longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 35 minutes ago, jiltedjen said: a new generation will take on the mantel of taking down the corrupt banks and central banks. ? some young plebs with all the will in the world and fire in their young blinded belly are not going to make one jot of difference. They are the masters and you and i are their play things to manipulate. i do like your spirit though i used to be like that but then so did most young people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberMonkeySmallAndChunky Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 11 minutes ago, longgone said: ? some young plebs with all the will in the world and fire in their young blinded belly are not going to make one jot of difference. They are the masters and you and i are their play things to manipulate. i do like your spirit though i used to be like that but then so did most young people. We didnt used to have the internet and now we do. The masters would have preferred to keep control over information transfer. Things change it just takes a long time. Those in power can manipulate but can only manipulate so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 3 minutes ago, UberMonkeySmallAndChunky said: We didnt used to have the internet and now we do. The masters would have preferred to keep control over information transfer. Things change it just takes a long time. Those in power can manipulate but can only manipulate so much. The internet is far more beneficial to the masters than it is to the plebs. A very concise online personality can be created from all this big data farming. let alone all the previous established methods. ISP history triangulation of phone movements sms records. social media connecting known people. telematics movements from your car. spending history from credit and debit cards. internet is a blessing and a hindrance at the same time. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsn03 Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 1 hour ago, longgone said: ? some young plebs with all the will in the world and fire in their young blinded belly are not going to make one jot of difference. They are the masters and you and i are their play things to manipulate. i do like your spirit though i used to be like that but then so did most young people. What he said... I don't like to see triers failing, but the Bitcoin revolution just isn't going to change the world. That said, the concept of digits being worth an ever multiplying fortune backed by nothing is bloody ridiculous in the extreme Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 4 minutes ago, wsn03 said: What he said... I don't like to see triers failing, but the Bitcoin revolution just isn't going to change the world. That said, the concept of digits being worth an ever multiplying fortune backed by nothing is bloody ridiculous in the extreme no less ridiculous than bitcoin being worth 200k each ? how is the balance going to even out though ?? For me converting all my fiat into a house with no or a tiny mortgage is the best option. The only constraint is how much house that buys me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberMonkeySmallAndChunky Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 2 hours ago, longgone said: The internet is far more beneficial to the masters than it is to the plebs. A very concise online personality can be created from all this big data farming. let alone all the previous established methods. ISP history triangulation of phone movements sms records. social media connecting known people. telematics movements from your car. spending history from credit and debit cards. internet is a blessing and a hindrance at the same time. ? The internet being beneficial to the masters was not clear at first and internet was treated with great fear. Maybe the masters will attempt to manipulate Bitcoin into something similar if it becomes more popular. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberMonkeySmallAndChunky Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 2 hours ago, wsn03 said: What he said... I don't like to see triers failing, but the Bitcoin revolution just isn't going to change the world. That said, the concept of digits being worth an ever multiplying fortune backed by nothing is bloody ridiculous in the extreme Numbers like $200k would be possible if we went up in another mad bubble again and how often do you have to be right just to speculate at $3500 prices.... 1 in 57 times i got to make that a break even speculation - sounds like good odds to me risk/reward. To make a break even trade from $3500 to sell again @ $20k you only need to be right 1 in 5.7 times. If price goes down these odds improve more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 (edited) You might not like bitcoin. But how else will the central banks be overthrown or the corruption banished? Bitcoin is an extreme long shot at changing things. but at least a 1 in a 100 chance that it will is better than nothing. We are all forced to be debt slaves, forced to buy houses driven up in price just so we pay the banks more interest or pay extortionate rents. when my kids are in tears in their 30’s as they cannot afford their own home, at least I did my best at changing things. Life will probably break me like it breaks a wild horse, to just be a normal debt slave. but at least I gave bitcoin a shot. had enough pride to give it a go. Im just more debt slave fodder, and me supporting bitcoin may make next to no difference, but if enough debt slaves do the same, on mass, a combination of millions can change the system. Bitcoin may actually work in changing things, but it could take generations. it’s probabably too late to change our lives, but might be planting a seed for future generations. be pragmatic, the odds are against bitcoin. but are you just going to take debt slavery lying down? Do nothing about it? might as well lube yourself up. The yellow vests have it wrong, too much CCTV, too much computers, too much technology, protests are useless. We can’t violently uprise. you need to be smart with your protests, we live in a technological world, use the tech. Edited February 6, 2019 by jiltedjen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 2 hours ago, UberMonkeySmallAndChunky said: The internet being beneficial to the masters was not clear at first and internet was treated with great fear. Maybe the masters will attempt to manipulate Bitcoin into something similar if it becomes more popular. lol who do think cashed out december 