Another Russian Spy?

[Peter Hun]

16 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

You'd think he'd want to sell his story to the press

And get murdered by the Russians?

He's a Police Officer - he can't 'sell his story to the press' and its a security issue so Official Secrets Act will apply.

You understand this was a chemical warfare attack, not some reality show entertainment?

[The Eagle]

7 hours ago, Peter Hun said:

You understand this was a chemical warfare attack, not some reality show entertainment?

Seriously?

The victims have recovered and are fine. If this had been a chemical warfare attack with Novichok they would have never woken up from their coma or best case suffered such severe brain damage that they would haven been cripples for the rest of their lives.

So either this Novichok is no more dangerous than a flu or than food poisoning, or they never came into contact with any chemical warfare agent.

Either way it should be patently obvious by now that this was indeed a reality show produced by HM government for our entertainment (or more likely to build up support among the sheeple for a war against Russia).

 

[Peter Hun]

4 hours ago, The Eagle said:

Seriously?

Yes, absolutely. You may not be aware of it but NATO reset its response to the 'special warfare' methods that Russia is using.  Basically, a covert attack like this will be treated as an attack on NATO and a coordinated response would be under taken. 'Proof' is not required as the perpetrator is known in advance, NATO's no.1 enemy Russia. The fact that Russia admitted their guilt and previously refused to extradited the assassins in the Litvinenko case means the approach is correct.

That the victims 'recovered' is irrelevant, we have a antidote and the medical facilities that Russia obviously don't posses. 

 

4 hours ago, The Eagle said:

Either way it should be patently obvious by now that this was indeed a reality show produced by HM government for our entertainment (or more likely to build up support among the sheeple for a war against Russia).

One of the features of Russia's convert warfare is the manipulation of feeble minded westerners by swamping the internet with  Russia agents casting doubt on reality with an explosion of random storylines to make the true disappear in a fog.

This will have zero impact on NATO's response.

Interesting that, so far, NATO is not admitting the missile attack on Syria.

[rollover]

2 hours ago, Peter Hun said:

 

One of the features of Russia's convert warfare is the manipulation of feeble minded westerners ......

Oh yeah, your mind was properly manipulated and your ideas twisted beyond fiction fact. You even believed an unproven fallacies without facts being a true. But all is fine as long the message is believable. Anyway we're living in post-truth era.

It's easier to accept it without questioning and get along with the crowd, it's cool if you want to go where the crowd is going

[Riedquat]

8 hours ago, The Eagle said:

Either way it should be patently obvious by now that this was indeed a reality show produced by HM government for our entertainment (or more likely to build up support among the sheeple for a war against Russia).

And why would we even want a war against Russia? The motives for anyone other than Russia simply don't stack up in any remotely credible form.

I have yet to hear a remotely plausible reason for Russia not being the prime suspect. "The UK government said they are so it must be someone else" argument is what it all seems to boil down to, by people who'd insist the weather was lovely if the government said it was raining, no matter what looking out of the window would tell them.

[The Eagle]

8 hours ago, Peter Hun said:

That the victims 'recovered' is irrelevant, we have a antidote

Oh really? Show me any credible source for this claim.

Quote

One of the features of Russia's convert warfare is the manipulation of feeble minded westerners by swamping the internet with  Russia agents casting doubt on reality with an explosion of random storylines to make the true disappear in a fog.

You are actually talking about our very own MSM. That's why they fear the propagation of truth via the Internet as our MSM lost control of our minds due to it.

It's patently obvious that you 'Peter Hun' are a paid NATO/UK government troll, just like Errol is clearly working for the other side, but the difference is that your posts are completely unbelievable and full of falsities.

 

5 hours ago, Riedquat said:

And why would we even want a war against Russia?

We (the common people) certainly don't want any war, but those in charge of NATO countries (especially US, UK, France) seem to bent on starting new wars all the time. War is big business and big profits.

[Riedquat]

6 minutes ago, The Eagle said:

We (the common people) certainly don't want any war, but those in charge of NATO countries (especially US, UK, France) seem to bent on starting new wars all the time. War is big business and big profits.

