Brendan110_0 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Why can’t they use these as an emergency? They did exist, plenty of beds/room, can they shift the bed blockers to those to free up hospital beds? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynamehere Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Staff was always the bottle neck. Beds are not much use without nurses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Luc Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 minute ago, mynamehere said: Staff was always the bottle neck. Beds are not much use without nurses. But we are talking about people who can be discharged who are bed blocking. They don't need nurses. Could probably be looked after by a carer so train up some carers to staff the nightingales it's not rocket science is it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonguest Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 5 minutes ago, mynamehere said: Staff was always the bottle neck. Beds are not much use without nurses. I got the impression that those Nightingale hospitals, intended for Covid surge, were not the sort of place you could be expected to come out of once admitted. So why would nurses matter? 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynamehere Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 minute ago, daveyj said: But we are talking about people who can be discharged who are bed blocking. They don't need nurses. Could probably be looked after by a carer so train up some carers to staff the nightingales it's not rocket science is it. There is a big shortage of carers too otherwise they would be discharged for home care? Training would be good. Paying more would be better. Immigration is the alternative. Pick your poison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HousePriceTooHigh Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Nightingale hospitals were effectively to be used as a halfway house to the morgue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Luc Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 (edited) 4 minutes ago, mynamehere said: There is a big shortage of carers too otherwise they would be discharged for home care? Training would be good. Paying more would be better. Immigration is the alternative. Pick your poison. Ah yeah that's right we sacked thousands of carers who refused to be experimented on for a cold maybe that wasn't such a good idea after all 🤷♂️ Edited January 9, 2023 by daveyj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynamehere Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 6 minutes ago, daveyj said: Ah yeah that's right we sacked thousands of carers who refused to be experimented on for a cold maybe that wasn't such a good idea after all 🤷♂️ Maybe. But that rule is not in place now Fact is social care sector needs billions extra to attract and retain staff. There is no short cut. You can’t blame managers for this one . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Homeless Millionaire Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Legacy of decades of treating some professions like dirt. Why would anyone wish to be a 'carer' when you are treated so badly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Sticking plaster fix.......bit like hotels for asylum seekers, expensive private accomodation, paid by the tax payers. We will be paying millions out of the public purse to buy beds in private nursing/care homes that use private nurses. Should be opening NHS convalescent homes, making more use of cottage hospitals with empty wards....... TRAINING More NHS staff.......not using private firms, that cost a fortune, and need to make profits, expecting them to do all the training and recruitment, already thousands that used to work with the NHS have transferred over...... The government doesn't really care.....gradual the plan that hasn't worked very well.......all becoming more transparent to the people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynamehere Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 there is an estimated social care funding gap of about 7bn a year building this or that makes good headlines but it comes down to money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msi Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 hour ago, mynamehere said: there is an estimated social care funding gap of about 7bn a year building this or that makes good headlines but it comes down to money BoJos NI hike was supposed to cover it...whooops! Take OAPs out of the NHS and push them onto Councils to fund. Suddenly all those smug Tory councils will have to stump up real cash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Luc Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, mynamehere said: there is an estimated social care funding gap of about 7bn a year building this or that makes good headlines but it comes down to money £120bn this year in interest payments how much of that to the BOE for the monopoly money they have printed over the years? How much money will be wasted on net zero bullsh*t? Money is never an obstacle when they can print as much as they like as was shown during covid (£300-£400bn spend on a sniffle that killed a few very ill grannies/oldies) but can't spent a few measly quid training/paying nurses/drs LOL. The fact is they only spend the cash on narratives that give them more control/power or enrich the already wealthy and training more nurses does neither of those things. Sooner people accept the government is not their friend and that the system is heavily rigged against them the better. Edited January 9, 2023 by daveyj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynamehere Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 minute ago, daveyj said: £120bn this year in interest payments how much of that to the BOE for the monopoly money they have printed over the years? How much money will be wasted on net zero bullsh*t? Money is never an obstacle when they can print as much as they like as was shown during covid. The fact is they only spend the cash on narratives that give them more control/power or enrich the already wealthy and training more nurses does neither of those things. Sooner people accept the government is not their friend and that the system is heavily rigged against them the better. I’m not sure from that if your agree with my about needing to increase social care funding. if not what’s the plan to pay carers more? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jean-Luc Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 1 minute ago, mynamehere said: I’m not sure from that if your agree with my about needing to increase social care funding. if not what’s the plan to pay carers more? I agree most definately. My point was there is plenty of money to pay for things so long as those things help those in power or their rich friends. Why spend money now to help people live comfortably (social care) or healthily? Nah lets spend half a trillion quid to pay morons to hide at home from a sniffle LOL Why not start a campaign highlighting all the grannies dying from lack of NHS care and i'm sure Rishi could rustle up another half a trillion like he did last time. After all we sarcificed our civil rights and economy to save granny but 2-3 years ago we must protect that investment no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msi Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 2 hours ago, HousePriceTooHigh said: Nightingale hospitals were effectively to be used as a halfway house to the morgue. +1 No nurses needed here. If you ended up in Nightingale, you were written off Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_duke_of_hazzard Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 2 hours ago, Brendan110_0 said: Why can’t they use these as an emergency? They did exist, plenty of beds/room, can they shift the bed blockers to those to free up hospital beds? Aside from all the other reasons this won't work mentioned above, weren't they temporarily based in conference centres and the like rather than buildings dedicated to hospital care? They just don't exist anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigantic Purple Slug Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 Surely the answer to "bed blocking" is easy. Just charge bed blockers an amount consistent with what they would pay if they were in a retirement home. Either that or just increase taxes on the middle class (again) to pay for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Englaender Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 5 hours ago, daveyj said: a sniffle that killed a few very ill grannies/oldies That "sniffle" killed my 62 year old neighbour in April 2020. Collapsed and died struggling for air on his bathroom floor. Not particularly old and despite having diabetes and being slightly overweight, not particularly ill either. That was obviously during the first lockdown, after his partner who worked in a care home inadvertently brought it home with her. Belittle the virus all you like, but without the first lockdown, he'd have been much less of an exception than he was. I'd hazard a guess there may be a few 60+ posters on here with similar waistlines who might have been equally as unfortunate if they'd got it when he did and didn't get admitted to hospital like Boris Johnson did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teal77 Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 7 hours ago, Brendan110_0 said: Why can’t they use these as an emergency? They did exist, plenty of beds/room, can they shift the bed blockers to those to free up hospital beds? Truth is, it was all just a big act. They never had the staff for any of these. The NHS is f***** and people are dying because governments have chosen not to fund it appropriately and made working conditions so poor for Doctors, Nurses, and other NHS staff that they are striking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LetsBuild Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 7 hours ago, mynamehere said: Maybe. But that rule is not in place now Fact is social care sector needs billions extra to attract and retain staff. There is no short cut. You can’t blame managers for this one . The job isn’t a pleasant or well paid one, but people stuck with it. Until the mandate finally forced a lot of them out of their inertia, I’d say the mandate is a big part of it that need not of happened irrespective of money on offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mynamehere Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 50 minutes ago, LetsBuild said: The job isn’t a pleasant or well paid one, but people stuck with it. Until the mandate finally forced a lot of them out of their inertia, I’d say the mandate is a big part of it that need not of happened irrespective of money on offer. I know a couple of anti vax carers still working it wasn’t hard to get around apparently. Demand is too high. so just anecdotally I would be very surprised if it was a significant factor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TenYearToGetMyMoneyBack Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 This basically answers most of your questions https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/bristol-news/amerind-grove-care-home-village-7677211 It has already happened to two care homes locally. The easiest way to make money from a care home is to demolish it and sell the land. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddog Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 There is no shortage of people that want to be doctors. Why not open the medical schools up and get many more doctors trained up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
msi Posted January 9, 2023 Share Posted January 9, 2023 50 minutes ago, reddog said: There is no shortage of people that want to be doctors. Why not open the medical schools up and get many more doctors trained up? Short Term: Sheer cost - £150K per student Long Term: Wage Premium. Can't charge the big bucks for consultants if you have too many coming through so keep limits on teaching places, training spots etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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