slawek Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Revolution will be televised? http://news.sky.com/story/grenfell-fire-protesters-enter-kensington-and-chelsea-town-hall-10917777 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 its about time people got angry. the propaganda by the BBC has been shocking, trying to hide the total estimated deaths, as they dont want it flashed up 150 dead. it wont just be the residents of the tower, but also those who have their own children living in similar death traps. we have known the housing crisis should of been solved 10-20 years ago. The anger will just get worse until something is done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Town hall now stormed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 why is the video quality soo poor? dont want the public to read the placards? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Young and the Nestless Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, oldsport said: From what I can work out from these ratings on the manufacturers website, it looks like the mineral fibre version of Reynobond is the only type of Reynobond that is truly non combustible. It is possible that "marketing speak" may have confused the designers, or that they simply tried to save £5000. Reynobond or Reynobond FR (Class B ) "Fire Retardent" Reynobond A2 (Class A2) "Non-combustible" Reynodual (Class A2) Reynolux (Class A1) "Incombustible" This PDF on the website carries the instructions: "As soon as the building is higher than the firefighters’ ladders, it has to be conceived with an incombustible material." Grenfell tower was 67m high and therefore should have used A1 class cladding according to the manufacturer's own statement above. (Though more than likely they meant to allow A2 'non-combustible' as well.) That was not a 'legal' requirement unfortunately. 3 hours ago, ElPapasito said: Look, sprinkler systems are unnecessary... It would have been fine in this tower except some idiot put a flammable wrapper on the outside of the building. At the time of building the sprinkler system may have been unnecessary, but even without the re-clad problems, there would be no guarantee that some other incorrect maintenance wouldn't take place and accidentally 'reduce' the original fire rating of any flat. Thus a sprinkler system would serve as a 'failsafe' in those scenarios. Edited June 16, 2017 by The Young and the Nestless Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 'Labour has called on the government to lift the borrowing cap on housing revenue account so councils can pay for all housing to meet safety standards.' Ah yes, because more debt is always the answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 They just cut off the chanting which was trying to tell the media it was more than 17. Wish we had a free media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Surely everyone is aware by now that real figure is probably over 100? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Young and the Nestless Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 2 minutes ago, Errol said: 'Labour has called on the government to lift the borrowing cap on housing revenue account so councils can pay for all housing to meet safety standards.' Ah yes, because more debt is always the answer. We are talking peanuts. Possibly some councils could add sprinklers to all their high-rises for less than a few million. Some of these flats may be rented out and making money. The paying tenants would want to live somewhere safe. Any business would borrow the money at the current crazy low rate and get it done. What's the problem here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 As long as the borrowing cap is raised for only that purpose, I wouldn't object. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bomberbrown Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 Quote 'Labour has called on the government to lift the borrowing cap on housing revenue account so councils can pay for all housing to meet safety standards.' And tenants in the Private Rental Sector? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nothernsoul Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 The company that won the bid for the reburbishment contracted out virtually all the work to other companies. How much taxpayers money was creamed off there? The company that fitted the cladding went bust shortly after the job, owing a million pounds to creditors, only to be bought afterwards by another company belonging to the same owner!( Seriously, how is that legal? )Without knowing the full details, I wouldnt expect such a person to buy the best quality materials for the money. Did the private management company, gifted valuable state assets to make profit, benefit financially from the refurbishment in any way? I think somwhere in all that is an explanation why it cost 80 grand to provide double glazing, central heating and cladding for a flat. These are all secondary issues to the responsibility behind the tragic loss of life, but it all paints an ugly picture of the unaccountable,spiv country we have become under new labour and the tories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funn3r Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 23 minutes ago, nothernsoul said: These are all secondary issues to the responsibility behind the tragic loss of life, but it all paints an ugly picture of the unaccountable,spiv country we have become under new labour and the tories. I don't normally feel it adds value to post "me too" but this comment perfectly expresses my disgust with our recent government(s), bankers, and others which have brought the country to its knees. God help us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 What is a tower block worth? what is a certain tower block over another tower block worth and why? what is a certain life over another life worth?....what and whose life is worth more than another life?......are some people worth more than another? who determines/values that?..