Libdem Lord Oakeshott Is A Property Vi Misleading B@stard

[Tired of Waiting]

LibDem Lord Oakeshott is a property VI misleading b@stard.

( Journalists will find the info in this tread very useful. )

Commenting on news about reduced mortgage lending forecasts for 2011 he said this:

Lord Oakeshott, a Liberal Democrat Treasury spokesman, said banks are abandoning millions of young people who have no hope of buying, even if they have a good job. "There is only one bank left lending at fair rates to first-time buyers without a 25 per cent deposit – the Bank of Mum and Dad,’ he said. ‘That is deeply divisive and damaging to social mobililty."

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340365/Mortgage-lending-hit-30-year-low-2011-110bn-year-peak-just-6bn.html#ixzz18lA4uI6A (Thanks to Pedro for the Fed for that: http://www.housepricecrash.co.uk/forum/index.php?showtopic=156512&pid=2829996&st=0entry2829996 )

Some of us thought strange that a Treasury spokesman would make such a basic mistake in economics. Thankfully some other posters clarified the situation:

Lord Oakshott Register of Interests

1: Directorships

Value and Income Trust plc

Audax Properties plcOLIM Ltd (investment management)

Aubrey Investments Ltd and Gakero Ltd (commercial property investment)

2: Remunerated employment, office, profession etc.

Joint Managing Director, OLIM Ltd (investment managers), a subsidiary of Close Brothers Group plc

4: Shareholdings (

Value and Income Trust plc

CF OLIM Unit Trust

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Aberforth Smaller Companies

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Law Debenture

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Scottish Oriental

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Monks

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Schroder Income Growth

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: British Empire Securities

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Smaller Companies Dividend

In AIL Pension Scheme: Investment Trusts: Value and Income

4: Shareholdings (a)

Aubrey Investments Ltd and its subsidiaries (commercial property investment)

5: Land and property

Home in Sussex occupied by mother and sister (no rental income)

10: Non-financial interests (...)

Lord Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay

Biography

My professional career is investing in commercial property, mainly shops and industrial property, all over the United Kingdom for pension funds, charities and investment trusts. I started my own business in 1986 after being a Director of Warburg Investment Management and running Courtaulds Pension Fund.

http://www.libdems.org.uk/people_detail.aspx?name=Lord_Oakeshott_of_Seagrove_Bay&pPK=447d0084-5a2b-4e44-a821-1abac27a4d42

Besides, apparently he has an Oxford degree in Philosophy, Politics and Economics (according to WikiPedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matthew_Oakeshott,_Baron_Oakeshott_of_Seagrove_Bay ).

Hence, his comment on that news article was not a "mistake", or ignorance. It was VI disguised as "concern for the poor FTBers"...

:angry:

.

Edited December 22, 2010 by Tired of Waiting

[LuckyOne]

Well done for making this into its own thread.

Clearly his interests and the interests of the British economy are not aligned. It is a major failure of the system that he is given a platform to try to modify behaviour to his personal benefit rather than the benefit of the nation.

[Patfig]

He looks like a bit of an @rse too, but which bit you might ask

[guitarman001]

But....... what can be done?

[Patfig]

But....... what can be done?

time will out

[Tired of Waiting]

Well done for making this into its own thread.

Thanks.

Clearly his interests and the interests of the British economy are not aligned. It is a major failure of the system that he is given a platform to try to modify behaviour to his personal benefit rather than the benefit of the nation.

Exactly!

( Hence my language short-cut: a b@stard ! )

.

Edited December 21, 2010 by Tired of Waiting

[Tired of Waiting]

But....... what can be done?

First, I am spreading the word, here now.

Next step? Not sure, suggestions welcomed. Hence this post. Help! This VI b@stard must be outed!

[tinker]

Just to add. It would be interesting to see the property position of all MPs (in particular the last decade), probably something that needs exposing. It may just open people's eyes (especially the young) as to why they supported the bubble, actively taking steps to prop it up and cannot utter the truism that falling prices means more people can afford property without the slavery.

Though scratch the surface and it won't just be MPs, will it?

