Give British Workers Jobs

[SarahBell]

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/sec-brits-jobs-not-migrants-033833055.html

Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan Smith is set to issue a plea to businesses to take on jobless British youths - rather than migrant workers.

Can businesses be sued for discriminating against better qualified foreign workers?

"Good immigration is managed immigration - it should not be an excuse to import labour to take up posts which could be filled by people already in Britain," he will say.

I really agree with this - but sadly think our being in the EU means it's a no-go.

[Number79]

Wasnt that soundbite worn out already?

"British jobs for British workers" by the same bunch that encouraged foreign workers to flood here to fuel a boom?

[bomberbrown]

http://uk.news.yahoo...-033833055.html

Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan Smith is set to issue a plea to businesses to take on jobless British youths - rather than migrant workers.

Can businesses be sued for discriminating against better qualified foreign workers?

"Good immigration is managed immigration - it should not be an excuse to import labour to take up posts which could be filled by people already in Britain," he will say.

I really agree with this - but sadly think our being in the EU means it's a no-go.

Sadly, Iain Duncan Smith is talking out of his backside in a classic case of putting the horse before the cart. Thanks to a flawed and most generous benefit system coupled with a decade of HPI, UK employers simply can't pay enough wages to the youngish British jobless to incentivise them away from 'free' Jobseekers Allowance, Local Housing Allowance, Council Tax Benefit, Dental treatment etc etc.

They'd need to start on around 25k a year, particularly in London, just to break even!

What a mess!!

Edited July 1, 2011 by bomberbrown

[MrFlibble]

Cannot be achieved without kissing goodbye to the EU...

[Patfig]

Cannot be achieved without kissing goodbye to the EU...

Maybe it's time to pucker up

[leicestersq]

Cannot be achieved without kissing goodbye to the EU...

Or the EU going meltdown.

It is better to walk away ourselves, but heh, if the other side walks that does the job too.

[Superted187]

It's a free market economy, but please be nice and do this instead of that.

We won't enforce this by law, but will just ask nicely, even't though we're in power.

What drivel.

[Nationalist]

The is no way a British worker supporting a spouse and a couple of kids can compete with immigrants living 10 to a house including a few sleeping in the kitchen. Just can't and won't happen. Using immigrant labour is national suicide; it's a quick jolt to GDP followed by terminal decline.

The only question I have is: Is our funeral pyre high enough yet?

[tomwatkins]

The is no way a British worker supporting a spouse and a couple of kids can compete with immigrants living 10 to a house including a few sleeping in the kitchen. Just can't and won't happen. Using immigrant labour is national suicide; it's a quick jolt to GDP followed by terminal decline.

The only question I have is: Is our funeral pyre high enough yet?

Nope...no MP's on it yet.

[unclefester]

Sadly, Iain Duncan Smith is talking out of his backside in a classic case of putting the horse before the cart. Thanks to a flawed and most generous benefit system coupled with a decade of HPI, UK employers simply can't pay enough wages to the youngish British jobless to incentivise them away from 'free' Jobseekers Allowance, Local Housing Allowance, Council Tax Benefit, Dental treatment etc etc.

They'd need to start on around 25k a year, particularly in London, just to break even!

What a mess!!

Nail on head - its beyond me why the politicos fail to see this basic truth

[bomberbrown]

Nail on head - its beyond me why the politicos fail to see this basic truth

Thanks, I know. I think the politicos do know deep down the mess we're really in, but none of them want to deal with it.

I forgot to say, a few years ago, I was on or would have been on here lambasting these people as lazy indigenous brits too idle to get off their arses and get jobs. Now I can't seem to blame them for taking the benefits option, you'd have to be mad not to!!

This situation is ONLY undoable with some serious future economic hardship, the only question being, to which group of people will this hardship fall on?

[@contradevian]

Nope...no MP's on it yet.

No but there will be. The only way those chunts will start acting in our interests is the threat of some decent quality rope and 650 odd lamp posts.

The whole "plea" thing from a supposed Government Minister is sickening, because as we all know its a corporate fascist state and he has to ask nicely.

Edited July 1, 2011 by John Steed

[Goat]

Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan Smith is set to issue a plea to businesses to take on jobless British youths - rather than migrant workers.

Nice idea, unfortunately:

British youth can't read or write

Too many young people are unable to read, write or communicate properly and do not work hard

And the teachers responsible for this mess claim that they're worth gold plated pensions paid for by the rest of us.