War is very expensive. War for the sake of grabbing resources can be a plausible explanation, war for the sake of war, very rarely.

[The Eagle]

1 hour ago, Riedquat said:

War is very expensive.

Very true, war is very expensive for the taxpayer, i.e. for us, but it's very lucrative for the 'elites'. Ask Rumsfeld and his friends how much money they made with the Iraq war and occupation.

In a way war is a mass-redistribution of wealth from the common people to the 'elites'.

[jonb2]

36 minutes ago, The Eagle said:

Very true, war is very expensive for the taxpayer, i.e. for us, but it's very lucrative for the 'elites'. Ask Rumsfeld and his friends how much money they made with the Iraq war and occupation.

In a way war is a mass-redistribution of wealth from the common people to the 'elites'.

So we won't notice the difference then?

Might as well as have a war then - after all there is nothing better to do. i could bag me a Russian Aeroflot passenger jet and blame it on the Danish. Or annex Calais and blame it on the Irish. Maybe I could kill the entire cast of Breakfast TV and blame them for causing unrest by being boring and feminist.

[zugzwang]

30 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

So we won't notice the difference then?

Might as well as have a war then - after all there is nothing better to do. i could bag me a Russian Aeroflot passenger jet and blame it on the Danish. Or annex Calais and blame it on the Irish. Maybe I could kill the entire cast of Breakfast TV and blame them for causing unrest by being boring and feminist.

The UK has been at war almost continuously since the Falklands campaign proved to be such a vote winner for Margaret Thatcher. Small patriotic wars in faraway places, naturally, since the country can barely afford to keep its soldiers supplied. Hiding behind America's skirts the British can satisfy their empire nostalgia and pretend they are still global players rather than arthritic has-beens while risking almost nothing materially. Such was the success of this jingo stance that the Labour Party under Blair embraced it with almost as much enthusiasm as the Tories had done. Of course, Blair is a Neoliberal globalist at heart so the fit was an easy one for him to make personally.

[jonb2]

3 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

The UK has been at war almost continuously since the Falklands campaign proved to be such a vote winner for Margaret Thatcher. Small patriotic wars in faraway places, naturally, since the country can barely afford to keep its soldiers supplied. Hiding behind America's skirts the British can satisfy their empire nostalgia and pretend they are still global players rather than arthritic has-beens while risking almost nothing materially. Such was the success of this jingo stance that the Labour Party under Blair embraced it with almost as much enthusiasm as the Tories had done. Of course, Blair is a Neoliberal globalist at heart so the fit was an easy one for him to make personally.

Agree with all of this Zug.

Doesn't mean we have to bend over though. Taking sides with Russian liars rather than our own liars is going too far.

[zugzwang]

35 minutes ago, jonb2 said:

Agree with all of this Zug.

Doesn't mean we have to bend over though. Taking sides with Russian liars rather than our own liars is going too far.

Factional disputes in the Middle East have nothing whatsoever to do with the UK! The on-going humanitarian disasters in Iraq and Libya should stand as an eternal warning against our involvement in regime change anywhere. As for the Russians, it seems obvious now that the Skripal affair is a softening up exercise to prepare the UK and the West psychologically for a large-scale military operation in Syria. Shameful.

[Big Orange]

33 minutes ago, zugzwang said:

Factional disputes in the Middle East have nothing whatsoever to do with the UK! The on-going humanitarian disasters in Iraq and Libya should stand as an eternal warning against our involvement in regime change anywhere. 

Or the real warning of hideously fractured, unstable societies barely held together by self-serving, psychopathic despots? 

Gaddafi was a fun sized Putin (he also played the West like a fiddle and rigged a oil heavy economy).

[jonb2]

1 hour ago, zugzwang said:

Factional disputes in the Middle East have nothing whatsoever to do with the UK! The on-going humanitarian disasters in Iraq and Libya should stand as an eternal warning against our involvement in regime change anywhere. As for the Russians, it seems obvious now that the Skripal affair is a softening up exercise to prepare the UK and the West psychologically for a large-scale military operation in Syria. Shameful.

