Young "unsuitable For Work"

[winkie]

...you also have to take into account that the people that leave their home country and are prepared to travel to a foreign land and learn a new language, are prepared to live in cramped conditions, are prepared to work hard to improve their lot and better themselves, they are grafters, not shirkers...there is no gain without pain and persistence....not all people in all countries are like that, taking the the eastern Europeans as an example, they have just as many that can't be bothered, have health, mind, addictions, educational and self esteem problems in their countries as we do.....

[winkie]

İve recently got to know a teacher (terrible İ know), how ever when talking about parents evenings he reckoned its the parents whose kids don't usually show up who will have the problems later on.

....the chances are that the parents parents didn't turn up or show an interest them when they were young...like father like son.

[Olebrum]

How enthusiastic would you be about breaking your back for £2.60 an hour?

http://www.apprenticeships.org.uk/Partners/Policy/NationalMinimumWage.aspx

I was on £2.60 an hour as an apprentice.....................

in 1983.

[PopGun]

You could also argue that the government is "unsuitable" to govern. It's all very well honing in on articles that reinforce your innate prejudice against anybody who's native to Britain, to run down British youth, make disparaging comments about awful British lazy workers but have you ever stopped to wonder how it's got like this in the first place?

The usual "it wasn't like this in my day" arguments don't wash since the generation making these remarks is also the generation who brought the youth of today into the world and were (presumably) responsible for their education and nurture.

It's sad that some people like to finger point and provoke feelings of inadequacy by highlighting how the sun shines out of the backsides of "eastern Europeans". So maybe if Britain had undergone 50 years of communism it would produce keen, easily pleased, servile work gangs to satisfy all but the most demanding employers. We can all pretend we sympathise with the point of view of a victorian workhouse owner but really, that's delusional and more importantly, why do you care?

+ a million

Commies are bad, but they produce great workers.......

Obviously our kids growing up and being educated under successive neoliberal governments are the problem, it's the only logical conclusion.

[Guest eight]

But the point is, £2.60 is the APPRENTICE wage...at 18...its the very start of your career. You will get experience and qualifications..then you can apply for better jobs..you work hard, you kiss the right arses,you apply yourself...within a couple of years you are earning £6 an hour..then £8..then £10...etc, etc..then maybe, just maybe, one day you CAN buy your own house..y'know, hope, ambition? but if you can't ever afford to buy a house its not the end of the world, you can rent, just like i do..like my parents before me did..like millions of others do..and still live a good and happy life!

Or... just not bother and live on fifty odd quid a week dole scraping by and being skint and miserable forever..

Apprenticeships paid more than that 25 years ago.

[Dorkins]

y'know, hope, ambition?

How much hope and ambition do you think there is in communities where half of all adult males are unemployed?

[Guest eight]

Agreed, very good points.

Considering this was brought in during Blair's time, but continued under the coalition, I can only surmise there's been a conspiracy to bring it about.

You're joking, right? Party politics IS the conspiracy.

[SarahBell]

There was someone on the radio saying kids used to leave school and go into manufacturing but these days the jobs are mostly service jobs and they're not capable of answering the phone or sitting behind a desk.

[Guest eight]

There was someone on the radio saying kids used to leave school and go into manufacturing but these days the jobs are mostly service jobs and they're not capable of answering the phone or sitting behind a desk.

interesting anecdote by "someone on the radio" there. Do you get all your opinion secondhand from the media? What about YOU, personally - don't you know ANY young people? Do they fit this description? Because the ones I know most certainly don't.

[t350chunder]

All our kids need is that first start, they will "get it " once they have to live in the real world, thats how it's always worked in years past, it's only the last few years with the influx of cheap experienced older foreign workers that businesses attitudes have changed

Spot on. I think the best thing you could do for your kids is to help them 'get it' and become resourceful and ambitious. Which is exactly what I was at 16. Started a YTS on £29.50, worked really hard, learned lots by myself, eventually ended up doing OK for myself.

[Buccaneer]

A new report reveals the dark underbelly of the food industry where workers are exploited, conned and abused. Sadie Robinson looks at the grim reality

“Contemporary forms of slavery” exist in Britain. That’s the conclusion of research by the Joseph Rowntree Foundation.

