Unmoderated Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 Apologies if already posted but I couldn't locate it. I listened to this the other night and found it really interesting. Discusses laws of rent but also other socio-economic impacts. Part one (Ep. 434) talks about the end of the city especially in New York. 46 minutes. Enjoy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12fixer Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 You've forgotten the link... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pindar Posted October 23, 2020 Share Posted October 23, 2020 And there was me thinking "they" wanted to herd us all in to "smart cities". This exodus from cities seems to buck that trend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Badhairday Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 link? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biggus Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 It's got to be this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02TsXT7cY_Q Brings to mind a BBC documentary from many years ago called Nightmare in the City that Never Sleeps. It was about the bond strike and black outs in late 1970s New York. Really good, if you can find it. The BBC now block it as it does not fit in with their big government narrative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 Surely as we are all consumers, business moves to where the consumers are....empty flats are not consuming, few tourists are not consuming, working from a distant location is consuming in another place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adarmo Posted October 24, 2020 Share Posted October 24, 2020 https://freakonomics.com/podcast/urban-flight-part-2/ Very interesting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregBowman Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Surely as we are all consumers, business moves to where the consumers are....empty flats are not consuming, few tourists are not consuming, working from a distant location is consuming in another place. Yep and it will move back when they move back I suspect the death of cities is a premature obituary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Yep and it will move back when they move back I suspect the death of cities is a premature obituary Cities are not dead, they are just not as necessary as they once wete, people / businesses will move back when there is something worth moving back for.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adarmo Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Yep and it will move back when they move back I suspect the death of cities is a premature obituary Yes, people will always be pulled into cities. What is interesting about the podcast is that even that US city 'Flint, Michigan' infamous for poisonous tap water is still expensive versus local wages. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adarmo Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Cities are not dead, they are just not as necessary as they once wete, people / businesses will move back when there is something worth moving back for.... These days it isn't so much the work as the social side imho. That said i turned then a career in high finance because i really didn't want to slum it in London. Hopefully that 'You need to be in London' nonsense abates now people see you can work from home. I'm really interested to see the impact Elon's 5g satellite cluster has when people can get fast and reliable internet access anywhere. Will people flock to a barn conversion in rural Wales or stay in city centre? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 These days it isn't so much the work as the social side imho. That said i turned then a career in high finance because i really didn't want to slum it in London. Hopefully that 'You need to be in London' nonsense abates now people see you can work from home. I'm really interested to see the impact Elon's 5g satellite cluster has when people can get fast and reliable internet access anywhere. Will people flock to a barn conversion in rural Wales or stay in city centre? A barn conversion in rural Wales is rather extreme.....look at the more medium sized towns with connection, homes being built on surrounding fields.....places where the traffic still flows, no charge to drive to enter.....new businesses and services popping up to cater for new people....people make their own entertainment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adarmo Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 A barn conversion in rural Wales is rather extreme.....look at the more medium sized towns with connection, homes being built on surrounding fields.....places where the traffic still flows, no charge to drive to enter.....new businesses and services popping up to cater for new people....people make their own entertainment. Agreed, i was more showing both ends of the scale, central London versus empty valley. I live in a good sized market town 10 minutes flat easy walk to the centre. Love having so much on my doorstep on one side of the town and literally open fields on the other. The town is a decent night out and has many independent and chain (Cotes etc) restaurants. Very lucky to live here (but i had to work hard and even then buy a wreck and work even harder lol). I agree the cities aren't dead but i think they'll lose some pricing differential in the coming years..... Just my humble opinion. I think the nice towns that are doable into London for one or two days a week are the winners. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted October 25, 2020 Share Posted October 25, 2020 Agreed, i was more showing both ends of the scale, central London versus empty valley. I live in a good sized market town 10 minutes flat easy walk to the centre. Love having so much on my doorstep on one side of the town and literally open fields on the other. The town is a decent night out and has many independent and chain (Cotes etc) restaurants. Very lucky to live here (but i had to work hard and even then buy a wreck and work even harder lol). I agree the cities aren't dead but i think they'll lose some pricing differential in the coming years..... Just my humble opinion. I think the nice towns that are doable into London for one or two days a week are the winners. Most towns are doable anywhere for two days a week.....why, it is quicker and cheaper to get to cities and towns in Europe than driving to some cities here.....some people can now work and or entertain themselves almost anywhere.....even on a laptop in the departure