The rats are jumping ship...SELL SELL SELL

[mrtickle]

21 hours ago, leonardratso said:

'cluster feck of a house' i reckons.

Could they be Ros' houses?

I did like the honesty, though:

 

[Cosmic Apple]

6 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

Could they be Ros' houses?

I did like the honesty, though:

 

Have you got that plugin that was mentioned here a while ago? Replaces some of the BS in estate agents write ups

[mrtickle]

2 minutes ago, Cosmic Apple said:

Have you got that plugin that was mentioned here a while ago? Replaces some of the BS in estate agents write ups

Aha! lol, yes I have.

It was the "shitemove" plugin.

 

 

Edited March 25, 2018 by mrtickle

[Cosmic Apple]

4 minutes ago, mrtickle said:

Aha! lol, yes I have.

It was the "shitemove" plugin.

[UnconventionalWisdom]

9 hours ago, eric pebble said:

Ha!!!!   I have been saying that since c.2004 when I joined HPC --- and it turned out I was King Lear shouting/Screaming to myself in a storm....  I saw all this coming 15+ years ago --- I banged so many tables -- got so angry --- and - well - here we are all that time later -- and I am beyond despair now.  

"Property" has become the new religion.  Those utter C nts are still on the tv today -- all those pwoberdee porn shows -- they're STILL there ---- it really is like being in Nazi Germany.... Day in Day out -- the poisonous property propaganda is pumped out 24/7 ......

And meanwhile -- decent ordinary people's lives are being utterly screwed by the Greatest Pyramid/Ponzi Scam of All Time....  Fueled by fraudulent "credit" -- i.e ever rising PREDATORY LIAR LOANS.....  THE GREATEST FRAUD of ALL TIME.

I am still the lonely voice - frail now -- just cannot believe how grim things have become.  Beyond words.

Ahhh! Don't say that-I've been on here for half a year and having been telling everyone for over a year that the situation is beyond belief and a house of cards (no pun intended). Most people don't believe me and want to plough on with buying things they can't afford (htb) or think that people should do whatever is needed to get a house. I feel like I wouldn't be fair to myself or my life if I took out a rediculous sized mortgage for a 1 bed flat. I hope, pray, beg that I'm not writing a message similar to yours to a newcomer in 15 years. 

Edited March 25, 2018 by UnconventionalWisdom

[eric pebble]

On 3/25/2018 at 4:50 PM, UnconventionalWisdom said:

Ahhh! Don't say that-I've been on here for half a year and having been telling everyone for over a year that the situation is beyond belief and a house of cards (no pun intended). Most people don't believe me and want to plough on with buying things they can't afford (htb) or think that people should do whatever is needed to get a house. I feel like I wouldn't be fair to myself or my life if I took out a rediculous sized mortgage for a 1 bed flat. I hope, pray, beg that I'm not writing a message similar to yours to a newcomer in 15 years. 

I don't quite know what to say, UW...  Like many others here ---- I simply cannot believe how long all this has gone on for....  It is the most depressing thing in the world....  All the crooks have got away with it.  Simply unbelievable.

[Tapori]

On 3/25/2018 at 3:50 PM, UnconventionalWisdom said:

Ahhh! Don't say that-I've been on here for half a year and having been telling everyone for over a year that the situation is beyond belief and a house of cards (no pun intended). Most people don't believe me and want to plough on with buying things they can't afford (htb) or think that people should do whatever is needed to get a house. I feel like I wouldn't be fair to myself or my life if I took out a rediculous sized mortgage for a 1 bed flat. I hope, pray, beg that I'm not writing a message similar to yours to a newcomer in 15 years. 

That feel.

Edited March 27, 2018 by Tapori

[spacedin]

On 25/03/2018 at 11:54 AM, mrtickle said:

Aha! lol, yes I have.

It was the "shitemove" plugin.

 

 

Can't help but laugh at that shitemove plugin.

Especially as it affected gumtree without me realising. I thought that seller was being a bit too honest about his bicycle. 

