What Is Wrong With My Friend's Wife?

[ccc]

Literally?

[swissy_fit]

Gardner, I didn't add anything to what has been said for your situation because it has all been said.

Best of luck, I feel for you.

A slow increase in quiet assertiveness will probably help if you can do it. Every time you try to stop behaviour you've "encouraged" before is going to be a battle though.

I recommend a trip to a good lawyer for advice, as well.

[little fish]

She is very controlling - 'my way or the highway' type though she doesn't recognise that. She regularly pleads with him saying things like 'we have to agree on such and such' but ignores his opinion and basically says they have to agree on her way. Her idea of communication is her telling him what to do and him agreeing.

She will constantly break her own rules whenever she likes - eg the 7:30 bedtime - though woe bedtide him if he breaks a rule.

She will also constantly undermine him in front of the kids even when he is applying one of her imposed rules. He never does the same to her.

She is also very critical of him and often compares him to other husbands. Two of the most frequent subjects of comparison now have failed marriages though when he points out the affairs etc these 'perfect' husbands were having there is no acknowledgement that those comparisons weren't exactly well founded.

What is the way forward for him?

Is this just normal burd behaviour.

Oh she once took a kitchen knife out whilst having one of these episodes and held it to her stomach making sort of threats to stab herself. She did this in front if the two young children (3 and 5 at the time).

Please tell my friend that this isn't unusual behaviour in a female. I don't think he wants to believe he's married a nutter.

Gardiner, you have taken powerful steps to ensure your own grounding and confidence and now seem ready to address the larger issues affecting your life, mainly that of your wife's behaviour and it's effects on your family. The practicalities of telling people face to face is hard. To get the right help you need to be honest about the situation and there are instances involving the children that may raise alarm bells. Admitting anything that seems 'out of the ordinary' within a family to a professional invites judgements to be made - and these may not always coincide with your view of the situation. To hurdle any uncomfortableness about this just focus on how your children may see the situation. A quick google of 'through the eyes of a child + domestic violence' will give you a clearer understanding of how your children may be feeling and reacting to the tension in the house. Children miss very little. Focus on this. You sound strong and determined enough to get through this - and your children need you to. Things can and do frequently change for the better.

Good luck...

Seeing a private doctor for referrals/advice is much quicker than anything on the NHS if that's an option.

[the gardener]

That's the absolute worst thing. If you can get evidence of the self harm and threats to self harm that will help your case enormously though. Has anyone else ever witnessed it? Any contemporaneous account you can get written up, especially by someone with no obvious bias to either partner will help. If you can get that in some form, my advice would then be to take it to a lawyer and get an opinion as to how that would play out in custody proceedings. If you do decide to take the leap, the first thing you should do is go to court to get an injunction to prevent her taking the kids out the country. If you can get that, then there's a reasonable, but not 100% chance, that she'd be stopped at the border if she tried to go.

I've no doubt I could get an injunction to stop any unauthorised kidnapping but its the legalized kidnapping that will take place sanctioned via the family courts that is the issue. At any moment she can decide to divorce me then I won't be seeing much of my children. I'll get holiday access only. Eventually that will diminish due to the children not wanting to be dragged to the UK every holiday - they won't be able to form proper friendships in their new country if they have to leave every school holiday.

Add a new man to the picture and I'm history regarding access to my children.

It's a nightmare.

[Tankus]

Sounds to me like she was prepared to give you one last chance and you blew it. Simple as that.

+1...turns up drunk as ****** ....probably in the hope of..!... Plus,when found to be not in , the deliberate wind up of the neighbour , you know she has issues with as an investment in future agro for her ,...... were you hoping for a kick off with him , bit of door step drama ?.

...quality iceing .....

As for OP , knife involved !!!! ,your already beyond just chatting to people on the internet.

[the gardener]

And vice versa of course. A highly emotional siutation.

Sorry but the reality is that it is almost always a she. You can probably count on the fingers of one hand cases where it is a he.

[The Masked Tulip]

I've no doubt I could get an injunction to stop any unauthorised kidnapping but its the legalized kidnapping that will take place sanctioned via the family courts that is the issue. At any moment she can decide to divorce me then I won't be seeing much of my children. I'll get holiday access only. Eventually that will diminish due to the children not wanting to be dragged to the UK every holiday - they won't be able to form proper friendships in their new country if they have to leave every school holiday.

Add a new man to the picture and I'm history regarding access to my children.

It's a nightmare.

I do know of a chap who married a woman and had two children with her. About 7 or 8 years into the marriage she started becoming abusive to him and ended up attacking him in front of people - the frying pan on head, waving kitchen knife, etc.