It was all about leverage, those that had it, and those that didn't; and those that acted out of fear (of missing out).

It's a huge scandal. Pure greed that has effectively wrecked the UK economy for a generation.

Edited December 21, 2010 by tinker

[Timm]

So,

1. Lord Oakshott has lots of investment property.

2. He wants young people to take on larger debts.

That would contribute to higher property prices, which would be in his personal self-interest.

But it would not be in the interests of the young people, who would have more debt to pay back.

[Tired of Waiting]

Just to add. It would be interesting to see the property position of all MPs (in particular the last decade), probably something that needs exposing. It may just open people's eyes (especially the young) as to why they supported the bubble, actively taking steps to prop it up and cannot utter the truism that falling prices means more people can afford property without the slavery.

Though scratch the surface and it won't just be MPs, will it?

It was all about leverage, those that had it, and those that didn't; and those that acted out of fear (of missing out).

It's a huge scandal. Pure greed that has effectively wrecked the UK economy for a generation.

I agree. Good post.

But this bubble has to be deflated now, gently if possible, but deflated. And the core of gov.+BoE+FSA = Cable, Clegg, Mervyn and (Osborne?) knows that. My big concern is that this b@stard, as the Treasury spokesman, is too close to this core, and may have some influence. He must be weakened - by his VI made as public as possible.

[Tired of Waiting]

So,

1. Lord Oakshott has lots of investment property.

2. He wants young people to take on larger debts.

That would contribute to higher property prices, which would be in his personal self-interest.

But it would not be in the interests of the young people, who would have more debt to pay back.

Yep. A b@strad.

[Georgia O'Keeffe]

Yep. A b@strad.

Whats the problem here, the guys heart is in the right place, hes only highlighting that banks are destroying the opportunity of the young to get on the housing ladder, ok so they may be a smidgeon overpriced at the moment but given that property doubles in value in the UK every 7 years (by statute), that means that by 2014 the average property will be around 400K if it was 200 in 07, so what is the problem with the banks lending, it is a win win, not only are millions of youngsters helped, the equity profit helps recapitalise the banks and the taxes generated by that equity help regenerate the Govts balance sheet, i think you need to look at the bigger picture before criticizing him.

[LuckyOne]

So,

1. Lord Oakshott has lots of investment property.

2. He wants young people to take on larger debts.

That would contribute to higher property prices, which would be in his personal self-interest.

But it would not be in the interests of the young people, who would have more debt to pay back.

I wonder how all these people spouting "progressive" ideas can look at themselves in the mirror when they act like this.

I wonder whether their supporters (especially the more rabid and militant ones) agree with the inconsistency or whether they are blind to it.

[Tired of Waiting]

I wonder how all these people spouting "progressive" ideas can look at themselves in the mirror when they act like this.

I wonder whether their supporters (especially the more rabid and militant ones) agree with the inconsistency or whether they are blind to it.

Good questions, both.

In my case the most frequent question is: "is this (guy/woman) a moron, or a b@srad?".

( In the case of this Lord though we know he is not a moron. )

[Acid In The Punch Bowl]

Write to him.

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/peer/lord_oakeshott_of_seagrove_bay

[Arthur Kinnell]

His Lordship is the rule not the exception. Sometimes they are so arrogant and so smug they don't care who knows it, as long as the money keeps rolling in and we keep swallowing.

[LuckyOne]

Whats the problem here, the guys heart is in the right place, hes only highlighting that banks are destroying the opportunity of the young to get on the housing ladder, ok so they may be a smidgeon overpriced at the moment but given that property doubles in value in the UK every 7 years (by statute), that means that by 2014 the average property will be around 400K if it was 200 in 07, so what is the problem with the banks lending, it is a win win, not only are millions of youngsters helped, the equity profit helps recapitalise the banks and the taxes generated by that equity help regenerate the Govts balance sheet, i think you need to look at the bigger picture before criticizing him.

Ah. So progressive actually means to use the ponzi scheme to make everyone rich with no risk and without actually producing anything.

I have so little understanding of modern left wing politics .....

