How Did Microsoft Manage To Screw Up Their Tablet Os So Badly?

[Riedquat]

lets see, paperwork creation and flow, business presentations, marketing workouts, accounting, DTP, CAD, serious document production...all cant be done on a tablet or phone efficiently.

No they can't, at least not at anything beyond a casual level. Tablets and phones are becoming ever more popular because they cater for the not very demanding computing needs of an awful lot of people, and a full-blown proper computer is overkill for 99.9% of what they do but they're not up to scratch for most serious work.

[Bloo Loo]

No they can't, at least not at anything beyond a casual level. Tablets and phones are becoming ever more popular because they cater for the not very demanding computing needs of an awful lot of people, and a full-blown proper computer is overkill for 99.9% of what they do but they're not up to scratch for most serious work.

Ive rcently got myself an Android, and yes its good for reading the emails from my exchange, can write short answers, get in touch if needed. Where is scores over a PC OR a tablet is that it is in my pocket, so if i am doing say for example, calorie counting, I can pull it out and update...tablet or PC means a traipse off to where they live.

I can just about do my accounts on a netbook, and remote control too.

Its horses for courses, and yes, the PC market will contract for these reasons, but it isnt going away anytime soon, laptops are more pricey, have smaller screens and less reliability.

[Riedquat]

Ive rcently got myself an Android, and yes its good for reading the emails from my exchange, can write short answers, get in touch if needed. Where is scores over a PC OR a tablet is that it is in my pocket, so if i am doing say for example, calorie counting, I can pull it out and update...tablet or PC means a traipse off to where they live.

I can just about do my accounts on a netbook, and remote control too.

Its horses for courses, and yes, the PC market will contract for these reasons, but it isnt going away anytime soon, laptops are more pricey, have smaller screens and less reliability.

Yes - you can do simple things with them and that's all a lot of people need but the examples mentioned earlier are the sorts of things that still need doing but for which phones and tablets are unsuitable. Personally speaking I don't see the point in phones or tablets at all since I've got a desktop computer, and find the desire to constantly want access to the internet and so on wherever and whenever rather weird.

[LiveinHope]

The answer to all those question is going to be yes.

The next question is does your workplace Desktop run the latest version of Windows, Office etc

The answer to that question in many cases is going to be no.

It is strange

I am running XP and 2000 on my machines, much to the chagrin of my IT support.

Yet I have always upgraded my macs to the lastest OS X version

Basically, I have seen improvements in mac OS, but a constant loss of functionality and annoyances in the Windows OS.

[Habeas Domus]

Basically, I have seen improvements in mac OS, but a constant loss of functionality and annoyances in the Windows OS.

There have been a few backward moves in OSX, e.g. the scroll bars no longer have arrows so its impossible to scroll up and down by exactly one line at a time. But thats nothing compared to the mess of W8 and Surface.

Also it seems Ballmer was pushed out by the board

http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9241867/Ballmer_forced_out_after_900M_Surface_RT_debacle

[Guest TheBlueCat]

I mean, how?

They could have gone for a Microsoft office skin for android that incorporated Microsoft cloud functionality to beat evernote and dropbox, but had a minimum reqd hardware spec so could have a nice implementation of the office suiteon android, surely that would have been better and easier? Could have had deals with the major tablet manufacturers to bundle it with their higher end tablets, and maybe cut down functionality apps for slower tablets, then still compelling people to stick with the Microsoft ecosystem ie PCs for productivity work, instead they have lost badly heh

I think the answer is most likely in their corporate culture. This article talks about one aspect of it and I suspect the approach of strangling creativity with managerialism run pretty deep:

http://www.forbes.com/sites/frederickallen/2012/07/03/the-terrible-management-technique-that-cost-microsoft-its-creativity/

[MarkG]

Do you work in an office, and/or do you know people who work in offices?

Yes.

Do you/they use Microsoft Windows and Microsoft Office at work?

I have a Windows XP VM that I open every couple of months when I have to run Word, solely because the documentation folks claim that Open Office messes up their Word template formatting.

For everything else, we have Linux.

Do the companies they work for pay to license use of the software?

Yes, but we only just 'upgraded' to Word 2007, which was a downgrade as far as I'm concerned. I don't see us 'upgrading' the XP VMs any time.... well, ever, probably.

The only time I really use Windows much these days is for playing games. Otherwise Microsoft is pretty much irrelevant to me, other than their attempts to prevent people wiping Windows from new computers to install other operating systems. I can see five Linux machines (including one Android) and zero Windows machines from my sofa, and that's not counting the Blu-Ray players and TV.

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

the desktop space is in terminal decline?

lets see, paperwork creation and flow, business presentations, marketing workouts, accounting, DTP, CAD, serious document production...all cant be done on a tablet or phone efficiently.

tablets are good for picture presentations and casual home users.

phones are good for keeping in touch and other niknaks.