It's not as simple as the west is bad and everybody else is good zz. Did you not see my post about the numbers Putin has killed and the picture of Grozny?

There is no doubt, depressingly, that money is talking louder than ever. The arms business is huge and obviously it suits the elites to perpetuate its consumption. However what-about-ism is not what's needed right now. This is the problem:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/07/global-inequality-tipping-point-2030

And Putin is on the top table among the elites. Assad has no compunction in gassing his own people. You will argue it's not true. However the reports have been frequent over the 6 years now and different nerve agents have been used. Quite an elaborate plan for propaganda.

The real problem is closer to home. Why the feck have the Tories not imposed financial sanctions on Putin's mates? This level of corruption belies the inconvenience caused by the Skripal case. Why would they want to rock the boat of gold Putin's mates bring into the UK?

Nope it wasn't us - makes no sense. No financial gain involved.

[zugzwang]

2 hours ago, Big Orange said:

Or the real warning of hideously fractured, unstable societies barely held together by self-serving, psychopathic despots? 

Gaddafi was a fun sized Putin (he also played the West like a fiddle and rigged a oil heavy economy).

Who played who?

Only one of these cunning gentlemen ended up being shot through the face.

And then there was Saddam Hussein and his infamous 'mobile chemical weapons laboratories'.

Parked up in an NCP near Salisbury, perhaps?

 

And let's not forget Osama bin Laden.

Our man in the Stan for so many years until he threw off his CIA handlers and went native.

 

[zugzwang]

2 hours ago, jonb2 said:

It's not as simple as the west is bad and everybody else is good zz. Did you not see my post about the numbers Putin has killed and the picture of Grozny?

There is no doubt, depressingly, that money is talking louder than ever. The arms business is huge and obviously it suits the elites to perpetuate its consumption. However what-about-ism is not what's needed right now. This is the problem:

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/apr/07/global-inequality-tipping-point-2030

And Putin is on the top table among the elites. Assad has no compunction in gassing his own people. You will argue it's not true. However the reports have been frequent over the 6 years now and different nerve agents have been used. Quite an elaborate plan for propaganda.

The real problem is closer to home. Why the feck have the Tories not imposed financial sanctions on Putin's mates? This level of corruption belies the inconvenience caused by the Skripal case. Why would they want to rock the boat of gold Putin's mates bring into the UK?

Nope it wasn't us - makes no sense. No financial gain involved.

No, it isn't simple. The Middle East is anything but simple. The sectarian conflict in Northern Ireland is child's play by comparison. Assad is a thug but so too are his opponents. The recriminations are endless. How do you even begin to fix it? By throwing Tomahawk cruise missiles around? How well did that work in Libya or Afghanistan? And the Israeli intervention last night, what good did that do? Its sole purpose I suspect was to flush out the positions of Russian anti-aircraft missiles ahead of a much larger, co-ordinated US strike this evening or tomorrow. The world is being stampeded to war because the US and UK govts know very well their stories fall to pieces under the slightest scrutiny.

No link between the Skripals and Syria? On the face of it you'd think not but then how do you explain the 'package has been delivered' horse shit dreamt up by the Sunday Express? Did the Express hacks make the Skripal-Syria connection themselves or were they given a helpful steer by the Foreign Office?

Quote

A mysterious message saying the “package has been delivered,” allegedly intercepted by the RAF then relayed to the Sunday Express by even more mysterious “insiders,” has exposed desperation in the UK media’s Skripal reporting.

This presumably highly classified, secret information was provided to the Sunday Express by the now ubiquitous anonymous “insiders.” Insiders who have apparently seen the intelligence and confirmed that there were two messages intercepted by RAF analysts in southern Cyprus on March 4 – the very same day that Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia were attacked in Salisbury.

