Brexit What Happens Next Thread ---multiple merged threads.

[rollover]

 

Quote

 

Labour vows to rip up and rethink Brexit white paper

Labour has said it would scrap the Brexit white paper and replace it with new negotiating priorities with the emphasis on keeping the benefits of the single market and customs union. Keir Starmer, the shadow Brexit secretary, will set out the plans alongside a pledge to unilaterally guarantee existing rights for all EU nationals as part of the party’s election manifesto, hastily being put together following the snap election announcement last week.

He will promise that Labour would replace the government’s great repeal bill with legislation focused on EU rights and protections. “A Labour government will set out a new Brexit strategy … A Labour approach to Brexit means legislating to guarantee that parliament has a truly meaningful vote on the final Brexit deal,” he will say. Guardian

 

It's like - middle finger out of the EU with bought feets in.

[maverick73]

11 minutes ago, rollover said:

 

 

 

It's like - middle finger out of the EU with bought feets in.

Are any of these political parties in touch with public sentiments?

The country's problems cannot be solved by the same thinking that created it. Yet we're stuck between dumb and dumber. 

This country's mess was because of the Labour Party mass borrow and teflon spending cycle (1997 -2010). Do we see the fruits of promises made (No more 'Boom' and 'Bust').

 

[pig]

33 minutes ago, rollover said:

 

 

 

It's like - middle finger out of the EU with bought feets in.

Weird. You mean they're giving us a choice ? I mean other than lunacy or swivel-eyed lunacy ?

Best keep Corbyn quietly off to one side then.

[OnionTerror]

44 minutes ago, rollover said:

 

 

 

It's like - middle finger out of the EU with bought feets in.

...so it sounds as if they are effectively advocating associate membership, which is a lot worse than what we have now...no voting power, but 100% of the EU acquis applied..

[the gardener]

3 hours ago, rollover said:

EU warns Britain it faces a 'bloodbath' from farmers if the Government tries to make it easier for cheap food to be imported in a trade deal with the US

The EU has warned Britain it faces a 'bloodbath' from the public and farmers that makes it easier for cheap food to be imported from the US under a new trade deal. EU Agriculture Commissioner Phil Hogan said 'hormone beef' and 'chlorine chicken' - produced in the United States which has lower food standards - would face a backlash if they arrived on British store shelves.

Hormone-treated beef and chlorine washed chicken are currently banned in Britain under European food standard rules. He slammed Trade Secretary Liam Fox for pushing to include food in any US-UK trade deal after Brexit. Daily Mail

The EU are really crapping themselves at the prospect of the UK being able to import agricultural products from outside the EU. At present the UK suffers a double-whammy of it's consumers paying over the odds to buy non-EU agricultural imports due to high tariffs which mostly protect the industries of other EU nations, on top of which we then have to hand over the customs duties collected to the EU.

Leaving the EU will mean that the UK will have access to cheaper food as we can reduce or remove tariffs on the items we choose whilst at the same time keeping any tariff income we do collect.

As for the food standards complaint, other EU countries' standards on animal welfare fall quite some way below standards in the UK.

We don't have to take chlorine-washed chicken or hormone-riddled meat for many reasons, firstly, the UK consumer won't want to buy it, secondly, we can set out own product standards and outlaw them just as the EU does. The notion that there will be a flood of cheap and nasty meat post-Brexit is laughable. What are all the EU producers going to do with their produce if they can't sell it to us?

What will happen is that over time we will be able to increase our imports from non-EU countries where the EU producers can't compete (due to inefficient production or high labour costs for example).

The only 'bloodbath' is very much going to be on the EU side, particularly Denmark, France, Germany and Holland. Their fear is palpable.

[Confusion of VIs]

6 minutes ago, the gardener said:

The EU are really crapping themselves at the prospect of the UK being able to import agricultural products from outside the EU. At present the UK suffers a double-whammy of it's consumers paying over the odds to buy non-EU agricultural imports due to high tariffs which mostly protect the industries of other EU nations, on top of which we then have to hand over the customs duties collected to the EU.

Leaving the EU will mean that the UK will have access to cheaper food as we can reduce or remove tariffs on the items we choose whilst at the same time keeping any tariff income we do collect.

As for the food standards complaint, other EU countries' standards on animal welfare fall quite some way below standards in the UK.

We don't have to take chlorine-washed chicken or hormone-riddled meat for many reasons, firstly, the UK consumer won't want to buy it, secondly, we can set out own product standards and outlaw them just as the EU does. The notion that there will be a flood of cheap and nasty meat post-Brexit is laughable. What are all the EU producers going to do with their produce if they can't sell it to us?

What will happen is that over time we will be able to increase our imports from non-EU countries where the EU producers can't compete (due to inefficient production or high labour costs for example).

The only 'bloodbath' is very much going to be on the EU side, particularly Denmark, France, Germany and Holland. Their fear is palpable.

