Stubborn Sods

[TiredOfMagnolia]

Every week, I get email updates from agents with a list of properties "suitable" for me. They always seem the same to me so today I checked back on the first one I received from them (October 2016) and out of the ten houses on there SEVEN have been on there for TEN MONTHS, and between them, not ONE PENNY reduction.

Area is Fetcham & Leatherhead Surrey. Stubborn lot around here. 

[Maynardgravy]

Winter's coming.

[stuckmojo]

18 minutes ago, Maynardgravy said:

Winter's coming.

winter is here. 

[Si1]

2 minutes ago, stuckmojo said:

winter is here. 

...and the govt's giving out free thermal jackets

[“Nasty Piece of work”]

Low volumes mean it is a well wrapped corpse.  Stiffy's don't give out heat.  Now we wait for the black gloop to appear. 

[Agentimmo]

If you are a buyer and fancy one of the houses,  send him an offer that's 50% off the asking price. It will be rejected of course. But you'll be contacted in 12-18 months time ....begging you to take it at your price hopefully.  

[stuckmojo]

21 minutes ago, Agentimmo said:

If you are a buyer and fancy one of the houses,  send him an offer that's 50% off the asking price. It will be rejected of course. But you'll be contacted in 12-18 months time ....begging you to take it at your price hopefully.  

This. 100%. 

in 2013 I did exactly the same. Wasn't 50% off but was 30% off the asking. They laughed at me

Then they came back to accept in September 2014. And I lowered my offer by a further 10%. 

They rejected it and then accepted it in October 2014. 

In the North East though, so perhaps not representative. 

 

I plan to do exactly the same again soon. this time I will offer 50% and if anything an offer like that will stick to their memory and will scare the shit out of anyone with a house for sale. 

[Agentimmo]

18 minutes ago, stuckmojo said:

This. 100%. 

in 2013 I did exactly the same. Wasn't 50% off but was 30% off the asking. They laughed at me

Then they came back to accept in September 2014. And I lowered my offer by a further 10%. 

They rejected it and then accepted it in October 2014. 

In the North East though, so perhaps not representative. 

 

I plan to do exactly the same again soon. this time I will offer 50% and if anything an offer like that will stick to their memory and will scare the shit out of anyone with a house for sale. 

As I've posted on here many times throughout the years, that was my strategy when I bought in the late 90s in France during their last major HPC. As long as you are patient,  you'll save tens if not hundreds of thousands of pounds/euros etc. 

In my case, the seller of a place I'd offered on 6 months earlier called me a week after I'd signed for another house. Offered me at less than my initial offer......she was a forced seller moving away for work reasons. 

Wife and I now looking to move maybe in 2019/20...so will start pushing the "fair price offers" in about 12months time to see where it gets us. ?

[stuckmojo]

6 minutes ago, Agentimmo said:

As I've posted on here many times throughout the years, that was my strategy when I bought in the late 90s in France during their last major HPC. As long as you are patient,  you'll save tens if not hundreds of thousands of pounds/euros etc. 

In my case, the seller of a place I'd offered on 6 months earlier called me a week after I'd signed for another house. Offered me at less than my initial offer......she was a forced seller moving away for work reasons. 

Wife and I now looking to move maybe in 2019/20...so will start pushing the "fair price offers" in about 12months time to see where it gets us. ?

Same plan, same strategy.

[sPinwheel]

I'm a stubborn sod. I refused to buy a house for 15 years....

Feck load of good that did me.

[longgone]

53 minutes ago, sPinwheel said:

I'm a stubborn sod. I refused to buy a house for 15 years....

Feck load of good that did me.

the last 4 years have been the worst for me , and osborne's magic HTB. 

fooking bloke should be left in the sea 

[lombardo]

2 hours ago, sPinwheel said:

I'm a stubborn sod. I refused to buy a house for 15 years....

Feck load of good that did me.

I invested the money and got more than the return I would have through house price inflation.

[Pop321]

5 hours ago, stuckmojo said:

This. 100%. 

in 2013 I did exactly the same. Wasn't 50% off but was 30% off the asking. They laughed at me

Then they came back to accept in September 2014. And I lowered my offer by a further 10%. 

They rejected it and then accepted it in October 2014. 

In the North East though, so perhaps not representative. 

I plan to do exactly the same again soon. this time I will offer 50% and if anything an offer like that will stick to their memory and will scare the shit out of anyone with a house for sale. 

I live in an area where reductions are unheard of......but that doesn't mean they don't happen just no one hears about them. My purchases have been either massive reductions following my offer or an off market purchase where next door has been double the price I pay. It is all about patience and when money is the only driver, it's about not being fussy. 

One flat (overlooking the town centre gardens) was £210k...my 'enquiry' at £150k was rejected and I bought at auction for £122k. 

A house sold for £410k as I bought the neighbouring town house (albeit a tad rough, some wall tie issues and needed £10k in a roof and pointing) for £210k. 

The 118'er does understand this...they consider property as an investment regardless. But I considered property as a potential investment due to a very inefficient market. No transparency and out of towners (or local high earning dual income families) just buying because they like the colours, the bath fittings or fireplace. Balmy. 

Investors are 'trade' but the 118'er formula has blindly bought at 'retail' prices on interest only where someone else's wage pays the mortgage...so they care less about true value but expect a long term growth. I hope everyone holds out for proper prices supported by local wages and then we can see a genuine crash reflecting regional variances. 

