Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

[Arpeggio]

11 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Have a look at the reports into EU migration, they contribute more than they take out. They played their part, while our government knowingly underfunded all of our infrastructure services.    

Even our own government admits this is barely true. With references to government: https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/briefing-paper/386

[Confusion of VIs]

9 minutes ago, Arpeggio said:

Even our own government admits this is barely true. With references to government: https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/briefing-paper/386

Barely true does equal true though.

 

26 minutes ago, Riedquat said:

No, as has been explained before that makes both the EU and the UK government contributors to the issue, and even though there's a good argument that Westminster's actions have made the biggest - perhaps even the lion's share - of impact that doesn't mean that the EU is not also part of it. That holds IMO even if it's not a deliberate effort on the part of the EU, i.e. being a member is one of the tools Westminster has used, and thus an argument on the side of taking away the tool.

Brexit is not going to change this.

The tool will not be taken away, just renamed after implementing the controls that were always part of FoM.

FoM always was going to come back into balance, the only way Brexit will affect this is by making us a poorer and therefore less attractive country. 

Edited November 8, 2018 by Confusion of VIs

[kzb]

23 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Because it is not illegal, you are getting annoyed about something you have just made up.

I'm sure C4 News could whip it up into a case.  The second referendum campaigners have accepted donations from a non-UK citizen.  It may be that no crime has been committed if there is no second referendum admittedly.  But it is a potential crime.

[kzb]

11 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Have a look at the reports into EU migration, they contribute more than they take out. They played their part, while our government knowingly underfunded all of our infrastructure services.   

If that were true, the tax take would have made more funds available for services.  In fact we were running a record deficit and state spending had to be got under control. 

The whole election campaign previous to the last was about the deficit if you remember.  Any politician who forgot to mention the deficit was scorned remorselessly.

[jonb2]

1 hour ago, kzb said:

Not saying that at all.  There are big problems.

 But the answer is certainly not to go after certain organisations because you disagree with them, and turn a blind eye to all the other corruption.

That would be a banana republic way of doing things surely.

George Soros (not a UK citizen) is on record of donating funds to the second referendum campaign.  This is not legal.  Why is Channel 4 not kicking up a fuss over this?

If you are worried about rigged elections, your first area to look at is postal votes, believe me.

I not sure why you are worried about Soros.

There are other foreigners doing far worse than supporting a second referendum - at least it's above board and his intent is clear. Unlike the corrupt shit-show of the ERG.

https://www.opendemocracy.net/uk/james-cusick/second-bank-account-mps-demand-probe-into-rees-mogg-s-brexit-group

BTW, the guy that wrote 'The Big Short' is set to make a fortune from Brexit. Like the Westminster maggots and their mates - he's in on the game.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2018-11-05/big-short-s-eisman-is-shorting-two-u-k-banks-on-brexit-video

Edited November 8, 2018 by jonb2

[Riedquat]

1 hour ago, IMHAL said:

So I should sue the sweet shop for my bad teeth. We should ban sweets and sweet shops, cars and anything else that could possibly be used in a way that is harmful...freedom needs to be used wisely or it is harmful.....we should take it away so that it can cause us no harm.

That doesn't follow on from what I said. In any case sometimes you need to take freedoms away from those who use them irresponsibly (not that we're talking about sensible freedoms). I don't have a problem with dangerous drivers being banned from using cars.

Edited November 8, 2018 by Riedquat

[Riedquat]

1 hour ago, Arpeggio said:

Even our own government admits this is barely true. With references to government: https://www.migrationwatchuk.org/briefing-paper/386

Even if they do the non economic aspects have been damaging. The post you were replying to complained about underfunding of infrastructure - infrastructure that generally wouldn't have been needed without having to support more people, and which is often unpleasant in its own right. Net result - creaking infrastructure or more unpleasant surroundings to our lives, or both. But whoopee, GDP's a little higher and that's the one and only thing in this world that matters.