What you dont need is necessarily a laptop for the kids and wives, certainly not a PC, but for productivity and business, there is nothing to touch a good keyboard, mouse and monitor.

this is MSs current mistake....

That's like saying well, 'You can't write a novel on a Nokia 3310 so people will always need PCs'. A friend basically did write a novel on a smartphone with a bluetooth keyboard in her handbag.

When the first iPad came out it was as case of, 'So what? Another gizmo that surfs the web?' But now increased power and better apps mean people are using them for EPOS, recording albums, data logging, office productivity, or accessing company systems which increasingly offer a browser-based front end. iPads have been eating into the corporate Windows laptop market a lot. And why not? They are lighter, have great battery life and apps to handle typical tasks.

Years back I needed a desktop, a tower to have sufficient power. Now I just buy a high end laptop every few years (and occasionally use an external monitor/keyboard). I use the cloud much more now for smaller files so I can just grab my computer and have 95% of my working life on it. I certainly have seen many offices where many staff are laptop, and even tablet based, and just plug in when they're at the office. It's becoming commonplace.

And as these changes occur Microsoft is getting less and less relevant because they keep on dropping the ball by releasing nonsense.

[davidg]

Years back I needed a desktop, a tower to have sufficient power.

bang for buck you are still better off with a desktop system but probably only a minority of users need that power a desktop gives you, I'm thinking gamers who need high end graphics cards and anyone doing video editing.

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

bang for buck you are still better off with a desktop system but probably only a minority of users need that power a desktop gives you, I'm thinking gamers who need high end graphics cards and anyone doing video editing.

I do a lot of HD video editing on my 2010 MacBook. It gives you a good preview with no real lag so you can edit in real time and let the real rendering happen in the background at its own pace. So unless you are working in some time-pressured professional environment extreme power isn't really necessary even then.

[Bloo Loo]

That's like saying well, 'You can't write a novel on a Nokia 3310 so people will always need PCs'. A friend basically did write a novel on a smartphone with a bluetooth keyboard in her handbag.

When the first iPad came out it was as case of, 'So what? Another gizmo that surfs the web?' But now increased power and better apps mean people are using them for EPOS, recording albums, data logging, office productivity, or accessing company systems which increasingly offer a browser-based front end. iPads have been eating into the corporate Windows laptop market a lot. And why not? They are lighter, have great battery life and apps to handle typical tasks.

Years back I needed a desktop, a tower to have sufficient power. Now I just buy a high end laptop every few years (and occasionally use an external monitor/keyboard). I use the cloud much more now for smaller files so I can just grab my computer and have 95% of my working life on it. I certainly have seen many offices where many staff are laptop, and even tablet based, and just plug in when they're at the office. It's becoming commonplace.

And as these changes occur Microsoft is getting less and less relevant because they keep on dropping the ball by releasing nonsense.

I didnt say you couldnt write anything on a phone.

I dont have a handbag, but I would write on a smart phone if I spent a lot of time travelling and thats all I had...not she would have attained 90 wpm or touch typing on the train/plane.

Many jobs today produce nothing but paperwork, an account entry and a bank balance change. for the sake of ergonomics alone, a phone isnt going to fit the bill. And people over 40 may well have an issue simply seeing the screen.

[stormymonday_2011]

And as these changes occur Microsoft is getting less and less relevant because they keep on dropping the ball by releasing nonsense.

I think the last line is the key.

If MS want to protect the Desktop and extend its life then the way to do it is to come up with a better Windows Desktop operating system not the horrible Windows 8

The truth is that the current versions of Windows biggest competitor is the previous version of Windows (XP, 7 etc) not the IPAD , Android, Linux etc

If they want to survive they need to improve their product with each release not make it more painful to use.

[CrashedOutAndBurned]

I think the last line is the key.

If MS want to protect the Desktop and extend its life then the way to do it is to come up with a better Windows Desktop operating system not the horrible Windows 8

The truth is that the current versions of Windows biggest competitor is the previous version of Windows (XP, 7 etc) not the IPAD , Android, Linux etc

If they want to survive they need to improve their product with each release not make it more painful to use.

Yes, you can almost forgive dogs dinner that was Vista as with extreme corporate pressure there's always a chance a product will be rushed out half-baked and slowly fixed later.

But Windows 8 seems to be wilfully dreadful. It''s like people that have no clue how to innovate making a caricature of innovation.

[MarkG]

That's like saying well, 'You can't write a novel on a Nokia 3310 so people will always need PCs'. A friend basically did write a novel on a smartphone with a bluetooth keyboard in her handbag.

You can write a novel on stone blocks with a chisel. That doesn't mean it's a sensible way to do so.

Tablets are less efficient than a PC for pretty much any kind of content creation. There was a time where many of our customers had iPads, but now they've mostly switched back to laptops (mostly Mac and Linux, I think) because they're much better for doing real work.

