simon99 Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 3 minutes ago, Staffsknot said: Its also that 'leftists' is the dumb nebulous term like wokeratti tha seems to cover everyone from anyone simply not agreeing with a daft position right through to Pol Pot. As I pointed out the wingnuts have me down as a leftistfascist, which even Alexei Sayle couldn't make a sketch out of. Remember if you clapped for the NHS you are a patriot, say they should be paid better and you are an evil leftist. Simon is also correct he is ignored, when someone replies to him it becomes visible... Well that's a real shame. Like I say you never seem to have a problem when people use the term Right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 31 minutes ago, Staffsknot said: An asylum seeker cannot pay a private landlord in England it is literally illegal to rent them a property. This is why they are housed in hotels, hostels, guest houses and converted army barracks. This is why when the Gov goes on about hotel usage they literally engineered it that way. So are hotels charging us the tax payers more per room to house asylum seekers than they charged customers?......that biddy Stockholm is not cheap, how many living on there at the moment, who benefits from the rent? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 23 minutes ago, winkie said: So are hotels charging us the tax payers more per room to house asylum seekers than they charged customers?......that biddy Stockholm is not cheap, how many living on there at the moment, who benefits from the rent? The rooms are rented often by private contractors who then charge the Home Office. Mates of ministers. Doesn't put up house prices, does line pockets of likes of Serco. Asylum seeker gets food in a hotel so the Govgives them a tenner a week for toiletries. If they go in a guesthouse with no food they get 40 odd quid but have to feed selves. Serco want that extra cash so stick them in catered accomodation or deliver food in bulk. Cheapest stuff they can make and pocket the extra cash But the Gov want you to believe they are interestrd in stopping immigration and to be angry at asylum seekers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dugsbody Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 3 hours ago, simon99 said: There we go, some more. Standard on HPC these days from the usual bunch who don't like any other opinion. I try very hard to avoid insults. In this case I'm afraid, it is deserved. Just try harder not to fall back on idiotic simplicities and you'll be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, dugsbody said: I try very hard to avoid insults. In this case I'm afraid, it is deserved. Just try harder not to fall back on idiotic simplicities and you'll be fine. There we go again. It's a hat-trick for Dug. It's amazing how a few of you are so upset whenever anyone says "the Left" and again it turns into people having a personal pop because they can't handle a differing opinion. People literally voted No in this poll, which in my opinion is worthy of some light mocking of the Left. If the likes of you bothered me Dug I'd have left this forum years ago. Just block me like Staffsknot has, so you don't get upset in future. Edited December 30, 2023 by simon99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 1 hour ago, dugsbody said: I try very hard to avoid insults. In this case I'm afraid, it is deserved. Just try harder not to fall back on idiotic simplicities and you'll be fine. I remember from older that particular poster wants attention and chucks out bait posts. Hasn't actually got anything to back up his posts they just have to be taken as fact. If he checked the earlier pages he'd see in black and white I stated immigration does affect house prices and the economy. Does ability to get credit affect it more - yep absolutely. Do asylum seekers - nope as proved Do immigrants who can't afford rent - nope same as a Brit not able to afford something doesn't increase its price. But apparently that's leftist thinking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 (edited) (duplicate post due to slow website looking like it hadn't posted). Deleted. Edited December 30, 2023 by simon99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted December 30, 2023 Share Posted December 30, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Staffsknot said: I remember from older that particular poster wants attention and chucks out bait posts. Hasn't actually got anything to back up his posts they just have to be taken as fact. If he checked the earlier pages he'd see in black and white I stated immigration does affect house prices and the economy. Does ability to get credit affect it more - yep absolutely. Do asylum seekers - nope as proved Do immigrants who can't afford rent - nope same as a Brit not able to afford something doesn't increase its price. But apparently that's leftist thinking I saw that post, my post wasn't even aimed at you (you've blocked me remember). I think you're referring to a handful of posts where I had an opinion on the Left and Brexit where I said people need to stop whingeing about it and move on (again a perfectly normal opinion which seemed to particularly upset you). People offer opinions on the Right etc, opinions are the whole point of this place, my posts are tame in comparison to others, plus I've always explained my thinking, which just seems to upset you more, so your recollection is wrong. Attention, don't make me laugh, it's an internet forum with a load of pseudonyms. If a handful of you didn't get so upset about my opinions and keep replying/referring to me I would post a lot less. Edited December 30, 2023 by simon99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debtlessmanc Posted December 31, 2023 Share Posted December 31, 2023 (edited) On 27/12/2023 at 16:36, Staffsknot said: There's a whole other thread you have run away from where the 300k figure was broken down and 2/3 of that figure was invited migration by Germany. 