She then ran off with the husband of friends of theirs and would only return to the home to hurl abuse and demand money/half the house, etc.

Divorce proceedings begun and the husband was petrified of losing his kids and the home. But he got a good solicitor and built up lots of evidence. He got custody of the kids and the house until the kids were 18. In fact, the court banned the wife from coming near him and the children.

Extreme example perhaps but the courts don't always find in favour of the mother.

[MrPin]

I do know of a chap who married a woman and had two children with her. About 7 or 8 years into the marriage she started becoming abusive to him and ended up attacking him in front of people - the frying pan on head, waving kitchen knife, etc.

Extreme example perhaps but the courts don't always find in favour of the mother.

I'd prefer not to have a relationship where I have to wear a hard hat and a flack jacket!

Sounds like the "Law" worked for once!

[ccc]

+1...turns up drunk as ****** ....probably in the hope of..!... Plus,when found to be not in , the deliberate wind up of the neighbour , you know she has issues with as an investment in future agro for her ,...... were you hoping for a kick off with him , bit of door step drama ?.

...quality iceing .....

As for OP , knife involved !!!! ,your already beyond just chatting to people on the internet.

Eh no !! I was there i think i should know

Ps this neighbour has given her no end of hassle. Flood caused from his flat. Pumps out his music at ridiculous levels. And the best bit - left her a note telling her to stop her pals smoking in her own kitchen and also to stop cooking curry as he can apparently smell it in his own flat Yes you read that correctly.

So no doubt i pressed a few other peoples buzzers as well. However they were probably reasonable people who realised its just some drunk person and it won't last long. Which it didn't.

I stay on a busy street. I probably get this at least once every two weeks. Its annoying but really not the end of the world.

She should be more worried that her neighbour is sending abusive messages during the night. I didn't get in past the buzzer. He never spoke to me either or came downstairs. There is also no peep hole or way to see who is outside.

So frankly - he must have just assumed it was someone trying to get into her place - because he had absolutely no way of knowing for sure.

What if i had just been some random walking past who decided to press lots of buttons for a laugh ? Gonna send more abusive messages based on guesswork ? Pretty out of order imo.

I was not storing up any future trouble for her. That's not my style. In fact - are you her ?

[dances with sheeple]

er....no

It was never accepted and would land the offender on an ABH charge if not common assault.

An assault to the face or head is very different to a smack on the rump.

So you are saying that it wasn`t commonly accepted that you would get a good hiding off your mum or dad for serious infractions by thousands of young people in the 70`s? I am talking about accepted by society, not the law. It used to be considered OK by many people to have six or more pints and drive the car.

[dances with sheeple]

Wrong place, wrong thread, wrong people, tell your " friend " to seek professional advice .

Yes.

[ccc]

So you are saying that it wasn`t commonly accepted that you would get a good hiding off your mum or dad for serious infractions by thousands of young people in the 70`s? I am talking about accepted by society, not the law. It used to be considered OK by many people to have six or more pints and drive the car.

You are probably right. Teachers in school used to hit children with sticks ffs

[Guest TheBlueCat]

I've no doubt I could get an injunction to stop any unauthorised kidnapping but its the legalized kidnapping that will take place sanctioned via the family courts that is the issue. At any moment she can decide to divorce me then I won't be seeing much of my children. I'll get holiday access only. Eventually that will diminish due to the children not wanting to be dragged to the UK every holiday - they won't be able to form proper friendships in their new country if they have to leave every school holiday.

Add a new man to the picture and I'm history regarding access to my children.

It's a nightmare.

Don't lose hope, as TMT says the courts don't always side with the mother, especially when there's strong evidence of dangerous behaviour. Go and talk to a lawyer with experience in the family courts, at least then you'll know where you stand. There isn't really a legalised kidnapping option as courts will usually require the parent with custody to live within a certain distance of an agreed location.

[dances with sheeple]

You are probably right. Teachers in school used to hit children with sticks ffs

PE teachers were particularly abusive I seem to remember, got footballs kicked at me full force for talking at the back of the class, and I`m pretty sure I remember someone getting kicked hard up the **** or on the legs for giving back chat to one of them, in front of a whole class no attempt to hide it. Stuff like that would mean immediate sacking nowadays. The two particular PE teachers who did this used to say to the older guys that if they had a problem they could have a square go out of school hours any time they wanted to arrange it! I heard that one year a couple of guys who were pretty hard got their leaving forms signed and went round the back of a changing room or something in a sports field and kicked f*uck out of the two teachers

[ccc]

Sounds class.