[GrizzlyDave]

8 hours ago, kzb said:

Not saying that at all.  There are big problems.

 But the answer is certainly not to go after certain organisations because you disagree with them, and turn a blind eye to all the other corruption.

That would be a banana republic way of doing things surely.

George Soros (not a UK citizen) is on record of donating funds to the second referendum campaign.  This is not legal.  Why is Channel 4 not kicking up a fuss over this?

If you are worried about rigged elections, your first area to look at is postal votes, believe me.

It’s all corrupt!

8 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

But it's nothing to do with our membership of the EU, how could it be when we opted not to use the controls available to us.

 

Hammer time

8 hours ago, Riedquat said:

No, as has been explained before that makes both the EU and the UK government contributors to the issue, and even though there's a good argument that Westminster's actions have made the biggest - perhaps even the lion's share - of impact that doesn't mean that the EU is not also part of it. That holds IMO even if it's not a deliberate effort on the part of the EU, i.e. being a member is one of the tools Westminster has used, and thus an argument on the side of taking away the tool.

This ^

7 hours ago, Dorkins said:

Feel free to do better, dense areas voting leave is your hypothesis.

My rational is based on;

 

ENGLAND 427 km^2 LEAVE 53.4%

WALES 151 km^2 LEAVE 52.5%

NIRELAND 138 km^2 LEAVE 42.2%

SCOTLAND 70 km^2 LEAVE 38%

 

 

This gives a Correlation of 0.73

 

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/281322/population-density-in-the-united-kingdom-uk-by-country/

Edited November 8, 2018 by GrizzlyDave

[kzb]

On ‎06‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 05:25, rollover said:

No way, I don’t think so.

I don't want to offend anyone, but people in higher age 65+ develop often dementia and alzheimer in higher numbers and the illness progresses with the age.

Careful, this could be defined as a hate crime retrospectively.

[pig]

22 hours ago, GrizzlyDave said:

No

This issue is about free movement of goods without the need for a Customs Union.

Ok - so you want a closed border not an open border then ?

[pig]

21 hours ago, Byron said:

Wiki

However French assistance was provided to Argentina, a team of French technicians stayed in Argentina throughout the war and repaired faulty Exocet missile launchers

 

22 hours ago, Confusion of VIs said:

Ok, Daily Express readers.

Wow. OK then.  So this nationalist 'problem' is a tad more endemic than I thought.

[GrizzlyDave]

10 minutes ago, pig said:

Ok - so you want a closed border not an open border then ?

No I want an open border without a customs union

[Confusion of VIs]

Just now, GrizzlyDave said:

No I want an open border without a customs union

In plain English, you want a border witout a border.

[Confusion of VIs]

2 hours ago, kzb said:

I'm sure C4 News could whip it up into a case.  The second referendum campaigners have accepted donations from a non-UK citizen.  It may be that no crime has been committed if there is no second referendum admittedly.  But it is a potential crime.

In the same way thatay doing. 70mph on a motorway is a potential crime because at some point in the future speed restrictions may be introduced?

 

2 hours ago, kzb said:

If that were true, the tax take would have made more funds available for services.  In fact we were running a record deficit and state spending had to be got under control. 

The whole election campaign previous to the last was about the deficit if you remember.  Any politician who forgot to mention the deficit was scorned remorselessly.

According to the government it did, you seem to be expecting immigrants to take responsibility for balancing the UK's budget. That's quite a big ask.

[jonb2]

Well, it just keeps getting better and better. First Davies, now Raab.

I have no idea why leavers believe anything the Brexiteers tell them. Blind faith - literally.

https://inews.co.uk/news/brexit/dominic-raab-admits-he-did-not-understand-how-reliant-uk-trade-is-on-dover-calais-crossing/

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/dominc-raab-i-had-not-quite-understood-importance-of-dover-calais-crossing-1-5769678

 

[yodigo]

3 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Well, it just keeps getting better and better. First Davies, now Raab.

