OurDayWillCome Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 http://theenergyst.com/ofgem-mulls-how-to-regulate-internet-of-things-what-to-do-if-people-dont-engage-with-smart-meters/ Comment at the end of this article is interesting. Can anyone confirm if it is true that the meter belongs to the supplier - switch suppliers, switch meter? If this is true then I can see why British Gas have been going full on with devious tricks to get us to upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPin Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Well I've just had an email, my last chance to avoid " an estimated bill". What does this smart meter actually do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgul Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 9 minutes ago, OurDayWillCome said: http://theenergyst.com/ofgem-mulls-how-to-regulate-internet-of-things-what-to-do-if-people-dont-engage-with-smart-meters/ Comment at the end of this article is interesting. Can anyone confirm if it is true that the meter belongs to the supplier - switch suppliers, switch meter? If this is true then I can see why British Gas have been going full on with devious tricks to get us to upgrade. They say 'lack of consumer engagement with smart meters'. Of course consumers' aren't engaged -- they (currently) offer no advantage to the customer and all the advantage to the supplier. For all of the stupid adverts saying how 'estimation is for idiots', actually, for most customers, the estimated electricity supply works out okay, thank you very much. The only way they can get consumer engagement is to actually allow smart meters to give cost savings -- but they can't do this without massively exaggerating the costs to the consumer of high demand periods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One-percent Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, dgul said: They say 'lack of consumer engagement with smart meters'. Of course consumers' aren't engaged -- they (currently) offer no advantage to the customer and all the advantage to the supplier. For all of the stupid adverts saying how 'estimation is for idiots', actually, for most customers, the estimated electricity supply works out okay, thank you very much. The only way they can get consumer engagement is to actually allow smart meters to give cost savings -- but they can't do this without massively exaggerating the costs to the consumer of high demand periods. I won't buy into it as it is just another way that jobs are lost. Barstewards are still going to have to pay someone to read my meters. I won't give them my own readings for the same reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChewingGrass Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Smartmeters are the back-door for variable power pricing when supply margins become even tighter than they are now and electric vehicles become more prevelant etc. There are now 4x as many EVs on the roads as there were just over 12 months ago. In 3 months from Nov 2016 to Jan 2017 pure EV sales have gone from 3.6% to 4.2% of UK market share. The next quarter is expected to see sales hit or exceed 5% and this level of growth has not really been planned for as urban drivers realise that small city cars like the Zoe with a range of 200 miles on a small 41kW battery are a practical day to day alternative to a petrol vehicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One-percent Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 5 minutes ago, ChewingGrass said: Smartmeters are the back-door for variable power pricing when supply margins become even tighter than they are now and electric vehicles become more prevelant etc. There are now 4x as many EVs on the roads as there were just over 12 months ago. In 3 months from Nov 2016 to Jan 2017 pure EV sales have gone from 3.6% to 4.2% of UK market share. The next quarter is expected to see sales hit or exceed 5% and this level of growth has not really been planned for as urban drivers realise that small city cars like the Zoe with a range of 200 miles on a small 41kW battery are a practical day to day alternative to a petrol vehicle. Good pint chewy. Did I also not read that our aged and decrepit national grid is on its last legs maintenance wise and also at full capacity at peak times. Guess the smart meter could in the future be an easy way of rationing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chronyx Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 On that theme, I'm fascinated by how the London grid is going to cope with all the expansion going on. It can't be long before something goes pop Turns out some places are having gas heating removed for safety reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgul Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 56 minutes ago, One-percent said: Good pint chewy. Did I also not read that our aged and decrepit national grid is on its last legs maintenance wise and also at full capacity at peak times. Guess the smart meter could in the future be an easy way of rationing. That is absolutely the case for smart meters. There has never really been any pretence of otherwise. But there is no consumer benefit. It is only a benefit for the generators. I'm of the opinion (with no basis at all, other than this is how technology comes along a screws the best intentions*) that there'll be a massive development in energy storage capability at the point where they've got smart metering installed in all houses in the UK, which will effectively remove the point of having them and remove the point of the massive investment in installing them (which we'll be paying for for the next 20 years). [* for example solar PV. All that expansion with substantial incentives that I'm going to be paying for (in higher bills) for the next 20 years, and all they had to do was wait 15 years for the technology to drop in price for it to be (more or less) possible to install the things without subsidy] 17 minutes ago, chronyx said: On that theme, I'm fascinated by how the London grid is going to cope with all the expansion going on. It can't be long before something goes pop Don't worry about London. Easy for power resources to be diverted from the rest of the country to keep London lit. And copper cables, if it comes to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chronyx Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Just now, dgul said: Don't worry about London. Easy for power resources to be diverted from the rest of the country to keep London lit. And copper cables, if it comes to that. True enough, but I do wonder how much current carrying capacity is left