Edited March 28, 2018 by spacedin

[Guest]

On 25/03/2018 at 7:24 AM, eric pebble said:

Ha!!!!   I have been saying that since c.2004 when I joined HPC --- and it turned out I was King Lear shouting/Screaming to myself in a storm....  I saw all this coming 15+ years ago --- I banged so many tables -- got so angry --- and - well - here we are all that time later -- and I am beyond despair now.  

"Property" has become the new religion.  Those utter C nts are still on the tv today -- all those pwoberdee porn shows -- they're STILL there ---- it really is like being in Nazi Germany.... Day in Day out -- the poisonous property propaganda is pumped out 24/7 ......

And meanwhile -- decent ordinary people's lives are being utterly screwed by the Greatest Pyramid/Ponzi Scam of All Time....  Fueled by fraudulent "credit" -- i.e ever rising PREDATORY LIAR LOANS.....  THE GREATEST FRAUD of ALL TIME.

I am still the lonely voice - frail now -- just cannot believe how grim things have become.  Beyond words.

I sense your despair, I personally always held back a little so it never ate away at me, reason being I wanted to be strong when the big day came so I could then fill my boots. My one big mistake was thinking that all these injustices and wrongs would be righted by decent people in high places, not going to happen.

This is just one example, quite simply the house I or you might want is being purchased by a BTL landlord and using my/your money is housing a genuine claimant, looser, scrounger, immigrant and handing the cash over to the landlord, how can you compete with that communist thinking. No matter how much some people try to better themselves by education and hard work and climbing the food chain it will never be enough, some in the lowest 10% of the food chain could quite possibly be living in better housing than the top 30% purely because they bred without wages.

[stop_the_craziness]

Just now, TonyJ said:

Separate from properties with tenants in situ coming on the market, I am definitely seeing former rental properties coming on the market, Is this the rush to sell, or is it just a mild pre-tremor?

Round my way the volume of 1 and 2 bedroom flats is increasing by the day.  1 bedroom houses are up too and the smaller/crappier end of the 2 bedroom houses is picking up too.

The problem is that most of these are pretty unattractive prospects to actually live in, which is probably why they were only ever attractive to BTL landlords in the first place.  Therefore I can't see anyone buying them but surely they will just make the more attractive properties that come one seem even better, which doesn't actually help anything?

[jiltedjen]

9 minutes ago, TonyJ said:

Separate from properties with tenants in situ coming on the market, I am definitely seeing former rental properties coming on the market, Is this the rush to sell, or is it just a mild pre-tremor?

i have just done my once monthly look on zoopla, and suddenly there is a noticeable increase in ex BTL properties coming to the market.
The real teller is the horrible cheap cheap carpet, same colour in     every      single    room.

Some of them are priced 'relatively' keenly, some of them are hoping to get out with massive gains. But seeing that we are just about to approach prime listing time spring/summer it's a really good sign. We have not yet had enough time for the 'no viewings' to sink in yet.

We are probably 6 months away from massive increases in volumes for sale and the first heavy drops from forced sellers. There is a now a heavily restricted pool of buyers (most in heavy car debt, or been gouged on rents, or just plain are not earning enough and are partly held back by the limp MMR rules).

The smarter BTL lot, which are probably those who bought say 10 years ago, can afford, and will just keep lowering prices to catch the rare buyers.

The stupider more recent BTL entrants can't afford to lower prices (having driven them up 30-40% in a short period), and they are about to finally meet mr reality and probably also mr financially ruined. 

Edited March 30, 2018 by jiltedjen

[Diver Dan]

An acquaintance (tax accountant by trade) of mine just put her flat on the market about 3 years after she got married and moved in with her husband. In fairness, it does look very well decorated and is in a nice part of town. It's a bit cramped and certainly overpriced. 

How did she describe it in the Facebook post?

Property for sale...

has been a great buy to let flat or would be an ideal first time purchase. Feel free to share!

My emphasis.