425k asylum seekers year to beginning December actually, Germany just fessed up letting in 121k through managed schemes in addition to the 300k+ of unmanaged. https://europeanconservative.com/articles/news/germany-family-reunifications-add-nearly-a-million-migrants-in-less-than-a-decade/ The system will collapse with the on-going growth of demand for asylum. Â Edited December 31, 2023 by debtlessmanc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 On 12/31/2023 at 9:46 AM, debtlessmanc said: 425k asylum seekers year to beginning December actually, Germany just fessed up letting in 121k through managed schemes in addition to the 300k+ of unmanaged. https://europeanconservative.com/articles/news/germany-family-reunifications-add-nearly-a-million-migrants-in-less-than-a-decade/ The system will collapse with the on-going growth of demand for asylum.  Ah so you have discovered yet more of the safe and legal routes BAMF includes that you claimed had been limited to 30k because you found 1 had. Families reunification are not first time asylum seekers so are not part of the original circa 300k. It is a different migration system to asylum seekers as even the author admits. Same as student visa are different to asylum seekers. But you have amply demonstrated again you do not know about safe and legal routes or migration types, nor a clue what that 30k figure in the EU you found relates to, nor what the stats you keep shouting about are. Also you have shown us where you get your news from, the European Conservative - the 'traditionalist' view that likes Mr Orban and the author of this particular piece "Formerly of Breitbart News" that bastion of dogturd journalism All on New Year's Eve too. So as I said you don't know anything about the immigration debate you always run to, claim things based on ignorance and deliberate lies and it clearly touched a nerve that you spent New Years Eve on this. Not the great reveal you thought. So no 305k of asylum seekers still, or do you think that is total immigration to Germany? What a great way to sign off the yearin style manc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamnumerate Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 On 29/12/2023 at 14:13, dugsbody said: And there you go, another idiot tries this straw man. A straw man does not exist as @simon99 said someone voted no so must exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 23 minutes ago, iamnumerate said: A straw man does not exist as @simon99 said someone voted no so must exist. Yes, 4 people so far. These details don't matter though, the usual tactics are on display by our resident lovelies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 27 minutes ago, iamnumerate said: A straw man does not exist as @simon99 said someone voted no so must exist. 4 people voted no but as its anonymous you have no idea who they are or what their politics are. So his 'everyone on the left' attempted strawman was exactly that and a cheap attempt for him to do yet another 'evil leftists' rant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Staffsknot said: 4 people voted no but as its anonymous you have no idea who they are or what their politics are. So his 'everyone on the left' attempted strawman was exactly that and a cheap attempt for him to do yet another 'evil leftists' rant It must have been the shortest "rant" in history. I think it's fairly safe assumption they are on the left to vote No to such a poll. "Evil"? - ridiculous emotive language. You're very touchy about the "left", yet seemingly no problem when others make much worse and insulting generalizations about the "right". It's very odd I get singled out for my innocuous posts. Edited January 2 by simon99 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamnumerate Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 10 minutes ago, Staffsknot said: 4 people voted no but as its anonymous you have no idea who they are or what their politics are. So his 'everyone on the left' attempted strawman was exactly that and a cheap attempt for him to do yet another 'evil leftists' rant Surely saying everyone is an exaggeration rather than a strawman?  It is very depressing that anyone can believe large numbers of people has no effect on house prices. Particularly as immigration does lower interest rates Interest rates would be higher without immigrants - BBC News So if people believe immigration does not increase house prices presumably they believe it does not change interest rates either. Or that interest rates do not change house prices either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 Just now, iamnumerate said: Surely saying everyone is an exaggeration rather than a strawman?  