We can try but as we will be very much the weaker party in the trade negotiations and desperate for a deal it's unlikely we will be dictating the terms.

As long as you are also happy to bankrupt British producers of these items.

Also the terms of whatever trade deal we finally agree with the EU may or may not allow us to reduce tariffs on imported food from outside the EU. If we have no deal and crash out on WTO terms food prices are going to rise dramatically, even with the benefit of being able to source from outside the EU.

 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-tariffs-idUSKBN17M1LS

[Sheeple Splinter]

5 hours ago, Futuroid said:

If I was quoting a YouGov poll carried out on the 21st April in March maybe I am from the future!

Have a quick look at the 21st dates on the chart and you may fall to earth...

[rollover]

More stuff coming from Brussel:

Quote

 

Brexit deal under threat as Brussels demands €2billion accusing HMRC of failing to deal with customs tax crime gangs

A €2BILLION bill demanded by Brussels officials accusing HMRC of failing to tackle Chinese crime gangs dodging customs tax could block Brexit negotiations. The demand will have to be settled before a Brexit trade deal can be agreed, The Times reports. European officials have reportedly accused HMRC of failing to curb gangs who undervalue goods imported to the EU in a bid to escape billions of pounds in VAT and duty.

Official figures seen by The Times show suspicious shipments imported to Britain through China increased from 192million kg in 2013 to more than 407million kg last year, with accusations the UK is being used as a gateway into Europe for dodgy goods. The EU anti fraud office said gangs can declare much lower values at Britain’s borders. The average value of women’s cotton trousers declared in the UK was reportedly €0.91 per kg compared to  €26.09 at EU borders.

The savings have riled EU markets as 86per cent of goods imported into Britain are immediately re-exported to the continent. The Sun

 

Post-Brexit gangsta paradise.

 

[thecrashingisles]

30 minutes ago, the gardener said:

The EU are really crapping themselves at the prospect of the UK being able to import agricultural products from outside the EU.

Have you missed the farmers' union lobbying to use Brexit to impose restrictions on agricultural imports because they don't like the competition from products like New Zealand lamb which is imported tariff free under EU deals...

[Sheeple Splinter]

1 hour ago, hotairmail said:

This is a link to that stunning news from Wales giving more background.

 

http://www.itv.com/news/wales/2017-04-24/shock-poll-suggests-tories-ahead-in-wales/

There is a similar effect apparent in Scotland but to a lesser extent....

https://www.sundaypost.com/fp/general-election-sunday-post-poll-shows-tory-vote-share-set-to-soar-while-labour-face-more-misery/

None for northern Ireland as yet but I expect the unionist vote to firm somewhat. Useful poll link....

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_United_Kingdom_general_election,_2017

 

 

Thanks.

So far, campaigning by all parties looks jaded.

 

[ZeroSumGame]

8 minutes ago, Sheeple Splinter said:

Thanks.

So far, campaigning by all parties looks jaded.

 

It could well become lively once the Old Bill get involved.

Quote

Last week a spokesperson for the CPS told The Independent that any charges would have to be made before the date of the general election on 8 June. Channel 4 News added that the CPS is considering prosecution against more than 30 individuals with regards to 2015 election expenses.

 

[Sheeple Splinter]

6 minutes ago, ZeroSumGame said:

It could well become lively once the Old Bill get involved.

 

Imagine if they arrest them at the count on 8th June...

[the gardener]

39 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

Have you missed the farmers' union lobbying to use Brexit to impose restrictions on agricultural imports because they don't like the competition from products like New Zealand lamb which is imported tariff free under EU deals...

Did I say NZ lamb should be imported tariff-free? Outside of the EU we could apply tariffs of our choice, albeit as long as they are no worse than the EU common external tariff (since any new schedule shouldn't be worse than previously applied to a country). Thus we could apply a tariff somewhere between zero and the EU tariff to NZ, whatever level would be mutually beneficial and agreeable to both parties.

As for the farmers complaint, well since we'll be out of the EU New Zealand couldn't necessarily continue to export the same amount of lamb to the UK tariff-free. Upon leaving the UK would take it's share of the EU quota with it which would not necessarily mean the destruction of the UK lamb producers.

As for being the weaker party in negotiations, how is it that we are always the weaker party in your fantasy negotiations? The UK is one of the largest economies in the world, the 5th or 6th. Seems to me that the list of stronger nations is rather short.

Besides the weaker party in trade negotiations is not necessarily the one with the largest GDP. The scarcity and substitutability of the product or service in question is far more important a factor.

[the gardener]

1 hour ago, Confusion of VIs said:

We can try but as we will be very much the weaker party in the trade negotiations and desperate for a deal it's unlikely we will be dictating the terms.

As long as you are also happy to bankrupt British producers of these items.