I have no idea why leavers believe anything the Brexiteers tell them. Blind faith - literally.

https://inews.co.uk/news/brexit/dominic-raab-admits-he-did-not-understand-how-reliant-uk-trade-is-on-dover-calais-crossing/

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/dominc-raab-i-had-not-quite-understood-importance-of-dover-calais-crossing-1-5769678

 

Leaving the EU is a political decision, not an economic one. Perhaps remoaners should learn the difference.

[jonb2]

Well, this will please deal old RQ - all hands to the deck of HMS Brexit, slipping and sinking faster and faster into the new mire of nothingness.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/nov/08/mps-condemn-raid-on-hundreds-of-environment-staff-to-work-on-brexit

Not sure what they will be doing. Maybe building big beautiful walls?

 

[GrizzlyDave]

20 minutes ago, Confusion of VIs said:

In plain English, you want a border witout a border.

Yes. Tell me why not...

There is already a firearms, fireworks, medicine, explosives, tobacco, red diesel, and alchohol border; without a border.

[smash]

18 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Well, it just keeps getting better and better. First Davies, now Raab.

I have no idea why leavers believe anything the Brexiteers tell them. Blind faith - literally.

https://inews.co.uk/news/brexit/dominic-raab-admits-he-did-not-understand-how-reliant-uk-trade-is-on-dover-calais-crossing/

https://www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/dominc-raab-i-had-not-quite-understood-importance-of-dover-calais-crossing-1-5769678

 

Its just embarrassing, what a fecking clown. It would be like a defence secretary saying "I hadn't fully appreciated the value of military aircraft during times of conflict"

Edited November 8, 2018 by smash

[jonb2]

1 minute ago, yodigo said:

Leaving the EU is a political decision, not an economic one. Perhaps remoaners should learn the difference.

A baseless argument.

Tell me, what are the advantages of Brexit for the common man? You know, ones that will make a difference. What politically is going to be different? We still have exactly the same system, with the same useless politicians. Or do you know of secret plans for turning Westminster into a tourist attraction and sacking the 650 odd MPs who have run this country down for the last 40 years? Have you seen the blueprint for a brand new system of governance here which provides a better and fairer future?

Or are you just happy people that are far richer than you are going to be even richer as they privatise, evade tax and asset strip without any restraint?

I'll be interested in your enlightening me - as I am not privy to the great political change you are inferring from Brexit.

 

[GrizzlyDave]

2 minutes ago, smash said:

Its just embarrassing, what a fecking clown. It would be like a defence secretary saying "I hadn't fully appreciated to value of military aircraft during times of conflict"

He’s a patsy.

Room meat.

A human shield for Theresa May before she delivers Soft Fudge Brexit.

[jonb2]

10 minutes ago, GrizzlyDave said:

Yes. Tell me why not...

There is already a firearms, fireworks, medicine, explosives, tobacco, red diesel, and alchohol border; without a border.

Now we know why the 400 EA people are going to be doing.

Post Brexit Britain. No longer a nation of shop-keepers. A nation of customs officials.

[jonb2]

4 minutes ago, GrizzlyDave said:

He’s a patsy.

Room meat.

A human shield for Theresa May before she delivers Soft Fudge Brexit.

Don't forget the other ministers - Johnson, Davis, Fox, Patel and Gove? Their vision has taken us far into Willie Wonker's Wonderland too.

[GrizzlyDave]

6 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Now we know why the 400 EA people are going to be doing.

Post Brexit Britain. No longer a nation of shop-keepers. A nation of customs officials.

The border is invisible - and yet monitored and policed today.

What is more of a threat? Firearms and explosives smuggle across the invisible border, or a crate of knock off my little ponies?

Lets get real here this is about tax revenue.

[GrizzlyDave]

2 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Don't forget the other ministers - Johnson, Davis, Fox, Patel and Gove? Their vision has taken us far into Willie Wonker's Wonderland too.

Trail blazers through the Mine field.