Nowhere is it explained why a potentially innocuous message from Syria relates to the Skripal poisoning in Salisbury, or why alleged Russian spies would continue to use phrases from early John le Carré novels. However, despite the vagueness of the reports, much of the British press have picked up the story unquestioningly.

The message was reportedly intercepted and included in an intelligence package shown to Britain’s allies before scores of Russian diplomats were ousted from more than a dozen countries, according to the Sunday Express.

It’s not known whether allies were given further details, because the “package” could be literally anything – groceries, a birthday present, or even a dangerous dosage of Novichok, supposedly one of the world’s most dangerous chemical weapons. (Even though the Skripals are both on the mend, conscious, and stable).

According to the Sunday Express, one message had been sent from Syria to “an official” in Moscow. This one included the phrase “the package has been delivered” and added that two individuals had “made a successful egress.”

On seeing the communication, apparently an RAF flight lieutenant remembered another message that had been intercepted and discounted on the previous day. Predictably, the UK Ministry of Defence cannot confirm claims as they are “linked to an ongoing investigation.”

https://www.rt.com/uk/423578-package-anonymous-source-secret/

 

[Peter Hun]

rt.com

 

... Right.

[Stay Beautiful]

The daughter is out of hospital and her father is improving rapidly. Must have been a bad batch of nerve agent used as we were told it is 10X more powerful than VX.

I do like a happy ending.

[Peter Hun]

Or the treatment was far more successful that anything the Russians have.

Quote

The spokesperson said they used specialised decontamination techniques, kept circulation going and used a "variety of drugs" to support the patients until they could reproduce the enzymes destroyed by the nerve agent, during the "round-the-clock care" the two received.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/04/10/poisoned-spys-daughter-yulia-skripal-due-discharged-hospital/

[jonb2]

5 hours ago, Stay Beautiful said:

The daughter is out of hospital and her father is improving rapidly. Must have been a bad batch of nerve agent used as we were told it is 10X more powerful than VX.

I do like a happy ending.

So the fact that Kim Jun Un's brother's poisoners are still alive is because he is really still alive and currently salmon fishing in Scotland?

Everything's a lie - there is no reality. Bloody moon landings and dinosaurs. All b*llocks.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/10/12/bbcs_adam_curtis_how_propaganda_turned_russian_politics_into_a_circus.html

[Stay Beautiful]

1 hour ago, jonb2 said:

So the fact that Kim Jun Un's brother's poisoners are still alive is because he is really still alive and currently salmon fishing in Scotland?

Everything's a lie - there is no reality. Bloody moon landings and dinosaurs. All b*llocks.

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2016/10/12/bbcs_adam_curtis_how_propaganda_turned_russian_politics_into_a_circus.html

I'm sure there's a point to be made somewhere in what you have wrote, sadly i just can't fathom it out.

[zugzwang]

How far will Putin escalate, that's the next question. Will cruise missiles be used against the West for the first time? It's clear that May can't afford a long fight, her position in parliament is too perilous (the Skripal affair was surely as much about getting her own MPs on side as it was about influencing public opinion) and the UK is already exhausted militarily and economically. I've seen no great movement of men and material along UK motorways either, unlike in 2003 when the preparations for war were evident long before Blair presented his dodgy dossier. 

Popcorn time.

[Stay Beautiful]

2 hours ago, zugzwang said:

 Will cruise missiles be used against the West for the first time? 

Hysterical question.

Russia launching a first strike against the West is absurd. It would take a Psycho to usher in World M.A.D.

[Peter Hun]

On 09/04/2018 at 3:10 PM, The Eagle said:

It's patently obvious that you 'Peter Hun' are a paid NATO/UK government troll, just like Errol is clearly working for the other side, but the difference is that your posts are completely unbelievable and full of falsities.

Funny.

Even if was a paid Nato troll, is there anything wrong with it. You know being on our side in a uk forum about the uk?

[Peter Hun]

10 hours ago, Stay Beautiful said:

Russia launching a first strike against the West is absurd.

And being one of the richest men on earth he has too much to lose