Also the terms of whatever trade deal we finally agree with the EU may or may not allow us to reduce tariffs on imported food from outside the EU. If we have no deal and crash out on WTO terms food prices are going to rise dramatically, even with the benefit of being able to source from outside the EU.

 http://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-tariffs-idUSKBN17M1LS

The EU has no say in our tariffs when we leave.

[thecrashingisles]

35 minutes ago, the gardener said:

Did I say NZ lamb should be imported tariff-free? Outside of the EU we could apply tariffs of our choice, albeit as long as they are no worse than the EU common external tariff (since any new schedule shouldn't be worse than previously applied to a country). Thus we could apply a tariff somewhere between zero and the EU tariff to NZ, whatever level would be mutually beneficial and agreeable to both parties.

As for the farmers complaint, well since we'll be out of the EU New Zealand couldn't necessarily continue to export the same amount of lamb to the UK tariff-free. Upon leaving the UK would take it's share of the EU quota with it which would not necessarily mean the destruction of the UK lamb producers.

I think you've missed the point.  Under the current deal we get all the tariff free lamb we can take.  Your argument is all over the place.

[Confusion of VIs]

37 minutes ago, the gardener said:

The EU has no say in our tariffs when we leave.

Depends what we agree to get a trade deal with the EU. Part of the reason trade deals are so complicated to agree is they need to take account of all the other deals a country has previously made. 

[the gardener]

27 minutes ago, thecrashingisles said:

I think you've missed the point.  Under the current deal we get all the tariff free lamb we can take.  Your argument is all over the place.

No.

NZ currently (and for several years hasn't) used all its sheep meat EU quota of which half is exported to the UK.

90% of British sheep meat production is exported to the EU. Post-Brexit much of these exports may switch to the domestic market (if EU market access proves difficult). Our demand for NZ lamb will decline.

I rather think it's the EU who will be flooded with NZ lamb, much to the detriment of it's own producers.

Bring it on.

[Guest TheBlueCat]

4 minutes ago, the gardener said:

No.

NZ currently (and for several years hasn't) used all its sheep meat EU quota of which half is exported to the UK.

90% of British sheep meat production is exported to the EU. Post-Brexit much of these exports may switch to the domestic market (if EU market access proves difficult). Our demand for NZ lamb will decline.

I rather think it's the EU who will be flooded with NZ lamb, much to the detriment of it's own producers.

Bring it on.

Nah, the French farmers will intercept it and burn it in all likelihood.

[thecrashingisles]

11 minutes ago, the gardener said:

No.

NZ currently (and for several years hasn't) used all its sheep meat EU quota of which half is exported to the UK.

90% of British sheep meat production is exported to the EU. Post-Brexit much of these exports may switch to the domestic market (if EU market access proves difficult). Our demand for NZ lamb will decline.

I rather think it's the EU who will be flooded with NZ lamb, much to the detriment of it's own producers.

Bring it on.

You are utterly incoherent.  You've been saying how great it is that we'll be able to remove tariffs and get cheaper food from outside the EU, now suddenly you think that cheap food is a threat.

[ccc]

8 hours ago, knock out johnny said:

You've got form for asking dopey questions when you full well know what the answer is

It's a basic question - that has yet to be answered. What club is this we are speaking of ? 

To give you a clue the EU - that this entire thread is about - is not a club. 

So why do people continually describe it as that ? 

[19 year mortgage 8itch]

1 hour ago, ccc said:

It's a basic question - that has yet to be answered. What club is this we are speaking of ? 

To give you a clue the EU - that this entire thread is about - is not a club. 

So why do people continually describe it as that ? 

It's not a club, it's a protection racket.

[GrizzlyDave]

15 minutes ago, 24 year mortgage 8itch said:

It's not a club, it's a protection racket.

It's the worlds biggest gated community!

[ccc]

So Labour and Corbyn would instantly guarantee all rights to EU citizens living in the UK on day one in power. Even though these rights were never in place or promised to anyone in the first place.

And even if the same rights were not reciprocated for UK citizens living in the EU.

What's wrong with these people ? They really do live on a different planet.

[GrizzlyDave]

6 minutes ago, ccc said:

So Labour and Corbyn would instantly guarantee all rights to EU citizens living in the UK on day one in power. Even though these rights were never in place or promised to anyone in the first place.

And even if the same rights were not reciprocated for UK citizens living in the EU.

What's wrong with these people ? They really do live on a different planet.

Whatever labour come up with- they are stuffed.

[Futuroid]

16 minutes ago, GrizzlyDave said:

Whatever labour come up with- they are stuffed.

I agree - they waved through the Article 50 bill and I was thinking to myself "they must know their support is split 50:50 on Brexit and they are trying to recapture some of the Leavers"... then I saw this:

 

On the biggest issue of the election they went against their natural voters.

Dead in the water.