No Nationwide repos for 12 months

[Gigantic Purple Slug]

If you're banking on mass owner occupied repos to give you a HPC then you are a fool living in the past.

The only potential is maybe for mass repos of BTL properties. I'm not sure this would have the momentum to cause HPC, but certainly would help contribute to it.

[spyguy]

4 minutes ago, Gigantic Purple Slug said:

If you're banking on mass owner occupied repos to give you a HPC then you are a fool living in the past.

The only potential is maybe for mass repos of BTL properties. I'm not sure this would have the momentum to cause HPC, but certainly would help contribute to it.

Im banking on mass BTL and mass furnished holiday let repos.

These will crash houses where I am.

[MarkD]

22 minutes ago, Locke said:

are you misremembering?

https://www.mortgagestrategy.co.uk/analysis/historical-interest-rates-uk/

I stand corrected, it was early 90's, but the rot set in late 88/89.

[Gigantic Purple Slug]

1 minute ago, spyguy said:

Im banking on mass BTL and mass furnished holiday let repos.

These will crash houses where I am.

I think the danger is the bank will not market them individually but sell them en mass at low prices to property management companies or local councils who continue to rent them out to their current tenants.

That course of action may well be government forced.

As for the holiday lets, I think that depends on the volume.

[longgone]

27 minutes ago, sammersmith said:

Last month my Nationwide cash ISA went from 1.4% to 0.35%. My Nationwide Help to Buy ISA went from 2.5% to 1% and my daughter's Nationwide future saver went from 3% to 1%. I've now cashed anything sub 1% out of Nationwide and looking very carefully at what to do with anything left there earning 1%. 

Blessing in disguise really as i was concerned about getting near to the FSCO limit. Not a problem now but those annoying Nationwide commercials are still infuriating. 

The interest rate will only show once your account has been funded. 1.55%  Unfortunately, this product is withdrawn for funding and can no longer accept deposits. Should we withdraw a product from our website, customers have 7 working days to fund their account. There is a section on our website which details the list of withdrawn products. Kind regards, Stuart Lockwood Shawbrook Bank

 

basically go away we will not give you 1.55% 

[Si1]

1 hour ago, MARTINX9 said:

Almost all Nationwide instant access savings and ISAs are now paying 0.01%. So if you invested £50,000 you would earn a grand total of £5 in interest a year. These rates are way below what several banks are paying.

So yes prudent mug savers are paying for over leveraged feckless borrowers including BTL landlords at NW.

So much for caring sharing mutuality!

Saver members outnumber mortgage  holders by 9 to 1 so they could use their voting power to vote out the board at the July AGM!

In that case they're idiots

[longgone]

200% ltv ???

100k house here is 200k mortgage ?

[Si1]

20 minutes ago, MarkD said:

I stand corrected, it was early 90's, but the rot set in late 88/89.

Interest rates didn't go up to 15% around then

[TheCountOfNowhere]

Anyone coming round to my way of thinking yet ?

These ****s will literally stop at nothing.

They will not let their asset prices fall for the simple reason, they're ****ed if they do.

All those over-levered MPs, all the bankers up to their necks in debt, massive mortgages on homes.

The VI is at the top and it wont end well for any of us.

We're in proper phase 2 of the railway mania now, collapse will come, real austerity wuill happen, people will be made a scape goat. If rather Osborne be tried than poor gullible my Sunak

[TheCountOfNowhere]

32 minutes ago, longgone said:

200% ltv ???

100k house here is 200k mortgage ?

Has to be made up surely

[richmondtw]

47 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

It's not their ****ing home till they've paid the savers for it.

The savers do not pay the mortgage off the mortgagee does

 

51 minutes ago, regprentice said:

You don't think so? I worked for ulster Bank. In 2008 and then many of the Irish banks issued 200% mortgages as the property market fell 50%.

OMG - I stand corrected - thanks for correcting me - I apologise - I assumed you were being sarcastic !

That is truly and utterly insane!!

53 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

THEY WILL STOP AT NOTHING.

They will not repo. They will not allow houses to fall to fair value.  If they do, they are bankrupt.

This is fraud, a crime.  These ****s should be jailed.

·         No they do not want to reposess

I said this on another thread about a year ago and was told I was totally wrong and had no idea.

No lender will want to take in a load of housing stock. They did that in the housing crash in the late 80s early 90s and it did not work out well as they had a load of property on their books that was just falling in value.