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pmgdawau Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 If the residents association were so certain about the potential dangers and that the only way things would change was through massive loss of life, why didn't they organise clear ups of the rubbish, emergency fire drills themselves ? Seems everyone was aware it was a deathtrap, but they continued to gamble with their own lives without realising the true odds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 13 minutes ago, pmgdawau said: If the residents association were so certain about the potential dangers and that the only way things would change was through massive loss of life, why didn't they organise clear ups of the rubbish, emergency fire drills themselves ? Seems everyone was aware it was a deathtrap, but they continued to gamble with their own lives without realising the true odds. you sir are a moron Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geezer466 Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 55 minutes ago, pmgdawau said: If the residents association were so certain about the potential dangers and that the only way things would change was through massive loss of life, why didn't they organise clear ups of the rubbish, emergency fire drills themselves ? Seems everyone was aware it was a deathtrap, but they continued to gamble with their own lives without realising the true odds. Picture of one of the landings published today on the BBC. Lifted Direct from the Grenfell action group blog. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-40290158 With the caption The Grenfell Action Group complained about uncollected rubbish in corridors, pointing out it was a fire risk Seems to me contributory negligence and anti-social behaviour had a small part to play here. All will become apparent in the public enquiry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geezer466 Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 59 minutes ago, pmgdawau said: If the residents association were so certain about the potential dangers and that the only way things would change was through massive loss of life, why didn't they organise clear ups of the rubbish, emergency fire drills themselves ? Seems everyone was aware it was a deathtrap, but they continued to gamble with their own lives without realising the true odds. The Sad fact is there would have been numerous warnings all going unheeded now we have this. The Council should have been on top it as well evicting the anti-social people who refused to comply with reasonable requests to keep the place tidy. The authorities have already mentioned they have no idea of the eventual death toll and the fact many will go unidentified. A significant number of these flats would have been sublets and operating in the black economy very possibly filled with illegals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 https://www.change.org/p/uk-parliament-this-government-must-carry-out-an-inquest-into-the-grenfell-tragedy-not-a-public-inquiry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will! Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 On 15/06/2017 at 7:56 AM, interestrateripoff said: Given the recent tragic events, how many of the countries tower blocks have been clad in materials which makes them a death trap? At least twenty will need inspection: http://www.constructionenquirer.com/2017/06/16/20-london-high-rises-with-grenfell-cladding-system/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Funn3r Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/grenfell-fire-protests-downing-street-theresa-may-must-go-chants-latest-news-a7794271.html Protest is growing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ah-so Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 1 hour ago, winkie said: What is a tower block worth? what is a certain tower block over another tower block worth and why? what is a certain life over another life worth?....what and whose life is worth more than another life?......are some people worth more than another? who determines/values that?..... I think that I read that a life is worth a tad under £200,000. At a cost benefit level, that is when the authorities will stop intervening, for example, sorting out an accident blackspot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 16 minutes ago, Funn3r said: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/grenfell-fire-protests-downing-street-theresa-may-must-go-chants-latest-news-a7794271.html Protest is growing Yeah, it's all Thereas May's fault because she didn't turn up to make a "look how caring I am" apperance. The PM should be competent, not nice. Of course she fails on that too, but that's beside the point in this context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 9 minutes ago, Ah-so said: I think that I read that a life is worth a tad under £200,000. At a cost benefit level, that is when the authorities will stop intervening, for example, sorting out an accident blackspot. Must be the UK's goal to get the average house worth more than a life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LC1 Posted June 16, 2017 Share Posted June 16, 2017 2 hours ago, nothernsoul said: The company that won the bid for the reburbishment contracted out virtually all the work to other companies. How much taxpayers money was creamed off there? The company that fitted the cladding went bust shortly after the job, owing a million pounds to creditors, only to be bought afterwards by another company belonging to the same owner!( Seriously, how is that legal? )Without knowing the full details, I wouldnt expect such a person to buy the best quality materials for the money. Did the private management company, gifted valuable state assets to make profit, benefit financially from the refurbishment in any way? I think somwhere in all that is an explanation why it cost 80 grand to provide double glazing, central heating and cladding for a flat. These are all secondary issues to the responsibility behind the tragic loss of life, but it all paints an ugly picture of the unaccountable,spiv country we have become under new labour and the tories. This is the big unanswered question, together with which local and national politicians were complicit in the deal, nod and a wink, nice one nice one. I heard £10 million to Raynon, or whatever they're called, and then they subcontracted out the cladding work for £2.5 million. Erm, where's the other £7.5 million gone? Are the media asking these questions at all? I know it's still a bit early perhaps, but the whole thing stinks like corruption and backhanders to me. The shady business practices you mention only give credence to that idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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