lounge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkG Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 And there was me thinking "they" wanted to herd us all in to "smart cities". This exodus from cities seems to buck that trend. The 'elite' want the useful people to leave the cities, while the useless remain behind in cities living on UBI. Then they barricade the cities, shut off the UBI and start the Great Cull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 The 'elite' want the useful people to leave the cities, while the useless remain behind in cities living on UBI. Then they barricade the cities, shut off the UBI and start the Great Cull. The elite have all gone off to live in China, right? Isn't that another one of your demented ravings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregBowman Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 These days it isn't so much the work as the social side imho. That said i turned then a career in high finance because i really didn't want to slum it in London. Hopefully that 'You need to be in London' nonsense abates now people see you can work from home. I'm really interested to see the impact Elon's 5g satellite cluster has when people can get fast and reliable internet access anywhere. Will people flock to a barn conversion in rural Wales or stay in city centre? Think the soviet state of Wales might of made itself a less attractive place for a few years now 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unmoderated Posted October 26, 2020 Author Share Posted October 26, 2020 Think the soviet state of Wales might of made itself a less attractive place for a few years now 😉 I think you're right. Not to mention the locals. There was the video of that ballbag kicking off in Tesco like it's his human right to not be denied the ability to purchase anything. The utter cretin also not wearing a mask... regardless of the discussions on here about them they do make a marginal difference and frankly that's a difference we should all take. 10% here and 5% there gets us to a sensible R value until this vaccine comes out and we can go back to normality. Wales is lovely but it's also fricking backwards. I guess there's been a brain drain with freedom of movement into what was the economic and military superpower for two centuries. I guess that's why it's cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 A barn conversion in rural Wales is rather extreme.....look at the more medium sized towns with connection, homes being built on surrounding fields.....places where the traffic still flows, no charge to drive to enter.....new businesses and services popping up to cater for new people....people make their own entertainment. Ah, the building as people move out, thus turning the places they head to into (smaller) versions of what they left, what a wonderful change Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GregBowman Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 I think you're right. Not to mention the locals. There was the video of that ballbag kicking off in Tesco like it's his human right to not be denied the ability to purchase anything. The utter cretin also not wearing a mask... regardless of the discussions on here about them they do make a marginal difference and frankly that's a difference we should all take. 10% here and 5% there gets us to a sensible R value until this vaccine comes out and we can go back to normality. Wales is lovely but it's also fricking backwards. I guess there's been a brain drain with freedom of movement into what was the economic and military superpower for two centuries. I guess that's why it's cheap. Totally agree with the mask thing until we have a vaccine simple precautions are the way ahead imho. It is rather like tax saving you do it in 2 and 3% slices the cumulative effect is noticeable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unmoderated Posted October 26, 2020 Author Share Posted October 26, 2020 Totally agree with the mask thing until we have a vaccine simple precautions are the way ahead imho. It is rather like tax saving you do it in 2 and 3% slices the cumulative effect is noticeable Yep (on the mask and tax front). Sky Cycling mantra was it's hard to get 10% improvement in one area but easy to get 1% in ten areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pindar Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 The 'elite' want the useful people to leave the cities, while the useless remain behind in cities living on UBI. Then they barricade the cities, shut off the UBI and start the Great Cull. Remember all the new ghost cities in China? Basically brand new, empty cities built from scratch. I think these would make ideal techno-gulags. The allure of the smart cities is sure to be irresistible for many. The tendency towards concentrating humans into small geographical areas is certain to continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trampa501 Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Most things are actually either cheaper (or more accessible) in cities than in say a village or small town, with the exception of accommodation costs. Public transport is more widely available, and often good value. Budget chain shops like Aldi, Poundland, Primark - found in cities not in small places. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Orange Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Wales is lovely but it's also fricking backwards. I guess there's been a brain drain with freedom of movement into what was the economic and military superpower for two centuries. I guess that's why it's cheap. Yeah, I sense a large minority of Welsh people are scarily parochial and unfriendly, even Cardiff nerds (I went to a Cardiff convention and I bumped into a clique of professional, youngish looking Cardiff people and they didn't want to deal with anybody). I think the UK's got the problem of its cities inhabited by deeply unpleasant, unsocial people - when trying to engage with a Bristolian or Londoner, you just get a hostile/funny look (which is why thousands when offered the choice, choose to leave). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Ah, the building as people move out, thus turning the places they head to into (smaller) versions of what they left, what a wonderful change Things are forever changing....why shouldn't where you live change?...not all changes are favourable always. Wonder how many Welsh jumped onto a car or on a plane on Friday to spend their lockdown somewhere else less lockdowned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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