They will not want the hassle of looking after empty property. If a property is to get the best value when sold as they are duty bound by law to do it has to be maintained.  That means gardens looked after, weeding, lawns cut, patios and decking cleaned.

The cost of metal grills that are used to secure properties are very high – I have used them myself last year.  They will not want to buy them and have the hassle of storing them so they will use a security company. 

Leaks fixed.  Central heating drained in the winter.

They will also incur estate agents and solicitors’ fees when the property is sold. 
At survey a problem such as Japanese knotweed could be discovered just as one example of things that could go wrong which will cost £££ to fix.

They do not have the internal computer systems to support loads of repossessed properties.  If they did choose to repossess 1000s of properties they would need to employ more staff at a time when they will be looking to cut costs.

Why would they want to own a load of property at a time when there will be mass unemployment?

That said I think the overwhelming number of job losses with be in the retail and pub/restaurant sector and very few of those people would be able to buy a house anyway. 

Skilled people will find employment due to the natural wastage in companies as staff move on – retire – go part time etc. 

It seems obvious that in a market if the market is falling no lender would want to repossess a depreciating asset. They feel they would be better off waiting for the mortgagee to obtain further employment and resume the payments. 

It is not fraud it is a simple business decision.  

Getting angry does not change anything. 

[longgone]

5 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Anyone coming round to my way of thinking yet ?

These ****s will literally stop at nothing.

They will not let their asset prices fall for the simple reason, they're ****ed if they do.

All those over-levered MPs, all the bankers up to their necks in debt, massive mortgages on homes.

The VI is at the top and it wont end well for any of us.

We're in proper phase 2 of the railway mania now, collapse will come, real austerity wuill happen, people will be made a scape goat. If rather Osborne be tried than poor gullible my Sunak

HTB causing more damage it seems. 

 

whats next though 50 year mortgage  

500k deposit for everyone paid back on death. 

[TheCountOfNowhere]

4 minutes ago, richmondtw said:

It is not fraud it is a simple business decision.  

Getting angry does not change anything. 

No, it's fraud.  Market manipulation to profit themselves.  Fraud, pure and simple.

Getting angry is the only way to change anything now.

Edited May 29, 2020 by TheCountOfNowhere

[TheCountOfNowhere]

2 minutes ago, longgone said:

HTB causing more damage it seems. 

 

whats next though 50 year mortgage  

500k deposit for everyone paid back on death. 

More magicked up cash, negative rates, inter gemnerational mortgages.

There will be a revolution at some point.

When this finally collapses it is going to be spectacular.

[longgone]

2 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

More magicked up cash, negative rates, inter gemnerational mortgages.

There will be a revolution at some point.

When this finally collapses it is going to be spectacular.

you have to wonder why anyone bothers to go to work or save anything. 

[TheCountOfNowhere]

Just now, longgone said:

you have to wonder why anyone bothers to go to work or save anything. 

Thats what they want.

I'd wager there are thousands over the last 2 months that wish they had money in the bank

[longgone]

2 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Thats what they want.

I'd wager there are thousands over the last 2 months that wish they had money in the bank

i really don`t feel i`m on the winning side.  

nice as a backup though no one to answer to. 

[Si1]

1 hour ago, Gigantic Purple Slug said:

If you're banking on mass owner occupied repos to give you a HPC then you are a fool living in the past.

The only potential is maybe for mass repos of BTL properties. I'm not sure this would have the momentum to cause HPC, but certainly would help contribute to it.

Those tallies with the flood of houses in seeing near me. All ex BTL fodder that hit the lha 3 or 2 bed requirements.

[Gigantic Purple Slug]

32 minutes ago, TheCountOfNowhere said:

Anyone coming round to my way of thinking yet ?

These ****s will literally stop at nothing.

They will not let their asset prices fall for the simple reason, they're ****ed if they do.

All those over-levered MPs, all the bankers up to their necks in debt, massive mortgages on homes.

The VI is at the top and it wont end well for any of us.

We're in proper phase 2 of the railway mania now, collapse will come, real austerity wuill happen, people will be made a scape goat. If rather Osborne be tried than poor gullible my Sunak

Came round to your way of thinking about 8 years ago.

Obvious that the government will do anything to avoid a HPC if at all possible, because a) it's really bad press and b) they will need to re-house everyone who is kicked out, so it just shifts the problem on to them.

Of course if they were really serious about stopping a HPC then they would have taken action from 2010-2020 to stop the market overheating. But they didn't because they like the feel good factor rising house prices seem to create amongst a lot of the population.