It is very depressing that anyone can believe large numbers of people has no effect on house prices. Particularly as immigration does lower interest rates Interest rates would be higher without immigrants - BBC News So if people believe immigration does not increase house prices presumably they believe it does not change interest rates either. Or that interest rates do not change house prices either. It was an exaggeration yes which obviously is not literally true, a small dig to show up their illogical thinking, this is the real problem they have with me. As ever the resident lovelies don't like anyone giving some back so turn a throwaway one line post about no one specific into pages of them having a personal dig. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 (edited) So do other small countries or countries with higher density areas and numbers of people suffer from negatively high house prices and economy? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-65380148 https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/EN.POP.DNST?locations=RW Â Â Edited January 2 by winkie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 2 minutes ago, iamnumerate said: Surely saying everyone is an exaggeration rather than a strawman?  It is very depressing that anyone can believe large numbers of people has no effect on house prices. Particularly as immigration does lower interest rates Interest rates would be higher without immigrants - BBC News So if people believe immigration does not increase house prices presumably they believe it does not change interest rates either. Or that interest rates do not change house prices either. That's not what he said and he is claiming to know the politics of the 4. He absolutely made a strawman. The biggest driver of house prices is access to credit and large multiples. Immigration only affects house prices if those immigrants are buying otherwise its like footfall in a Ferrari shop and claiming it pushes up Ferrari car prices when most can only get a keyring Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon99 Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 1 minute ago, Staffsknot said: That's not what he said and he is claiming to know the politics of the 4. He absolutely made a strawman. The biggest driver of house prices is access to credit and large multiples. Immigration only affects house prices if those immigrants are buying otherwise its like footfall in a Ferrari shop and claiming it pushes up Ferrari car prices when most can only get a keyring Unlike all the resident lovelies on here who know exactly what I think, better than I do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
14stFlyer Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 3 hours ago, Staffsknot said: Immigration only affects house prices if those immigrants are buying otherwise its like footfall in a Ferrari shop and claiming it pushes up Ferrari car prices when most can only get a keyring Hmm.  Caught in the middle here again.  I would suggest that lots of young men and women (who can’t afford a Ferrari) purchasing a Ferrari key ring does indeed lead to increased long term Ferrari prices. Human aspiration is a strange and powerful thing. This is only my view though.  I have no proof. Likewise, I would suggest that lots of competition at all levels in a housing market leads to aspirational rarity and so increased prices. In effect, we have a whole population of human beings spending more than they should on housing in the UK because of human aspiration.  And even those who cannot afford to buy a house contribute to this. Again, just my view,  I have no proof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pebbles Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 3 hours ago, Staffsknot said: That's not what he said and he is claiming to know the politics of the 4. He absolutely made a strawman. The biggest driver of house prices is access to credit and large multiples. Immigration only affects house prices if those immigrants are buying otherwise its like footfall in a Ferrari shop and claiming it pushes up Ferrari car prices when most can only get a keyring I used to live in west london. My neighbour (immigrant from the 70's i think) was the highest bidder on a house that was then used to house many newly arrived immigrants in pretty terrible conditions because they were prepared to pay that price to live that way. It is inconceivable that immigrants didn't contribute to the price that was paid and their willingness to pay cash in hand to another immigrant. They removed a house from being used (because it is now occupied) therefore reducing supply and whilst the second lot of immigrants didnt buy the property the first landlord couldnt have payed the top price without them. None of this was credit driven because in this community there is family money brothers, sisters, parents and aunts clubbed together to buy. I am relieved to see only 4 people on this forum are economically illiterate enough to believe that supply and demand applies to everything except house prices (when discussing immigration) and labor costs (again when discussing immigration). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huggy Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 (edited) 4 hours ago, Staffsknot said: Immigration only affects house prices if those immigrants are buying otherwise its like footfall in a Ferrari shop and claiming it pushes up Ferrari car prices when most can only get a keyring Immigrants are living in houses though, and someone is paying someone else for the pleasure. That will increase prices. Just like people paying Ferrari owners to sit in the back rather than buying the car itself. You get 1m extra people per year trying to do that, and supercar prices won't be going down. 4 hours ago, iamnumerate said: So if people believe immigration does not increase house prices presumably they believe it does not change interest rates either. Or that interest rates do not change house prices either. But they do believe it will increase prices. They also don't think it's good for the majority in the country either. That's exactly the plan, yet they can't admit it as it would be quite unpopular. Do you think the millionnaire landlord, and Remainer, Tony Blair was thinking about the best interests of the country when he was calling for the Peoples' Second Confirmatory Referendum? Edited January 2 by Huggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 1 hour ago, 14stFlyer said: Hmm.  Caught in the middle here again.  I would suggest that lots of young men and women (who can’t afford a Ferrari) purchasing a Ferrari key ring does indeed lead to increased long term Ferrari prices. Human aspiration is a strange and powerful thing. This is only my view though.  I have no proof. Likewise, I would suggest that lots of competition at all levels in a housing market leads to aspirational rarity and so increased prices. In effect, we have a whole population of human beings spending more than they should on housing in the UK because of human aspiration.  And even those who cannot afford to buy a house contribute to this. Again, just my view,  I have no proof. Aspiration and ability are two separate things Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamnumerate Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 1 hour ago, Pebbles said: I used to live in west london. My neighbour (immigrant from the 70's i think) was the highest bidder on a house that was then used to house many newly arrived immigrants in pretty terrible conditions because they were prepared to pay that price to live that way. It is inconceivable that immigrants didn't contribute to the price that was paid and their willingness to pay cash in hand to another immigrant. They removed a house from being used (because it is now occupied) therefore reducing supply and whilst the second lot of immigrants didnt buy the property the first landlord couldnt have payed the top price without them. None of this was credit driven because in this community there is family money brothers, sisters, parents and aunts clubbed together to buy. I am relieved to see only 4 people on this forum are economically illiterate enough to believe that supply and demand applies to everything except house prices (when discussing immigration) and labor costs (again when discussing immigration). +1 I know someone who I will call joe, who wanted to move to a bigger property but couldn't afford it. So they had lodgers to help them save and with the money bought a bigger property. Although, the lodgers couldn't afford to buy but their rent did help Joe buy another house. Most of Joe's lodgers were immigrants and without them Joe would have had less money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Staffsknot Posted January 2 Share Posted January 2 1 hour ago, Pebbles said: I used to live in west london. My neighbour (immigrant from the 70's i think) was the highest bidder on a house that was then used to house many newly arrived immigrants in pretty terrible conditions because they were prepared to pay that price to live that way. It is inconceivable that immigrants didn't contribute to the price that was paid and their willingness to pay cash in hand to another immigrant. They removed a house from being used (because it is now occupied) therefore reducing supply and whilst the second lot of immigrants didnt buy the property the first landlord couldnt have payed the top price without them. None of this was credit driven because in this community there is family money brothers, sisters, parents and aunts clubbed together to buy. I am relieved to see only 4 people on this forum are economically illiterate enough to believe that supply and demand applies to everything except house prices (when discussing immigration) and labor costs (again when discussing immigration). Supply and demand is as I just said linked to ability to pay. It always is and always will be. There was someone with the ability to pay who paid. He got credit - his family helped supply it and I am guessing by 'family money' you didn't think about BOMAD or inheritance that are also features of the housing market and linked to credit availability and money in the system either. It is economically illiterate to believe that simple supply and demand operatesin isolation. Now your former neighbour landlord was able to cram several immigrants in at substandard accom and in doing so collect smaller rents from less able to pay immigrants - which if he'd done it up for a non-immigrant he'd have charged more for as less people and got similar rate. Its not rocket science this. I can't believe you literally tried to say availabiliy of credit doesn't matter then say he borrowed money off family. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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