins. Theyll be rebuilding loads. He’s jumped through hoops just to get to the stage of them doing actually doing something about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 7 hours ago, rb391 said: He’s jumped through hoops just to get to the stage of them doing actually doing something about it. And now lawyers have a precedent of a Permisson hous that was sooo badly built that it needed rebuilding. The next lot will have less hoops to jump thru. And the building sruvtors will know they have been rumbled as shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saving For a Space Ship Posted February 8, 2021 Share Posted February 8, 2021 The man who got Persimmon to rebuild his new house because the walls were so bad https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/man-who-persimmon-rebuild-new-19757458 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Locke Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 On 08/02/2021 at 07:55, Saving For a Space Ship said: The man who got Persimmon to rebuild his new house because the walls were so bad https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/man-who-persimmon-rebuild-new-19757458 ...what? So the brick "wall" is mere cladding? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 No, the new builds these days are SIPS wooden panels, so it's the timber frame that holds the roof and floors up. The outside brick is just the outside skin. It could be anything.. brick, wooden cladinging, tile, or stone in my case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 8 minutes ago, Jason said: No, the new builds these days are SIPS wooden panels, so it's the timber frame that holds the roof and floors up. The outside brick is just the outside skin. It could be anything.. brick, wooden cladinging, tile, or stone in my case. Makes me glad I live in an old house rather than an oversized garden shed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LumpHammer Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Locke said: ...what? So the brick "wall" is mere cladding? Traditionally (40-50 years) the inner leaf is blockwork and provides the supporting element, the brick outer is mostly aesthetic although it provides some buttressing, the inner and outer leaf are linked with stainless wall ties. Persimmon and other house builders are using SIPS panels in place of the blockwork as Jason has said but it's only the large scale of their business which allows it, the small and medium scale builders are mostly using the traditional way. The advantage of SIPS is primarily cost - a reduction in on-site skilled labor and quicker build time where multiple trades can be run in parallel as opposed to traditional build which is sequential up to a later stage. Persimmon have a separate business called Space4 who manufacture the SIPS panels used in their homes, this is a bit old but describes the construction: https://www.persimmonhomes.com/corporate/media/298539/space4-presentation-3rd-november-16.pdf The exterior finish in the article is poor but sadly common, normally a medium to large developer will get the build out of the ground to DPC with their own people who are employed directly and are usually highly skilled and get it spot-on, after that developer hands over to contractors who's interest is to get it up in the shortest possible time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 Most houses are going to the SIPS building method, unless it's a bespoke design. Me and the Mrs are applying for a self build plot (from the council, like the Graven Hill project but smaller) and I will be going down the SIPS route. If you want cost control, and a simple build that is the only cost effective route we would consider - we don't have the budget for those overruns like on Grand Designs. But it's still a long shot we would be allocated a plot - there's huge demand! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LumpHammer Posted February 17, 2021 Share Posted February 17, 2021 That sounds like a great project, all the best to you in getting a plot. I will take your word on future trends, I don't know. Currently around me all but the larger developments are using brick / block but there is no reason why SIPS couldn't be used. The stories of problems in SIPS built houses appear to be general quality issues that would also affect a traditional build although I'd imagine the problems might manifest themselves sooner. In housing developments the reduction in build cost has little chance of being passed on to the buyers as it's not a competitive market and my perception is that many buyers have little interest in / knowledge of how the house is built regardless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hurlerontheditch Posted September 10, 2021 Share Posted September 10, 2021 Quote Persimmon sold me four-bed home but it only has three - now it refuses to fix it A homeowner claims he has been left out of pocket by £20,000 after a developer sold him a four-bedroom house that actually only had three bedrooms. The man, who is using the name John Smith to protect his identity, 30, bought a new house from developer Persimmon on October 31, 2019. A Persimmon brochure advertised the Birmingham property as a "four-bedroom home", and the house was priced with that in mind. But Smith claims the fourth bedroom was suspiciously small, measuring just 3.12 x 2.04 metres. Persimmon sold me four-bed home but it only has three - now it refuses to fix it (msn.com) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted September 10, 2021 Share Posted September 10, 2021 27 minutes ago, hurlerontheditch said: Persimmon sold me four-bed home but it only has three - now it refuses to fix it (msn.com) 3x2 metres is a perfectly passable 'spare' bedroom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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