One day at my school some scumbag came into school for some reason. Can't remember why.

This big Chinese bloke in our school went outside to confront him with a meat cleaver he got from the home economics room.

But a wee history teaches told him to go back in - and went outside himself and had a square go with the bloke. He did a bit of boxing whilst in the army apparently. Quality day of entertainment and school gossip.

[Bloo Loo]

So you are saying that it wasn`t commonly accepted that you would get a good hiding off your mum or dad for serious infractions by thousands of young people in the 70`s? I am talking about accepted by society, not the law. It used to be considered OK by many people to have six or more pints and drive the car.

not round my way

[swissy_fit]

Eh no !! I was there i think i should know

Ps this neighbour has given her no end of hassle. Flood caused from his flat. Pumps out his music at ridiculous levels. And the best bit - left her a note telling her to stop her pals smoking in her own kitchen and also to stop cooking curry as he can apparently smell it in his own flat Yes you read that correctly.

So no doubt i pressed a few other peoples buzzers as well. However they were probably reasonable people who realised its just some drunk person and it won't last long. Which it didn't.

I stay on a busy street. I probably get this at least once every two weeks. Its annoying but really not the end of the world.

She should be more worried that her neighbour is sending abusive messages during the night. I didn't get in past the buzzer. He never spoke to me either or came downstairs. There is also no peep hole or way to see who is outside.

So frankly - he must have just assumed it was someone trying to get into her place - because he had absolutely no way of knowing for sure.

What if i had just been some random walking past who decided to press lots of buttons for a laugh ? Gonna send more abusive messages based on guesswork ? Pretty out of order imo.

I was not storing up any future trouble for her. That's not my style. In fact - are you her ?

Has she "done" the neighbour in the past?

[Snafu]

I genuinely thought it was indeed a friend of the OP.

[ccc]

Has she "done" the neighbour in the past?

Don't think so - but you never know. I would seriously doubt it though as she really can't stand the bloke - been causing her no end of hassle . Which is why i was pretty surprised at her going off on one because he was the one being annoyed for once. Karma and all.

Its the whole people in glass houses scenario. When she moved into her previous flat she got an ASBO there on the very first day ! Yes you read that correct again. Had a huge housewarming apparently and caused so much mayhem the police were called a few times and gave her one of these.

So the fact the same person is giving me grief - because i was a bit drunk and pressed a few wrong buzzers one night - is frankly taking the piss.

It would be like me sitting in a boozer having sunk 15 pints and telling the bloke next to me he drinks too much.

[The Masked Tulip]

I genuinely thought it was indeed a friend of the OP.

What is Santa bringing you next week?

[finallysold]

OP, your wife seems to have mental issues and control issues. how was she when you were dating/ engaged etc. did she hide these tendencies or did you just ignore these red flags because you were in love. also you mention that you still love her. are you sure you are not in love with what she once was. she frankly seems pretty nasty. essentially she is a control freak with lots of insecurity issues. so she tries to control your every move. but when you cede control to her, her innate female nature is disgusted by your weakness too.

you are scared of angering your wife and all your interactions are probably engineered towards keeping the peace. you have been beaten down by her and the legal system and you feel unable to act decisively. but surely you realise that your kids will be damaged if she becomes a sole parent. also is there not a law preventing parents from emigrating without express consent of the other parent.

you really need to shed your despondency (very tough but doable) and be really proactive in terms of finding out about your rights. the legal system is highly biased towards mothers but you have a woman here who is showing more and more signs of being a danger to herself and probably her children as well.

everytime she plays up, your tensions levels rise and she uses your need for peace to control you. get a couple of voice activated recorders and start using them religiously. they have a long recording time and you can use them to protect yourself at a pinch against false allegations. next time she plays up with a knife, whip out your smart phone and start recording it if you are upto it and can handle her barrage. otherwise call 999 and inform that your wife is suicidal. each time she plays up there is a record. when she hits the kids and leaves a mark, take a photo and document it.

of course she will soon catch on to what you are doing. hence you need to be really ready with all the legal stuff. does she work,

i think a really forum to get some practical advice is the 911 section in Married man sex life (MMSL) forums. http://marriedmansexlife.vanillaforums.com/ . Although it is US based, there are quite a few brits there and they will be able to help you more. read the MMSL book as well to get a better idea of marriage dynamics and male-female interaction.

you have done well to emerge from your depression problems, that should give you strength to tackle your marital issues as well.

[mikthe20]

Will just chuck this in as it might be familiar to the OP (and ccc!). These are things they do that make you think you're going crazy. Mostly taken from Wikipedia.