[Diver Dan]

Just now, TonyJ said:

A strange turn of phrase. I wonder if it was intentional, or it just reveals her inner feelings, as a tax accountant, about the prospects for BTL. 

Exactly. Why would you get rid of something that's still a money-spinner?

[Guest]

The more I read that site the more it reflects what I have seen in real life regarding BTL, it is basically for people who want to pretend they are business people and don't want to work hard for their money, it's just one of those endless "Get Rich Quick" schemes that actually worked for some for a while.

[Guest]

29 minutes ago, jiltedjen said:

We are probably 6 months away from massive increases in volumes for sale and the first heavy drops from forced sellers. There is a now a heavily restricted pool of buyers (most in heavy car debt, or been gouged on rents, or just plain are not earning enough and are partly held back by the limp MMR rules)

We just need that fast initial BTL rush for the exit with no buyers to save them and then it's game on, just cannot see it just yet, but it will just take just one big fright and there will be nothing to reverse sentiment once it gets started, a negative property market is gagging to be ignited, just cannot seem to get that first f***** initial spark.

[Houdini]

 

24 minutes ago, inbruges said:

We just need that fast initial BTL rush for the exit with no buyers to save them and then it's game on, just cannot see it just yet, but it will just take just one big fright and there will be nothing to reverse sentiment once it gets started, a negative property market is gagging to be ignited, just cannot seem to get that first f***** initial spark.

I suspect the big shock will be next week when the 2017/18 self assessment forms appear with the new questions regarding BTL tax as people watch their incomes and tax bills shoot up. As suddenly things will change from theory to actual money

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, TonyJ said:

I agree with you. In my experience, portfolio BTLers are often a certain type of person, who wants to come across as a serious and successful winner at the top of the social hierarchy, but is actually just a talentless chancer on a get rich quick scheme, often without other prospects, 

I have met a lot of business people in my time, many of them knowing their fields inside out  sometimes in very complicated areas, I never look at them in envy because it was no accident so many of the excelled far more than I ever will, they were just a cut above most. BTL types have got this delusional image of themselves as some kind of Alpha people, it's like the majority of estate agents who suit up thinking that's what gives them class when in fact they look more like 1960's London gangsters or Reservoir Dogs.

There is one scragg on Property Tribes who appeared on MTV for a short period where 99.99999999% will never have heard of her who has tried to live on that ever since who had nothing else to back her life up, hence BTL. Everytime I am introduced to a BTL type I am checking for my wallet while having this stranger get over familiar with me in the first few seconds of knowing me, I have always had this inbuilt radar with over friendly people on first meeting me, I never trust them. But the minute someone jokingly insults me for the first time  I have a friend for life.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Houdini said:

 

I suspect the big shock will be next week when the 2017/18 self assessment forms appear with the new questions regarding BTL tax as people watch their incomes and tax bills shoot up. As suddenly things will change from theory to actual money

 

That can be put off until 31st December 2018 Houdini, and probably will. I always remember my own little campaign a decade ago regarding tax. I wrote to MP's and all sorts, I just wanted one little thing to be done in what I am certain was the biggest case of mass fraud  the UK has ever seen, self cert.

I wanted one simple thing done, all recent self certs, say within 5 years cross referenced with self assessments . It will probably all come out one day, maybe once a property crash has been and gone, another Jimmy Saville

[UnconventionalWisdom]

5 minutes ago, inbruges said:

I have always had this inbuilt radar with over friendly people on first meeting me, I never trust them. But the minute someone jokingly insults me for the first time  I have a friend for life.

Me too- I want genuine people not someone who's trying to manipulate 

[oatbake]

40 minutes ago, inbruges said:

The more I read that site the more it reflects what I have seen in real life regarding BTL, it is basically for people who want to pretend they are business people and don't want to work hard for their money, it's just one of those endless "Get Rich Quick" schemes that actually worked for some for a while.

If you go on propertytripe there are still plenty of muppets embarking on BTL endeavours. Almost every day there's a post about asking for advice for newbie landlords.