[@contradevian]

Nice idea, unfortunately:

British youth can't read or write

Err neither can a lot of immigrants. Strangely not a bar to employment it seems.

[swissy_fit]

From the employers point of view it's a no-brainer who to choose.

Unless they have a serious financial incentive to choose the young Brit, it's not going to happen.

Apprenticeships are used here by the Swiss in a classically pragmatic way - employers abuse the system to get cheap labour BUT young people become employable.

[alexw]

Sadly, Iain Duncan Smith is talking out of his backside in a classic case of putting the horse before the cart. Thanks to a flawed and most generous benefit system coupled with a decade of HPI, UK employers simply can't pay enough wages to the youngish British jobless to incentivise them away from 'free' Jobseekers Allowance, Local Housing Allowance, Council Tax Benefit, Dental treatment etc etc.

They'd need to start on around 25k a year, particularly in London, just to break even!

What a mess!!

Rubbish. The benefits young jobless people can claim generally amount to no more than 8K a year. £53 a week jobseekers allowance, maybe 1k a year reduced rate council tax, and ~£70 per week shared accomodation housing allowance.

http://landlordportfolio.com/landlord-clinic/

For london the housing allowance is more like £90. So make that 9K a year in london.

Its got nothing to do with not being able to afford uk youngsters, just that they don't want to pay more than minimum wage and with the flood of desperate eastern europeans they dont need to. Hence the declining wages at the bottom end that we have all witnessed with those monies redirected to the top. Jobs that used to pay the equivalent of 7,8,9 pounds per hour now pay 5 or 6.

Edited July 1, 2011 by alexw

[cica]

The is no way a British worker supporting a spouse and a couple of kids can compete with immigrants living 10 to a house including a few sleeping in the kitchen. Just can't and won't happen. Using immigrant labour is national suicide; it's a quick jolt to GDP followed by terminal decline.

The only question I have is: Is our funeral pyre high enough yet?

Our problems are house prices, crap government, subsidising non-work, paying a fortune to teach people BS degrees, bailing out millionaires etc.

It ain't the immigrants doing this. That's a symptom.

The immigrants would not be coming and they'd find competition from the natives MUCH tougher otherwise. The immigrants are being given the opportunity.

If we block immigration that'll fix the rest? Don't think so. Start with the causes.

Edited July 1, 2011 by cica

[pathfinder]

Working on a NMW salary, half your salary goes on renting a bedroom in shared accommodation (who wants to stay at home for good), another quarter on bills and living expenses your left with £200 to spare cash.

Seriously that's not going to cover holiday spending money/the odd treat, let alone savings. In the mid 90's you could get a 10k job easy, 3 years on 20k was possible even with few qualifications, just on the back of some smarts between the ears and a good work ethic. Now its blood, sweat and tears for 11k with no job prospects, or with a 9k a year degree clasp at 18-22k with little prospect of promotion. If I was the next generation I would give the royal salute to working too.

[Self Employed Youth]

Sadly, Iain Duncan Smith is talking out of his backside in a classic case of putting the horse before the cart. Thanks to a flawed and most generous benefit system coupled with a decade of HPI, UK employers simply can't pay enough wages to the youngish British jobless to incentivise them away from 'free' Jobseekers Allowance, Local Housing Allowance, Council Tax Benefit, Dental treatment etc etc.

They'd need to start on around 25k a year, particularly in London, just to break even!

What a mess!!

I am going to get myself fired on 3rd August. Claim on the 4th. Dentist on the 5th.

'Unemployed again youth'.

******JOB ******SYSTEM *****

I have some cash in hand lined up.

[Timak]

If you are Romanian and used to earning £200 a month then moving to Britain for 3 years working 50 hour weeks for £6 an hour enables you to save £30k (when cost of living in a shared room and basic food is included).

£30k buys a lot in Romania and is therefore worth the sacrifice of 3 years of your young life

Now our young could do the same but £30k is barely enough for a deposit on a house that you wouldn't be able to afford to pay the mortgage on.

[@contradevian]

I am going to get myself fired on 3rd August. Claim on the 4th. Dentist on the 5th.

'Unemployed again youth'.

******JOB ******SYSTEM *****

I have some cash in hand lined up.