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberMonkeySmallAndChunky Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 Just now, longgone said: lol who do think cashed out december 2017 oh thats bitcoin price and that would be small time cash out for super elites. I was talking about potential manipulation in other ways similar to how the masters might use the internet now to gain data on us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 how can you be a debt slave if you have no debt. ?? i have 0 debt. i do not buy things i don`t need if i do i buy it`s on classifieds ad`s you won`t find me in a shop paying vat. i don`t even have a job so i pay no income tax. why should i ? no job pays anymore than it did 20 years ago even before inflation for far more stress reduced employment protection. i would work if they paid right and i paid next to nothing in tax otherwise what is point. benefit scroungers can sit at home and play xbox for the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 3 minutes ago, UberMonkeySmallAndChunky said: oh thats bitcoin price and that would be small time cash out for super elites. I was talking about potential manipulation in other ways similar to how the masters might use the internet now to gain data on us. they know enough already information wise. same like they do with everything else use the MEDIA and FOMO? works a treat on us stupid brits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 Take this for example i bought a lynx shower gel and deodorant and bath speaker set for £4 in a supermarket paid with my debit card, last week i receive a letter saying the speaker set is subject to a recall so have requested for it to be sent back in a prepaid envelope. my address was never given at the self service checkout when i paid for it and no loyalty card was used either. so the manufacturers have power to a database of addresses for anything sold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberMonkeySmallAndChunky Posted February 6, 2019 Share Posted February 6, 2019 1 hour ago, jiltedjen said: We can’t violently uprise. Agreed. 17 minutes ago, longgone said: Take this for example i bought a lynx shower gel and deodorant and bath speaker set for £4 in a supermarket paid with my debit card, last week i receive a letter saying the speaker set is subject to a recall so have requested for it to be sent back in a prepaid envelope. my address was never given at the self service checkout when i paid for it and no loyalty card was used either. so the manufacturers have power to a database of addresses for anything sold. Maybe when they get to grips with tracing public ledger it will mean the masters can track all criminal activity eliminating competition so they can be the only crims... who knows all speculation. Bitcoin is not currently banned so i guess its testing ground atm or maybe the masters will never be able to control it. Right now i feel bitcoin does give a new level of freedom and from a speculation point of view i see potential upside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsn03 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 15 hours ago, jiltedjen said: You might not like bitcoin. But how else will the central banks be overthrown or the corruption banished? Bitcoin is an extreme long shot at changing things. but at least a 1 in a 100 chance that it will is better than nothing. We are all forced to be debt slaves, forced to buy houses driven up in price just so we pay the banks more interest or pay extortionate rents. when my kids are in tears in their 30’s as they cannot afford their own home, at least I did my best at changing things. Life will probably break me like it breaks a wild horse, to just be a normal debt slave. but at least I gave bitcoin a shot. had enough pride to give it a go. Im just more debt slave fodder, and me supporting bitcoin may make next to no difference, but if enough debt slaves do the same, on mass, a combination of millions can change the system. Bitcoin may actually work in changing things, but it could take generations. it’s probabably too late to change our lives, but might be planting a seed for future generations. be pragmatic, the odds are against bitcoin. but are you just going to take debt slavery lying down? Do nothing about it? might as well lube yourself up. The yellow vests have it wrong, too much CCTV, too much computers, too much technology, protests are useless. We can’t violently uprise. you need to be smart with your protests, we live in a technological world, use the tech. I know much about the subject you are discussing here - the majority of the money and power does remain in the hands of the few, it is actually quite alarming to what extent that happens. The plebs clearly have the odds stacked against them. It is not fair you are right, but there are ways to ensure you don't suffer as a result. I really do not see Bitcoin rescuing any of that, and i really don't see it recovering from where it is now. Rather than hope for a miracle I suggest get your kids to be creative. I always do the opposite of the norm. As a result I can command a good living by working in industry doing work that everyone else chose to abandon years ago because it was out of vogue. It's the reasons plumbers have done so well the last few years. My step son is a very clever lad, teenager. He can do some serious mechanical work on motorbikes - he can do things modern mechanics cant because they long since gave up teaching them. I've told him to apply those skills later, but where the money is - not motorbikes, but classic cars. Lots of wealthy people in 20 years time will be sitting on classic cars as assets, but will have no one who can maintain them - no one to rebuild and balance carburetors for example. He can earn more money than most just by looking after rich peoples cars, and get to do something he enjoys in the process. Think I'm dreaming? A very good friend of mine became famous in the motorcycle world building parts for bikes, was always poor. So he took that skill where the money was, to the car world. Then he earned a big fat living driving to stately homes fitting parts he had built in his workshop for a few quid, charging each wealthy owner thousands in the process. You won't change the system, it's far too developed. You can learn to skim a good living off it if you have something unique that the people with money need. End of lecture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wsn03 Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 17 hours ago, UberMonkeySmallAndChunky said: Numbers like $200k would be possible if we went up in another mad bubble again and how often do you have to be right just to speculate at $3500 prices.... 