As long as there is money to borrow people will continue to flock to BTL as it is still seen as easy money. 

The money tap will only turn off when:

a) house prices start to seriously decline and lenders start to ask for bigger deposits, or increase interest rates on BTL mortgages, making it unviable, or

stories of landlords going bust in their hundreds due to S24 etc are commonplace in the press, or

c) the government ban IO buy to let.

Until then people will still keep throwing everything into buy to let. 

It's still irrational exuberance.

Personally I'm looking forward to seeing how many of these chancers stay solvent going forward...we have all read of the heroic exploits of Busta, Bosher, MK Dong, Dullard, Private Fraser... and who could forget good old Pricey?

We could even play HPC bingo.

Unfortunately they will probably take a couple of banks and building societies with them. It's all starting to feel very 2007 again!

 

 

 

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, TonyJ said:

I do my tax return about October/November so I can be sure to get the right amount of cash together by mid-January eg put savings accounts on notice. Presumably LLs will also need to know in advance that they have enough ready cash available to pay in Jan. And maybe they will also need to pay on account the following July, since they are now asking me for two payments per year.

Next year though I think we will be getting the endless BTL landlord sob stories to the Tax man how this evil government has moved the goal posts and ruined their business and sent them into a debt spiral. That's what I love about BTL "business people", they think the governments job was to deal with every pissy little problem they have. With my business I have something to deal with monthly, but it is just part and parcel and I get on with it.

[spyguy]

1 hour ago, inbruges said:

The more I read that site the more it reflects what I have seen in real life regarding BTL, it is basically for people who want to pretend they are business people and don't want to work hard for their money, it's just one of those endless "Get Rich Quick" schemes that actually worked for some for a while.

IO BTL is a sane proposition to someone who has money or understands investing.

You are taking a huge leverage to get a sub 5% yield.

A bit of research shows that btl have been the market since early 2000s.

[hayder]

4 minutes ago, TonyJ said:

I've been shafted many times by the government, but I have just had to accept it is the nature of government to shaft people. Next time I always vow to be wiser and to try to anticipate what the government might do, and try to stay one step ahead.

LLs seem to believe they should be exempt from the facts of life that plague everyone else. LLs have zero public sympathy, so unless they can put up rents and reframe s24 as a 'tenant tax', they will get nowhere.

what i've learned painfully over the last 15+ years is that the government's job is to look after the main herd of population... stragglers and outliers (especially the non-wealthy ones) will get thrown under a bus for the benefit of the main herd. 

To be honest, this was a painful lesson to absorb. Many on here are still angry about it. But ultimately its been the best lesson for me so far... it hopefully should help us be more accurate in foreseeing future government direction and policy and acting accordingly.

Edited March 30, 2018 by hayder

[spyguy]

22 minutes ago, TonyJ said:

When you say this, do you mean the market has consisted almost entirely of BTL since 2000?

Id reckon the bulk of transaction since 2002 has been btl.

They outbid - and over paid - FTBs.

[Guest]

46 minutes ago, TonyJ said:

I've been shafted many times by the government, but I have just had to accept it is the nature of government to shaft people. Next time I always vow to be wiser and to try to anticipate what the government might do, and try to stay one step ahead.

LLs seem to believe they should be exempt from the facts of life that plague everyone else. LLs have zero public sympathy, so unless they can put up rents and reframe s24 as a 'tenant tax', they will get nowhere.

I am under no illusion that the system now works in order for a very sizeable minority to have very comfortable and pleasant lives at the expense of 80% ish of the UK population who live hand to mouth in very stressed  and un rewarding lives. Maybe this is now is the new norm and house prices will always be out of reach unless you are willing to sacrifice 20 + years of you life, risk your marriage and never nurture your kids because you are always working or too tired.

But the longer this goes on the more people are going to say F*** it  I will let the state take care of me, free rental in the form of housing benefit sounds very tempting for those who are time poor and sick of using their pay for something they will never own while others get it for free.