And if you look back at Cameron/Osbourne, you can see his calculation was completely right. He didn't need to give a shit about boosting prices from 2010-2016, because ultimately the fallout from that will be someone elses problem.

[MARTINX9]

1 hour ago, Si1 said:

In that case they're idiots

Who  - the savings members? Might make the board stop and think for a second at least if their bonuses got voted down. The CEO of Nationwide earned 20 times what the PM did last year.

Nationwide has totally forgotten what its purpose is as a mutual - the fact that it is paying much lower savings rates than banks with shareholders or indeed smaller local societies without its economies of scale is very poor yet it keeps up this pretence about being a caring sharing entity. Certainly has plenty of money too for those tacky adverts it has been doing recently.  It doesn't even offer a regular month saver account for its members anymore  - which should be the staple account of a mutual - whereas those nasty shareholder banks are offering such products paying up to 2.75%.

The only people benefitting from its caring and sharing seem to be its board in terms of their Executive pay and its buy to let customers who it has aggressively chased in recent years - plus the overleveraged who can't pay their debts. The board can do what it wants - as the electorate is dispersed and powerless if it doesn't exercise its one chance each July.

It might as well just convert to a bank frankly - savings rates would probably go up!

Edited May 29, 2020 by MARTINX9

[regprentice]

1 hour ago, longgone said:

200% ltv ???

100k house here is 200k mortgage ?

It's effectively a remortgage - Looking at the small print it's for virgin customers only, who are not moving house and have a household income of £75k minimum. 

For that small group they can buy a new build today at £500k, but when the value drops to £250k in a crash, they can remortgage to continue to pay the £500k debt at 4.5%. Lucky them. 

 

Edited May 29, 2020 by regprentice

[Locke]

11 minutes ago, Gigantic Purple Slug said:

a) it's really bad press

Sure

11 minutes ago, Gigantic Purple Slug said:

b) they will need to re-house everyone who is kicked out

hahaha what?

If people lose their houses because of a house price crash, it is tautological to state that there will be loads of affordable housing for them.

[gp_]

4 hours ago, scb said:

Does that mean all Nationwide mortgage holders get a 12 month payment holiday? Or will they just wait 12 months from now and repo the house even if you have sorted yourself out since then?

According to their website:

"we’re promising not to take any action to repossess your home if you've fallen into arrears because of the financial impact of coronavirus until 31 May 2021. You’ll just need to stay in touch and keep working with us to help get your mortgage back on track."

They have left themselves a lot of wriggle room:

1. It only applies if you have fallen into arrears because of coronavirus: this could be interpreted as support while you are on furlough, but not if you are made redundant.
2. Its only until Mary 2021. They can do what they want after that. Probably if you look like you can pay it off with an extra year or two on the term you are probably OK, other wise they will repossess.
3. You have to "stay in touch and keep working with us to help get your mortgage back on track" - that could mean that if you do not look like you are going to get your mortgage back on track they will repossess.

Joe also said that people who take a further mortgage payment  break should have it noted on their credit rating until their payments returned to "normal": https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52847131

[Hullabaloo82]

It makes sense to keep borrowers on the hook for the debt rather than have the hassle of owning and trying to sell a house into a massive recession, especially when you consider the I and E impact is extend the provision a bit vs write down a load of assets and incur a shedload of costs if they repossess. 

They'll be gambling on the famous "V shape" recovery meaning that by December they can convince their auditors that they can still collect this cash and it's a bet I think they'll probably win. 

Commenters are absolutely right that this is not terribly helpful if you're anticipating a nominal price fall. First we had the thinly veiled helicopter money, now we've got the banks shifting the goal posts. I suspected this wpuld be the case; interesting to see it confirmed now. 

Next up will be leave to rent and 100% mortgages for "second steppers" with secure employment and a proven track record of paying they'd still rather lend to than take the risk on someone else in the current environment. 

Sad but true. 

[Timm]

49 minutes ago, Hullabaloo82 said:

(...)

Next up will be leave to rent and 100% mortgages for "second steppers" with secure employment and a proven track record of paying they'd still rather lend to than take the risk on someone else in the current environment. 

Sad but true. 

Not sure what you mean by this, but I remember "let to buy" mortgages from the early '90s. You just had to find a tenant for your underwater home and you could buy a new one. They essentially created the BTL thing - lots of people got into it by accident and were surprised to find they had fallen into a nice little earner.

I'm not sure how well it would work now - BTL is not what it was and a lot of people would find they had fallen into a nice little cluster******. Perhaps if they were HMG sanctioned?