1 in 57 times i got to make that a break even speculation - sounds like good odds to me risk/reward. To make a break even trade from $3500 to sell again @ $20k you only need to be right 1 in 5.7 times. If price goes down these odds improve more. The bit most of you are missing is that bitcoin has now had its mania, the bubble burst and people lost the shirts off their backs. That was full peak mania, full madness, but most importantly peak publicity. It has no reason to come back, just like the dotcom boom didn't. The biggest problem with Bitcoin is it serves no purpose. It is nothing more than an unregulated and unbacked set of computer digits. You can't touch it, or even use it for anything. At least with other bubbles, like say classic cars, the people who lost were still left with something they could use, Bitcoin is nothing more than a speculation as far as I can see. The other thing no one seems to point out is that you can't even safely keep it. If someone nicks your car you can insure it. If someone holds a gun to your head for your Bitcoin passwords and you have no recourse - and it has already happened to some unfortunate people. Its anarchic, very unsafe as a so called store of value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 56 minutes ago, wsn03 said: The bit most of you are missing is that bitcoin has now had its mania, the bubble burst and people lost the shirts off their backs. That was full peak mania, full madness, but most importantly peak publicity. It has no reason to come back, just like the dotcom boom didn't. The biggest problem with Bitcoin is it serves no purpose. It is nothing more than an unregulated and unbacked set of computer digits. You can't touch it, or even use it for anything. At least with other bubbles, like say classic cars, the people who lost were still left with something they could use, Bitcoin is nothing more than a speculation as far as I can see. The other thing no one seems to point out is that you can't even safely keep it. If someone nicks your car you can insure it. If someone holds a gun to your head for your Bitcoin passwords and you have no recourse - and it has already happened to some unfortunate people. Its anarchic, very unsafe as a so called store of value. young got dragged into to believing this new fangled thing was going to change the world, when in fact it was just another pump and dump scam orchestrated by media and big fiat holders anyway. how many morons loaded up on credit card debt to get in on the action. i tried to find some of these stories but can`t find any bitcoin bankruptcies at a small scale level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doomed Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 58 minutes ago, longgone said: young got dragged into to believing this new fangled thing was going to change the world, when in fact it was just another pump and dump scam orchestrated by media and big fiat holders anyway. how many morons loaded up on credit card debt to get in on the action. i tried to find some of these stories but can`t find any bitcoin bankruptcies at a small scale level. You are talking like it has failed already. There is still a long way to go in this space and I believe it will eventually have an impact far beyond what most imagine. There was a bubble based on speculation that current fundamentals couldn’t support that has collapsed. I expect most of these crypto protocols that exist today will disappear with a few surviving that will go on to become a major part of daily life for everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 16 minutes ago, doomed said: You are talking like it has failed already. There is still a long way to go in this space and I believe it will eventually have an impact far beyond what most imagine. There was a bubble based on speculation that current fundamentals couldn’t support that has collapsed. I expect most of these crypto protocols that exist today will disappear with a few surviving that will go on to become a major part of daily life for everyone. The technology is there, but that is not why people invest they just want cold hard cash and i believe that is over now. For another member to have over 100k of value in BTC from 2k when their own net worth was only 200k ish and not sell up is totally insane. i never see it reaching previous highs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doomed Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 2 minutes ago, longgone said: The technology is there, but that is not why people invest they just want cold hard cash and i believe that is over now. For another member to have over 100k of value in BTC from 2k when their own net worth was only 200k ish and not sell up is totally insane. i never see it reaching previous highs. Greed does funny things to people. The total market cap of the eventual winners will exceed the previous high by orders of magnitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 39 minutes ago, doomed said: Greed does funny things to people. lose mostly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kosmin Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Bitcoin hasn't moved much in several weeks. Have trading volumes been lower? Is anything noteworthy happening? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Nothing happening of any real note apart from the halving in May 2020. apart from the wider world, where the purchasing power of fiat continues its endless march to worthless imagine what inflation would of been if rents and house prices were included in the basket of goods over the last few years. That’s the real destruction of your purchasing power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
longgone Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 On a positive note fiat seems to be doing well against house prices and is on a positive trajectory. Which after all is what this forum is about. It feels good knowing that fiat pile is buying more bricks by the day. If there is any change left I may have a go on BTC is they reach 50 bucks a piece.? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jiltedjen Posted February 7, 2019 Share Posted February 7, 2019 Ten steps backwards and one step forward is not that great for fiat. but have a permanent portfolio and be immune Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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