The charity interviewed 62 migrant workers who worked in the food industry. Many said their bosses had lied to them, withheld their wages, paid less than the minimum wage and bullied them. Some described stealing food in order to survive.

Often workers lived in “shocking” overcrowded and unsafe accommodation that was tied to their job. Some had their passports retained by their employer—for up to a year.

One worker said that supervisors “did not call us by our names, we were called by numbers. They treated us like slaves.”

The joys of globalisation. These are standard working practices in many countries.

[PopGun]

The joys of globalisation. These are standard working practices in many countries.

You may laugh, but statements like this are actually used to defend and even justify these practices.

We need to be competitive you know, whilst also maintaining that £200k price tag for my two up two down..

[Olebrum]

Apprenticeships paid more than that 25 years ago.

30 years ago.

£2.60 an hour is a joke wage for anyone over 16.

[Riedquat]

You may laugh, but statements like this are actually used to defend and even justify these practices.

We need to be competitive you know, whilst also maintaining that £200k price tag for my two up two down..

That's what Western standards of living are based on. We just shoved the serf labour overseas and pretended that we're no longer exploiting it in order to live in comfort because we can't see it.

[Mrs Bear]

I heard that on the radio and it's the sort of stuff they've been saying about English youngsters for years and years to justify mass immigration along with the masses of job substitution etc.

I've never heard it specifically about Scottish youngsters before but all of a sudden it's all the usual criticisms they've usually aimed at young English people - it's not necessary to list them all (my own opinion is that nearly all the young people I meet of working age [either inside or outside of a working environment] are entirely "suitable" for work).

Is it Scotland's turn now.

And how did that argument ever stand up anyway? If kids are have been unsuitable for work then what they needed was better teaching/schools/discipline in said schools, plus a few hard lessons on the realities of life - learning to get up in the morning and turn up on time is a good idea if you want to keep a job, yes, you might well have to start at the bottom since you have bugger all skills and no experience of anything, but it's up to you whether you stay there, etc.

Labour could have done at least some of this but they preferred to bring in stacks of immigrants because they reasoned that both the immigrants and the kids who then went on benefits would all vote for them.

It was an utterly cynical betrayal, and whatever the coalition now try re improving standards will be fiercely resisted by teachers, who mostly resist on principle anything coming from any tory, and so sod all will get done.

[kazap]

We have a broken education system in which there is no discipline, no need to work, they fall out of that, useless, its a crime against our young.

I disagree, my Mrs works at the local comp and as a result I socialise with a number of teachers here in S. London. I hear that whilst there are always a minority of grotty kids in any year, and a number of teachers who can't control a classroom, this is a minority. I'd also be interested to know in what era wasn't the case! Certainly sounds similar to my education in the 90s, and modern education seems way ahead of the horrendous experience my parents had.

Of course we are aware of schools in challenging areas struggling to produce the results, but this is clearly down to social issues. Ask any teacher, their role is to educate, they are not social workers and they are not parents - yet increasingly we are expecting them to perform this role and are surprised when it turns out they are neither trained for this nor have the time (every minute not spent teaching puts great pressure on getting through a crammed syllabus).

Don't get me wrong, a good school in such an area can really make a difference and I tip my hat to the amazing staff at such places, but there is only so much they can do against a wider backdrop of poverty.

As others have said, the vast majority of kids are hard working and ambitious and will go on to be productive members of society.

Edited May 23, 2012 by kazap

[crashmonitor]

work is unsuitable for the young

don't blame them

Lack of experience is always going to be a problem, always has been. Doesn't help that we have 25 year olds who have made going to university a career option when they could have had 9 years experience starting with an apprenticeship. You have to start learning all over again when you start work properly.

Edited May 23, 2012 by crashmonitor

[NuBrit]

These people have had no consequences resulting from their failure and their poor attitude throughout their entire education. They've been given every right, yet no responsibility.

Now the HPC lefties are making yet more excuses for them.

I agree.

People need to stop looking at this as a generational thing and also need to stop casting aspersions on people because of their age. Every time a thread like this is started, one group of people come in and start complaining that the boomers have wrecked everything for the young, that they were given 10 houses for a lowly 12 schillings and tuppence and are retiring at 50 with guaranteed £50k a year pensions. At the same time, another group of folks are coming on and complaining the the young are workshy layabouts. In reality, most of the boomers have worked hard and endured hardship to be where they are and most young people actually work pretty hard.