[LiveinHope]

Tablets are less efficient than a PC for pretty much any kind of content creation. There was a time where many of our customers had iPads, but now they've mostly switched back to laptops (mostly Mac and Linux, I think) because they're much better for doing real work.

I have never understood tablets. A Smartphone yes, a pocket computer that you can even run presentations from to projectors, but apart from the cost, if you are talking apple for example, an 11" macbook Air makes so much more sense than an iPad.

[Sour Mash]

I have never understood tablets. A Smartphone yes, a pocket computer that you can even run presentations from to projectors, but apart from the cost, if you are talking apple for example, an 11" macbook Air makes so much more sense than an iPad.

If you are doing the sort of stuff that about 90% of consumers use computers for at home - some web browsing, checking for new emails, checking social networks, sending some instant messages, casual gaming - then a tablet is way more convenient and comfortable to use than any laptop and quite a bit cheaper. It's also nicer to use than a smartphone thanks to the bigger screen. It's basically a 'luxury' variant of a smartphone. Smartphone screens are of course getting bigger to offer some of that luxury to phone users but there is a practical limit on just how hefty you want your phone to be and even a small 7" tablet form factor offers more usability that a 5" phone which is pushing the borders of what you want to carry with you all the time.

For most people, the only reason to go to a laptop or desktop computer is because of the physical keyboard. That's why I have a Chromebook that I use to supplement my tablet. This allows me to do just about everything I want to do IT-wise at home .. and tablet and Chromebook offer instant-on with really easy to use form factors which seals the deal.

The amount of times per week that I bother getting up and going upstairs to power on my main PC to do something can be counted on one hand (increasingly, it doesn't even get used for weeks at a time) - I used to be on it most evenings.

Of course, if you want to do real IT or office related work at home you'll probably find that a traditional PC/ screen/ keyboard/ mouse suits your needs better - but that is a very small part of the market for consumer computing and that's where all the money is at.

[MrPin]

I think more black people should make telephones!

[Riedquat]

But Windows 8 seems to be wilfully dreadful. It''s like people that have no clue how to innovate making a caricature of innovation.

I wonder if it's a case of running out of things that the previous OS doesn't do that anyone would want it to do - there's no actual need whatsoever for a new version of Windows, but they need to keep coming up with something "new" anyway to try to sell stuff. IMO that's been largely true since XP (and the main advantage of that over previous versions was mostly that it didn't crash every five minutes).

[rw42]

But Windows 8 seems to be wilfully dreadful. It''s like people that have no clue how to innovate making a caricature of innovation.

The impression i got from seeing it's adverts and a bit of it, but not using it, is that it was designed based on what'd look great in an advert.

From my point of view (games, internet, development, random bits and pieces), mostly what i want are applications, and the operating system to stay the hell out of the way.

MS seem to want to make all your interactions go through the OS, making it a brand. I want to use my apps, alt-tab between them quickly, and be able to copy data between them. In all of that the only way the O/S can make itself noticed is by making it hard, intrusive, or useless at doing any of that.

Windows 7 is fine for me, i can't see myself upgrading for a very long time.

[The Masked Tulip]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-24564738

WHY did they not do this in the first place? How can a company that big make such a simple mistake?

Anyone on 8.1 yet?

Narcissism?

[Bloo Loo]

Windows 8.0 works on a laptop providing the laptop hardware is made a little more capable..

I am running a Toshiba with WIndows 8 and it is fine...mainly because it has a large touch pad and you can do enhanced swipes and strokes on it..However, if you need to use a mouse as you would on a full size desktop, then it would remain rubbish.

I gather the 8.1 previews were different for different triallers...some had the start button, others didnt..In fact I only checked yesterday on the MS 8.1 website and they were still issuing trial versions for test.

Apps downloaded seem to be mainly for small touch screen use and pretty useless on the lappy.

Should get my free upgrade shortly in the ether then.

[The Masked Tulip]

Too little, too late. I know so many people this year who were going to buy new Windows laptops but instead opted for tablets.

[Guest eight]

Too little, too late. I know so many people this year who were going to buy new Windows laptops but instead opted for tablets.

I "upgraded" to a refurb Dell desktop with Windows 7. As far as I'm concerned, it's great!

[Guest TheBlueCat]

http://www.bbc.co.uk...nology-24564738

WHY did they not do this in the first place? How can a company that big make such a simple mistake?

Anyone on 8.1 yet?

I've just downgraded my Windows 8 laptop to Windows 7. I spent nearly a year trying to get to like it but gave up in the end. It wasn't just the hideously user-vicious GUI either, the way that patches would routinely take half an hour to install themselves was particularly annoying. I suspect this may be the last Windows OS I ever buy and I don't think I'm unusual in that.

[StainlessSteelCat]

Narcissism?

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