Thank you for your help in explaining this to me....

Edited December 21, 2010 by LuckyOne

[Si1]

I wonder whether their supporters (especially the more rabid and militant ones) agree with the inconsistency or whether they are blind to it.

I think trad (and even militant) liberal / labour supporters are loyal to the tradition of Lloyd-George, Askwith and Atlee, which is an honourable position to take other issues notwithstanding; they are often simple uneducated people who do not want to be taken advantage of by avaricious tories (of which there are plenty), not realising that some of the incumbents in the liberal or socialist traditions can be just as bad

it's a bit like Faith in the Catholic church - it is just a given, even if the current clergy are corrupt

[LuckyOne]

I think trad (and even militant) liberal / labour supporters are loyal to the tradition of Lloyd-George, Askwith and Atlee, which is an honourable position to take other issues notwithstanding; they are often simple uneducated people who do not want to be taken advantage of by avaricious tories (of which there are plenty), not realising that some of the incumbents in the liberal or socialist traditions can be just as bad

it's a bit like Faith in the Catholic church - it is just a given, even if the current clergy are corrupt

It seems that the poor are really stuffed.

In the modern era, the rich are going to get them : either overtly by the politicians of the right or covertly by the politicians of the left.

[northwestsmith2]

]I tried a few banks with a full time worker on 26K and the limits are not on LTV but in cash terms I think.

HSBC

They will lend 107K on a 160K average house with 53K deposit

66% LTV

or 107K on a 118K house with a 12K deposit

90%LTV

Even with major falls they are covered as the last layer puts their money into covering the upstream.

Edited December 21, 2010 by northwestsmith2

[NEO72]

Doesn't anyone have any media contacts - this illustrates the wider issue of VIs well and imo would make a decent story. Why not try emailing this info to some journos (Indy writers might be the best bet)?

[Tired of Waiting]

Doesn't anyone have any media contacts - this illustrates the wider issue of VIs well and imo would make a decent story. Why not try emailing this info to some journos (Indy writers might be the best bet)?

Yes! That would be the best way.

Can anyone here point this guy/story to some journo?

[Giordano Bruno]

Ah. So progressive actually means to use the ponzi scheme to make everyone rich with no risk and without actually producing anything.

I have so little understanding of modern left wing politics .....

Thank you for your help in explaing this to me....

I have difficulty believing that Tamara De Lempicka can be serious. Every bubble, every ponzi scheme, and every pyramid scheme like chain-letters must collapse sooner or later. Surely we all know that?

[Milton]

I'm afraid I came to the same conclusion as TOW, after seeing Lord Oakeshott's comments on Newsnight 2 or 3 weeks ago.

The other Guest was some banker.

Oakeshott rightly has it in for the bankers. But his closing comments caused great concern.

When the subject of housing came up he seemed to be suggesting that it was not alright for the Banks to overextend themselves, but it was perfectly acceptable for the 'consumer' or FTB'er to do so!

However, he is transparent. Thank god for small mercies.

Edited December 21, 2010 by Dan1

[erranta]

First, I am spreading the word, here now.

Next step? Not sure, suggestions welcomed. Hence this post. Help! This VI b@stard must be outed!

Interests

'They' have completely sold orf their "Property funds management business" in October

So do they realise something the general public don't 'get' yet?

Insider info only been whispered/released in the "Gentlemans Clubs" of the City - The housing game is up?

http://www.closebrot....uk/latest.aspx

18 November 2010

Interim Management Statement Q1 2011

7 October 2010 Close Brothers announces sale of Property Funds Management Business

28 September 2010 Preliminary Results for the year ended 31 July 2010

23 July 2010 Trading statement

21 May 2010 Interim Management Statement Q3 2010

26 April 2010 Close Brothers launches first ever advertising campaign in national newspapers

22 April 2010 Announcement regarding Winterflood Securities

16 March 2010 Close Brothers announces Interim Results 2010

22 January 2010 Trading statement

4 January 2010 Acquisition of invoice financing loan book

This thread is like deja-vu of what we used to do on HPC years ago!

Edited December 21, 2010 by erranta