Codependency: [A great book about people with BDP is called "I hate you, don't leave me" - says it all]. Codependency is defined as a psychological condition or a relationship in which a person is controlled or manipulated by another who is affected with a pathological condition (typically narcissism or drug addiction); and in broader terms, it refers to the dependence on the needs of, or control of, another. It also often involves placing a lower priority on one's own needs, while being excessively preoccupied with the needs of others. Codependency can occur in any type of relationship, including family, work, friendship, and also romantic, peer or community relationships. Codependency may also be characterized by denial, low self-esteem, excessive compliance, or control patterns. Narcissists are considered to be natural magnets for the codependent.

Gaslighting: [you may have just seen here hit your child, but she will absolutely deny it just happened] is a form of mental abuse in which false information is presented with the intent of making a victim doubt his or her own memory, perception and sanity. Instances may range simply from the denial by an abuser that previous abusive incidents ever occurred, up to the staging of bizarre events by the abuser with the intention of disorienting the victim. The term "gaslighting" comes from the play Gas Light and its film adaptations. The term is now also used in clinical and research literature.

Projection: [she accuses you of doing the things she is guilty of- shouting, bullying, having an affair - she is actually doing those things herself. This is very useful as she is telling you what she is up to - in her world if she has told you then she can legitimately get on with doing it. eg. telling you the EX-husbands of friends are better men than you is hinting she wants an ex husband too! - sorry]. A defence mechanism in which a person unconsciously rejects his or her own unacceptable attributes by ascribing them to objects or persons in the outside world. For example, a person who is rude may accuse other people of being rude.

Splitting: [you are either perfect or a complete *******, nothing in between] is a relatively common defense mechanism for people with borderline personality disorder. One of the DSM IV-TR criteria for this disorder is a description of splitting: "a pattern of unstable and intense interpersonal relationships characterized by alternating between extremes of idealization and devaluation". In psychoanalytic theory, people with borderline personality disorder are not able to integrate the good and bad images of both self and others, resulting in a bad representation which dominates the good representation. This school hypothesizes that they consequently experience love and sexuality in perverse and violent qualities which they cannot integrate with the tender, intimate side of relationships.

Cognitive Dissonance: [test - does she get angry with you when she does something wrong, rather than apologise?] A psychological term for the discomfort that most people feel when they encounter information which contradicts their existing set of beliefs or values. People who suffer from personality disorders often experience cognitive dissonance when they are confronted with evidence that their actions have hurt others or have contradicted their stated morals.

Dissociation: [they effecively don't recognise it's them doing harm! Therefore they don't have to feel guilt or take responsilibilty] In psychology, the term dissociation describes a wide array of experiences from mild detachment from immediate surroundings to more severe detachment from physical and emotional experience. The major characteristic of all dissociative phenomena involves a detachment from reality – rather than a loss of reality as in psychosis. Dissociative experiences are further characterized by the varied maladaptive mental constructions of an individual's natural imaginative capacit.

Hoovering: [ccc, pay attention here - they use sex a lot for this] Hoover is a metaphor taken from the popular brand of vacuum cleaners, to describe how an abuse victim trying to assert their own rights by leaving or limiting contact in a dysfunctional relationship, gets "sucked back in" when the perpetrator temporarily exhibits improved or desirable behavior.

Lots more of course, but they are all acts to watch out for. I found it really useful to learn abou these as it enabled me to build an explanation of my ex's behaviour and deal with it.

These people lack empathy - how can a mother repeatedly hit her own children? If me or my kids were sick my ex used to get offended, as if we were doing it to have a go at her. Kids were sick, she'd scream "why are you doing this to me?"!! They also have extremely low self-esteem but a high sense of entitlement, and are absolutely terrified of abandonment (which is IME the weakness you can use against them) and of their true nature being made public. Fundamentally, they hate themselves. They have the maturity of teenage kids and must be treated similarly - boundaries must be set or otherwise they will forever push further and further for complete and utter control and humiliation of their targets.

[ccc]

Thanks for that Mik.

6 of those 7 ring very loud bells.

[JoeDavola]

Bloody hell, that sounds like every girl I've got involved with over the past 2 years.

I must be attracted to borderline ladies.

[Si1]

It took me dating a girl who displayed attributes of borderline or narcissism, it took this for me to ask myself why I opened myself up so comfortably for such abuse

That allowed me to realise that my dad is a verbally abusive narcissist of some description, and certainly fits the deliberate belittling, devaluing etc tendencies. In getting involved with a girl like that I was just replaying my abusive relationship with my dad