[Travisher]

I remember in late 1980s looking to buy in Goole. Almost every offer was being gazumped on a daily basis. One place advertised at £25k got to £34k and we walked away. Another that still had gas lamp brackets - I'm not joking, came on at £19k and was over £30k before we got to look at it. In the autumn as the crash set in the owner of the first property knocked on the door of our above shop flat/hovel to see if we were still interested. We had decided not to buy any house as it was clear the bottom had fallen out of the market so we were heading down south. She didn't like being told that.

[sPinwheel]

4 hours ago, lombardo said:

I invested the money and got more than the return I would have through house price inflation.

Yeah I thought about lotto scratch cards too but they were a bit hit and miss. Mostly miss.

[Dyson Fury]

4 hours ago, lombardo said:

I invested the money and got more than the return I would have through house price inflation.

This link is a few weeks old, but it's remarkable to see such a comment in the editorial article rather than in the comments:

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/latin-graffiti-cambridge-wake-up-12847940

Quote

It looks eye-watering on paper to see that a student’s debt of four years at one of the Cambridge universities is £36,000.

But that pales compared to the hike in value of three bed houses on my street. They went up four or five times as much in the same period.

What’s the lesson of this? Stop learning, stop trying to better yourself, stop trying to be creative. Just get hold of some land and sit on it?

 

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Phil321 said:

I live in an area where reductions are unheard of......but that doesn't mean they don't happen just no one hears about them. My purchases have been either massive reductions following my offer or an off market purchase where next door has been double the price I pay. It is all about patience and when money is the only driver, it's about not being fussy. 

One flat (overlooking the town centre gardens) was £210k...my 'enquiry' at £150k was rejected and I bought at auction for £122k. 

A house sold for £410k as I bought the neighbouring town house (albeit a tad rough, some wall tie issues and needed £10k in a roof and pointing) for £210k. 

The 118'er does understand this...they consider property as an investment regardless. But I considered property as a potential investment due to a very inefficient market. No transparency and out of towners (or local high earning dual income families) just buying because they like the colours, the bath fittings or fireplace. Balmy. 

Investors are 'trade' but the 118'er formula has blindly bought at 'retail' prices on interest only where someone else's wage pays the mortgage...so they care less about true value but expect a long term growth. I hope everyone holds out for proper prices supported by local wages and then we can see a genuine crash reflecting regional variances. 

How do you find off market properties? Just through enquiries amongst neighbours?

[Pop321]

5 hours ago, Grab_Some_Popcorn said:

How do you find off market properties? Just through enquiries amongst neighbours?

Mine have been through contacts and purchased from other investors. Enquiries to neighbours who aren't motivated is probably a waste of time...you are then buying on their terms. 

To be precise I can give my last example. 3 guys own maybe a dozen properties all bought in the 80's and they are badly maintained but functional. One is an accountant, one a lawyer type and the other in finance...I am not even convinced these properties are their main source of income in their retirement. Investor 3 had died and unthinkably to the other 2 his widow wanted some cash...so they need to sell. An estate agent 'friend' let me know 2 houses they might sell...one for £350k (7 flats large crack on building with massive potential but needed £200k investment). The other was 3 flats from a converted Victorian terrace new boilers but all very very scruffy, needed a roof and the rear projection wall needed tying back into the main body of the building and they wanted £250k. 

Neither had planning (not a problem because converted in the late 70's) but no building regs. 

I bought the second one for £210k (spent £10k on repairs) and the neighbouring property had sold at £410k in fair condition. In mine the first floor had a tenant not paying and was known for dealing in drugs despite this being a super area. 

No mortgage, no MEW'ings, no nonsense....took 6 months to agree the price then bought in about 3 weeks. 

Why would they sell cheaply? ...because both buildings needed investment, had some issue with them and as it later transpired they paid £25k in 1985 for mine! 

And they sold the other on the open market after another year of debate and the widow demanding a second sale...offers over £350k and it went for £550k to some amateur numpties who, to be fair, made a nice job of the place and probably made £100k from a £800k total investment....but what a risk at that price. The widow was right, these guys were old, never realised any gains,  the houses were horrid, hassle and not something she would want to be associated with. The yields could be doubled but they needed money which the 3 original investors were not capable of bringing themselves to spend. 

 

I had been offered a house from a work colleague whose sister was desperate to sell and feared repossession...bad karma if you abuse a friend or associate so I don't touch these. It was 'worth' £175k, she would have taken £125k so I contacted that same agent and they had an open and honest discussion. He sold it on the open market in a week for £155k with an exchange and completion within a month. 

I was never a big player but I was honest and therefore opportunities from other investors came my way normally via agents or directly from those investors who needed money. 

The most annoying thing agents say in a bouyant or firm market when they get a low offer is 'I'd buy it myself for that'.....genuinely I must have had 3 examples where after 6 months they have come back to me with an acceptance and their tail between their legs....and I rarely would stand by that offer. "Too late buy it yourself" I am thinking....but I normally would say I had found something else so could only now afford it at £X price. 

There are dozens of examples and opportunities over the past 20 years. People definitely forget what happens when the market is quiet and someone needs to sell quick. That time will come again and the key is not to be fussy (if money is the driver). Trickier if you intend to move the wife and kids in of course ?. 

I am now no longer buying ever again...the impact of leveraging and daft prices make the situation unfair on a whole generation and owner occupiers....but I am sure opportunities for real investors and OO alike will come again. 

Edited September 8, 2017 by Phil321