spyguy Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Democorruptcy said: PAYE workers don't know the secret handshake that gets those that do, PFI deals. Someone has to pay: For example, while the capital cost of rebuilding Calderdale Royal Hospital in Yorkshire is £64.6m, the scheme will end up costing Calderdale and Huddersfield NHS Foundation Trust a total of £773.2m. Similarly, the cost of building the new Walsgrave district general hospital in Coventry will jump from an initial £379m to an eventual £4bn. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2012/jul/05/pfi-cost-300bn No secret handshake required. Just an innumerate, one eyed scots tnuc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nome Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 And yet still the VAST majority of younger folks are far more concerned with LGBT "issues" , wimmins rights, the plight of "refugees" etc etc They're currently far too busy on their twitter echo chamber of irrelevance defending the new Dr Who from all the "vile sexist misogynistic attacks" or calling for the rights of a schoolgirl who has declared herself "pansexual" to be recognised. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
durhamborn Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, nome said: And yet still the VAST majority of younger folks are far more concerned with LGBT "issues" , wimmins rights, the plight of "refugees" etc etc They're currently far too busy on their twitter echo chamber of irrelevance defending the new Dr Who from all the "vile sexist misogynistic attacks" or calling for the rights of a schoolgirl who has declared herself "pansexual" to be recognised. Yes its even worse the younger you are.It gets me as im 46,but at least i was able to buy a house years ago.People 30 might not of been so lucky so have the double hit.Paying off huge mortgages so unable to save enough capital to retire early.Of course as we all know thats the plan.The one thing that stands in the way is people getting an inheritance.That can bridge the gap and see them retire.No doubt the government will do everything possible to cut off that as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talking Monkey Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 3 hours ago, Social Justice League said: Why bother working hard all your life to pay loads of tax and buy loads of consumerist tat. New build houses fall into this bracket too. Our whole consumerist society is a pile of old sh**e. Using up the worlds resources as quickly as possible isn't something to aspire to imo. Those new builds will be pretty dilapidated in 20 years time, they're just not built to last Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 2 hours ago, Save me from the madness! said: I look on it as this is the Government failing to plan and coming up with a reactive solution that actually won't achieve what they want, much like the student loans (passing the cost onto students, but then it turns out so few will ever pay off the loan leaving the state to pick up a big bill). Yes there are people who make it all the way to the end of their careers in high paying jobs, but so many don't. Redundancy in your 50s and then a big struggle to get a similar level of job. Ill health can strike at an increasingly likely rate as age goes up. Just being mentally worn out from it all can be a big contributor. I think if we fast forward there will be a growing number of 60+ year olds on incapacity benefit, job seekers and a massive need to introduce some other benefit stop a massive social disaster unfolding. Being under 40 I am affected by this, but I look at if that if it screws me over in my fortunate position, there will be mass protests from the majority of less well off peers by that age. You might remember Brown saying 'prudent' the odd time. What he meant was blowing a massive credit bubble, dounbling the public sector, paying people on benefit 30k, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adarmo Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Why are they waiting until 2044? Do it now and at least make some of the boomers cover their own costs. When the old age pension was first introduced retirement age was actually above the average life expectancy. Now it's viewed as a right to have a 20 year end of life holiday funded by the younger generation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Si1 said: So pre boomers got screwed, and post boomers got screwed. To help the boomers. Again. Yep. Paternal GPs dud not make it past 65. Maternal lived till late 80s but worked til 70s - they had to. Parents are too old to be boomers byt Mum never worked more than 15h week. Dad started work at 16, army two years, 10 years pissing around on parttim, house bought by maternal gps - he could not get a mortgage, started work when married to pay gps back, lasted 12 years, laid off never bothered working again, effectivly retiring in late 40s. Current in his 3rddecade of retirement, all on about 20 years of work. Parents get 3 times what my gos got- free tv, winter fuel, bus pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, adarmo said: Why are they waiting until 2044? Do it now and at least make some of the boomers cover their own costs. When the old age pension was first introduced retirement age was actually above the average life expectancy. Now it's viewed as a right to have a 20 year end of life holiday funded by the younger generation. We did, but they spent it, same as they did with the contributions of the generation before us, who's retirement we had to fund. Governments do that . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Hun Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Brexit means Brexit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talking Monkey Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 3 hours ago, Fatmanfilms said: Since you only need 35 years of contributions, no point unless you intend to retire early. From age 16 if your studying you get credits so only 30 years of work needed if you did A levels & then got a degree. Do A levels and degree count towards the 35 years, I didn't know that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, Talking Monkey said: Do A levels and degree count towards the 35 years, I didn't know that I don't know but sprogging does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talking Monkey Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 3 hours ago, Calcutta said: The simple solution is to hang around here as long as you have to, once the kids are grown up take every penny you've got and go on the mother of all benders. Year or so on the crack in South America, couple of years smashing whores across Asia, then come back here penniless and too f**ked to work again. Go on the sick, get the HB to pay off some schmuck BTLers mortgage for you and wait for wonga or provident to be stupid enough to 'loan' you a couple of grand they'll never see again to go and relive the glory days for a few weeks. Outstanding advice, absolutely outstanding. I shall begin planning immediately Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bear.getting.old Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 5 hours ago, TwoTearsInABucket said: This will not be the end of it. The changes I mean. It might well be the start of the end of the state pension. At the very least they will make it needs based. If you are under 45, forget about a state pension. Do not calculate that into your plans. There is no way they can axe the state pension without there being riots and the party responsible for it unelectable. They wouldn't dare. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Forget the pension.......WHO WILL PAY THE RENTS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wish I could afford one Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, bear.getting.old said: There is no way they can axe the state pension without there being riots and the party responsible for it unelectable. They wouldn't dare. Democracy is a mob mentality. Providing you look after the mob (they keep the State Pension) you can take as much as you like from 'the rich' (they lose the pension through means testing). It's why I'm planning on none. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormymonday_2011 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) 4 hours ago, dpg50000 said: Erm, my parents get something like £200 State pension, which I gather is the current max of ~ £160 plus a £40 topup (no idea what that's for). Edit to add - they retired prior to 2016. They are a married couple which effects the amount as it covers 2 people and they may have paid into SERPS as well which would increase the amount My Mum is a Widow she gets the basic single persons state pension If you retired before 2016 it is £122.30. It is here in black and white on the government web site if you want to check it https://www.gov.uk/state-pension/overview My Dad got nothing for his contributions as he died before retirement age. Edited July 19, 2017 by stormymonday_2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 12 minutes ago, bear.getting.old said: There is no way they can axe the state pension without there being riots and the party responsible for it unelectable. They wouldn't dare. what if all the parties remove it. vote who you like you still wont get it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormymonday_2011 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) 22 minutes ago, bear.getting.old said: There is no way they can axe the state pension without there being riots and the party responsible for it unelectable. They wouldn't dare. No politician is going to be so daft as to openly default since their racket requires keeping the taxpayers paying money in with promises of jam tomorrow. Whose going to bail out the banks etc if people decide that paying taxes and NIC is for suckers. They are going to do it by more oblique means. These changes come into effect in 2037 which is way, way over the electoral horizon . BTW for those who think that the State Pension is backed by nothing more than fresh air and promises what do you think is behind the all other classes of savings such as ISAs, bank deposits etc. The reality is that the latter are just as likely to be reneged on as the former. Edited July 19, 2017 by stormymonday_2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormymonday_2011 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) 17 minutes ago, wish I could afford one said: Democracy is a mob mentality. Providing you look after the mob (they keep the State Pension) you can take as much as you like from 'the rich' (they lose the pension through means testing). It's why I'm planning on none. There is already a means test on the State Pension for the rich. It is called income tax which is potentially chargeable on all state pension earnings. Edited July 19, 2017 by stormymonday_2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wish I could afford one Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Just now, stormymonday_2011 said: There is already a means test on the State Pension for the rich. It is called income tax which is potentially chargeable on all state pension earnings. That only takes 20, 40 or 45%. Means testing is a 100% tax. If they could tax 'the rich' at 110% they would. Someone has to pay for the mob. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spyguy Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 4 minutes ago, stormymonday_2011 said: No politician is going to be so daft as to openly default since their racket requires keeping the taxpayers paying money in with promises of jam tomorrow. Whose going to bail out the banks etc if people decide that paying taxes and NIC is for suckers. They are going to do it by more oblique means. BTW for those who think that the State Pension is backed by nothing more than fresh air and promises what do you think is behind the all other classes of savings such as ISAs, bank deposits etc. The reality is that the latter are just as likely to be reneged on as the former. I did think the NI and the like were just collect and spent. There is a ledger. Not like the Norwegian oil fund. More a big jar i nthe treasury shoved full of IOUs. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Insurance_Fund Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenDevil Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Does this also mean that the politicans and the bankers wont get their gold plated pensions until they are 68? Thats gotta be worth another year of 9-5. Oh hang on.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talking Monkey Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 23 minutes ago, bear.getting.old said: There is no way they can axe the state pension without there being riots and the party responsible for it unelectable. They wouldn't dare. If they made any moves to axe the state pension then a lot of people would simply cease to work, or work up the tax threshold, what would be the point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormymonday_2011 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 2 minutes ago, spyguy said: I did think the NI and the like were just collect and spent. There is a ledger. Not like the Norwegian oil fund. More a big jar i nthe treasury shoved full of IOUs. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Insurance_Fund Yes the NI fund money is technically loaned out to the government in return for gilts etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stormymonday_2011 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Talking Monkey said: If they made any moves to axe the state pension then a lot of people would simply cease to work, or work up the tax threshold, what would be the point And that is precisely what politicians and their various backers do not want you to do. Who is going to bail out dead beat corporations like Carillon with HS2 money if the public decide working and paying taxes is completely pointless. Edited July 19, 2017 by stormymonday_2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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