Good for you mate. Be even better when you are old enough for working tax credits. Whats good enough for bankers is good for everyone else IMO

Edited July 1, 2011 by John Steed

[Chesnor]

Apprenticeships are used here by the Swiss in a classically pragmatic way - employers abuse the system to get cheap labour BUT young people become employable.

It was like that here once. I think everyone (I certainly did when I was an apprentice) understood this. You get paid peanuts for a few years, make tea, collect left-handed screwdrivers, get thrown in rivers, locked in boxes, etc.. but you also get training.

If you remove the "training" part of the deal, where is any incentive. Non-immigrant kids, raised in a welfare state with a media that lionises success and celebrity to the nth degree just won't accept being treated as transitory labour without the promise of future pay dirt. Immigrants will because they're not kids, they are willing to live 8 to a 3 bed house plus they know the one thing that most kids don't. Moving between jobs is far easier than stepping into one from the dole or education.

So really it's a case of EU/non-EU immigrants (not-youth) pricing UK youth out of work. Great for short termist business types who are convinced they are magical wealth creators, but ultimately it's an own goal. The welfare state will expand, they will be taxed more as a result, society (if it exists) will fester, immigration will continue apace, and their businesses will ultimately fail.

[leicestersq]

Rubbish. The benefits young jobless people can claim generally amount to no more than 8K a year. £53 a week jobseekers allowance, maybe 1k a year reduced rate council tax, and ~£70 per week shared accomodation housing allowance.

http://landlordportfolio.com/landlord-clinic/

For london the housing allowance is more like £90. So make that 9K a year in london.

Its got nothing to do with not being able to afford uk youngsters, just that they don't want to pay more than minimum wage and with the flood of desperate eastern europeans they dont need to. Hence the declining wages at the bottom end that we have all witnessed with those monies redirected to the top. Jobs that used to pay the equivalent of 7,8,9 pounds per hour now pay 5 or 6.

The incentives for single people don't seem to be a problem, except there is a big benefit in working cash in hand and claiming if you can.

But what about those with kids. What do all the benefits look like then? Is it worth working?

[Blod]

The excuse that our kids don't have the skilled is nonsense however its the will to work that's missing and the reasons highlighted are why. If the residents of a country enjoy a lower cost of living and they are also able to accept the hardship of a few years working abroad then coming to the UK and roughing it is a ticket to a nice start in life when you return home.

I remember an interview of a restaurant owner in brick lane declaring that he faced ruin if he wouldn't be allowed to employ his staff from abroad. He was asked why they had to come from abroad and he said that it was the only way to get genuine chefs to which the interview ask why not use our domestic chefs was cost also an issue. He denied that it was cost but you could tell that was the reason and as soon as they asked for more money they'd be shown the door.

Migrants working in the UK are on the whole being fleeced and as soon as they cotton on to how they're being used they just hop onto the next best job. It always feels to be like these people are being treated like chattels or for that matter slaves. Its another hypocrisy created by NuLabour.

[Trampa501]

Sadly, Iain Duncan Smith is talking out of his backside in a classic case of putting the horse before the cart. Thanks to a flawed and most generous benefit system coupled with a decade of HPI, UK employers simply can't pay enough wages to the youngish British jobless to incentivise them away from 'free' Jobseekers Allowance, Local Housing Allowance, Council Tax Benefit, Dental treatment etc etc.

I do feel this argument is inaccurate and flawed. Most youngsters will earn far more on minimum wage than claiming dole, as they'll be living at home. Ok, so a small percentage (single mothers especially) will be able to catch themselves a council flat, but this isn't an option in many areas now. Your average youngster won't be interested in free dental treatment, if they can have £200 disposible income a week from their job to spend on fashion, music, going out etc.

However, the case is that employers have been convinced (perhaps with good reason) that UK youngsters are a write-off, and that workers from EE countries are a superior race. Yes, it may well be that Maria or Pieter have a better educational standard, and come across better than local youth who will pepper their speech with "bruv" and "innit". But what are the long term costs of writing off your own population? Is it a failing in education or society standards, that foreign migrant workers are preferred to the local workforce? I have every sympathy with IDS's plea, but suspect it won't make any difference to the situation.

Edit: When i go to places in the UK where there hasn't been such a big influx of migrant workers eg Derbyshire or Cornwall, they seem to manage ok with local workers in the shops, offices, bus stations etc. I don't buy the argument that Brits can't or won't work in certain types of job.

Edited July 1, 2011 by Trampa501