in the distribution cables themselves. Pavements where exploding a while back! Replacing or adding them would be a huge job with the underground ones Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChumpusRex Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 11 minutes ago, chronyx said: True enough, but I do wonder how much current carrying capacity is left in the distribution cables themselves. Pavements where exploding a while back! Replacing or adding them would be a huge job with the underground ones The London transmission grid has been greatly upgraded in the last few years. With several 275 kV cables/air insulated substations ripped out and replaced by 400 kV GIS equipment and 400 kV cables in deep underground tunnels. There are also several new 132 and/or 66 kV distribution substations going in in various locations, including a new 120 MVA substation to support upgraded tube trains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One-percent Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 17 minutes ago, chronyx said: True enough, but I do wonder how much current carrying capacity is left in the distribution cables themselves. Pavements where exploding a while back! Replacing or adding them would be a huge job with the underground ones I remember that. Does anyone with a technical background have a view on the cause? From what I remember it was reported without any analysis as to the cause (unusual for the msm) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chronyx Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 12 minutes ago, ChumpusRex said: The London transmission grid has been greatly upgraded in the last few years. With several 275 kV cables/air insulated substations ripped out and replaced by 400 kV GIS equipment and 400 kV cables in deep underground tunnels. There are also several new 132 and/or 66 kV distribution substations going in in various locations, including a new 120 MVA substation to support upgraded tube trains. Good to know some money has been spent on infrastructure. While you're here: Pylons! Are they two banks of L1, L2, and L3? Each pair of cables per row seem joined together. Never covered anything beyond them being 400kV at college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChumpusRex Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Pylons are typically two circuits; one three phase circuit on the left and one on the right. For current handling capacity, conductors may be paralleled on each circuit (1, 2 and 4 conductor bundles are common). Because the left and right halves of the pylon are separate circuits, it allows one string of pylons to provide a redundant supply (failure of a complete pylon is exceedingly rare). For example, it's not uncommon for a small town to receive its full electricity supply via a single set of pylons; each circuit is rated to the full load of the town so the system is single fault tolerant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chronyx Posted March 17, 2017 Share Posted March 17, 2017 Amazing thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OurDayWillCome Posted March 21, 2017 Share Posted March 21, 2017 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/bills-and-utilities/gas-electric/can-trust-smart-meter-mines-dumb-have-press-seven-buttons-get/ Lack of compatibility between suppliers and LED light bulbs causing high readings! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPin Posted March 21, 2017 Share Posted March 21, 2017 Is Chumpy making things up again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 They talk about saving money with fewer meter readers ("Government goal to increase unemployment!") yet they never seem interested in taking meter readings anyway. Not had a meter reader turn up in the couple of years I've been in my current place; the meters are indoors so it's not as if they can read them if I'm not there (or if they can I'm going to get very annoyed!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errol Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 On 17/03/2017 at 6:27 PM, MrPin said: Well I've just had an email, my last chance to avoid " an estimated bill". What does this smart meter actually do? This is rubbish. You can read the meter yourself and ring them up. There is no need to have an estimated reading. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riedquat Posted March 22, 2017 Share Posted March 22, 2017 Creepily enough after that above post I got home this evening to find a card shoved through the door saying they turned up to read the meter and will try again tomorrow. It also asked me to write down the number and stick the card in the window if I was going to be out, so presumably that'll somehow count for more than the readings I'd been sending via their website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPin Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 11 hours ago, Errol said: This is rubbish. You can read the meter yourself and ring them up. There is no need to have an estimated reading. The point is I thought it would send the meter reading without my manual intervention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
winkie Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 My neighbour says their smart meter can tell when they run a bath and turn the kettle on..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPin Posted March 23, 2017 Share Posted March 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, winkie said: My neighbour says their smart meter can tell when they run a bath and turn the kettle on..... And I have a telescope! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy_renting Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 On 17/12/2016 at 0:03 PM, MrPin said: We have a winner! My electricity company sends me a bill every month telling me how much electricity I have used! I let them do all the work! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
happy_renting Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 6 hours ago, winkie said: My neighbour says their smart meter can tell when they run a bath and turn the kettle on..... I can tell when I have turned my kettle on, without looking at a meter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Eagle Posted March 24, 2017 Share Posted March 24, 2017 3 minutes ago, happy_renting said: I can tell when I have turned my kettle on, without looking at a meter. But the spooks need the meter for that (unless you have a smart-TV with built in camera pointing towards your kitchen). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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