If you ask me, I think the issue here transcends age and is actually a symptom of our generous benefits system. I look at people across all age spectrum's who are unemployed, and I see a lot of commonality. Only last weekend, my wife and I were talking with an uncle of hers (plasterer by trade, in his 40's). He was complaining about unemployment and not having enough money. My wife suggested that he applied for a position that was open at her place of work to tide him over until his trade picked up. He seemed interested until she mentioned the pay was about £250 a week. All of a sudden, you could see his eyes glaze over and the excuses come out. "Not worth my while", "Job is beneath me", etc. I am all for unemployment benefit as a safety net, but when you're 5 years unemployed as this man was, the system shouldn't allow you to be choosey about bring money into the house.

[PopGun]

That's what Western standards of living are based on. We just shoved the serf labour overseas and pretended that we're no longer exploiting it in order to live in comfort because we can't see it.

That's what you get when you globalise a market. The choice is illusionary.

[juvenal]

30 years ago.

£2.60 an hour is a joke wage for anyone over 16.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/9235729/PandO-cruise-ship-crew-paid-just-75p-per-hour.html

It's better than the 75p an hour wage P&O employees have allegedly been paid on cruise ships...

Edited May 23, 2012 by juvenal

[Bob Loblaw]

Many potential employees were also shocked at the number of hours they were expected to work and the report said "the biggest single issue causing difficulties for the transition from school to employment" was the "discrepancy in working hours".

What does that mean? School hours should be increased or decreased?

I know a couple of youngsters doing a 'full time' college course:

MON - OFF

TUE - 8:45am - 3:15pm

WED - 11am - 2:15pm

THU - 8:45am - 3:15pm

FRI - 11am - 2:15pm

So a full time course that consists of 19 1/2 hours a week. They break up in one months time until the end of August for the summer holiday.

I despair for the young of today, you only have to look at their obsession with Facebook and Twitter and their inane ramblings on it to realise that we have created a generation of kids who have no concentration span who are constantly distracted by technology and who think their inane random thoughts on everything from what they wear to what they eat and how long they lie in bed are somehow of interest to the wider world. Add to this an education system that praises them for mediocre achievements and parents who treat them as princes and princesses and it is no wonder they are ill suited to the needs of an employer.

[SarahBell]

interesting anecdote by "someone on the radio" there. Do you get all your opinion secondhand from the media? What about YOU, personally - don't you know ANY young people? Do they fit this description? Because the ones I know most certainly don't.

It's from the same media circus that is saying they're unfit for work.

They don't learn the skills to 'work in manufacturing' any more than they are given 'call centre training' at school.

I know a few young people.

I'm struggling to think of any out of work though. All the late teen lads who left school at 16 work - although one has been let go from various places for his lack of paying attention whilst driving.

The girls I know either work in shops or pubs or are doing degrees.

I am struggling to think of any unemployed youths I know.

A family has just moved in near me though and 5 lads have just piled in with a bag that looks like it's from the cheap booze shop so I assume they're some of the unemployed.

[billybong]

On the subject of call centre employment.

I suppose all those overseas people manning (personning?) the call centre phones for the scam PPI claim calls, pretend official / public announcement calls etc etc etc etc are the very model of how UK youngsters should be when answering / making telephone calls.

Don't make me laugh.

Edited May 23, 2012 by billybong

[Tenubracon]

I know a couple of youngsters doing a 'full time' college course:

MON - OFF

TUE - 8:45am - 3:15pm

WED - 11am - 2:15pm

THU - 8:45am - 3:15pm

FRI - 11am - 2:15pm

So a full time course that consists of 19 1/2 hours a week. They break up in one months time until the end of August for the summer holiday.

Be fair, but the hours you've shown are (presumably) the hours they spend in the classroom. They're supposed to study at least one hour for each they spend in lectures. Of course, whether they actually do this is another matter ...

[scottbeard]

I despair for the young of today, you only have to look at their obsession with Facebook and Twitter and their inane ramblings on it to realise that we have created a generation of kids who have no concentration span who are constantly distracted by technology and who think their inane random thoughts on everything from what they wear to what they eat and how long they lie in bed are somehow of interest to the wider world.

Amusing to read this as a post on an internet forum...