Johnny Storm Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Much if not most of the child payments are being paid to families now living overseas - it's a huge scam which was known about years ago when I worked for immigration and is probably much worse now. We need things like this on the news! Would make a great pre-election news story wouldnt it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caribbean Beauty Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Just read my post again and it does make me sound a little like the BNP's first ethnic West Indian member, so in the interest of balance I should add that tens of thousands of ethnic Brits also defraud the CB/etc system by emigrating overseas while leaving their bank payments running forever (eg the Costas, but we met one family in the Caribbean doing it). I believe the maximum time one is permitted to be overseas for and still claim is 6 weeks, might be wrong, but in some developing countries the CB payments alone represent more money than paid to a local teacher, copper etc. So this fraud transcends all racial lines - from UK chavs to crack crazed third worlders. Feel better now Hopefully one of our resident BNP members will take this insider scandal story to the media, via the pig-farmer, although I suspect it is fairly well known? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptherebels Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Much if not most of the child payments are being paid to families now living overseas - it's a huge scam which was known about years ago when I worked for immigration and is probably much worse now. I know of people who have come here from Eastern Europe, and claim child benefit for children who still live back at home. These kids were not born here, and have never even vistited the UK. Is this allowed? If not, how do you stop it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChadzKhan Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Much if not most of the child payments .............................. The losses to us must run into the billions and make me sick. Thanks for that, was quite an eye opener surly something has to be done, but sadly i apportion more blame to the govt as if it wanted to it could stop this. As for people doing this well if any dodgy person see's loopholes they can use to their advantage, they will! look at the recent MP's expenses scandal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caribbean Beauty Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Thanks for that, was quite an eye opener surly something has to be done, but sadly i apportion more blame to the govt as if it wanted to it could stop this. As for people doing this well if any dodgy person see's loopholes they can use to their advantage, they will! look at the recent MP's expenses scandal. Yes it was largely a product of the New Lab regime, who made an existing problem worse by introducing new IT and bank payment systems (while trimming human checks to 0) which made it easier to setup claims and run. All of the foreign gangmasters, snakeheads etc know of the scams - the ones I outlined do not even require forged documents (except child-lending which does, eg a forged Somali birth certificate which might cost a fiver and is impossibloe to disprove). The other big problem is that in some cases the DWP employees themselves are organising or selling claims to their own people - eg in London a DWP job is highly sought after by members of (for instance) the west african communities. Hell, we even had sophisticated Nigerian fraudsters boldly adopting fake UK identities and squeezing by all the checks and balances to become immigration officers!!! Always covered up, but one gets exposed and fired (sometimes prosecuted/deported too) every couple of years. It is all just too damn easy. But the Observer story is indicative of how our corrupt government would rather target the middle classes (for small savings) than, woe betide, risk upsetting immigrant populations with any kind of enforcement crackdowns or tighter new procedures. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dremmler Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 the best cuts would also be non means tested. salaries for Public Sector workers. I propose a 50% cut of all PubSec Salaries above a point of £25,000. so a £50,000 salary would be cut to £37,500....still a high salary. =============================================================== In that case you'll be performing your own hip replacement operation on yourself when you are older then, presumably. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 the best cuts would also be non means tested.salaries for Public Sector workers. I propose a 50% cut of all PubSec Salaries above a point of £25,000. so a £50,000 salary would be cut to £37,500....still a high salary. =============================================================== In that case you'll be performing your own hip replacement operation on yourself when you are older then, presumably. heres a novel idea, maybe he'll use his own money to pay someone to replace it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingsgate Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 There are too many people. Only people that can afford to have children should have them. People who decide they cant afford to have children and therefore dont have them should not be paying for others who equally cant afford them.As we have seen in society. The more well to do intelligent people are waiting to their 30s to have a child and then struggling due to fertility problems. The 16 year old chav has 4 by the time she is 20 to different rainbox coloured fathers. This will be the doom of our society. Out bred by chavs and immigrants, who we pay to breed while we do not. Agree totally. We should be paying the better people to breed, and stop paying the thickoes and wasters to do so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptherebels Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 It is allowed. Yes, some people have said that is the case. Others however, have said that it's not. I don't know who is right. The mothers of these children, claim child benefit in their own country, and the fathers claim it in the UK. Now if that is all legal, I should be able to claim child benefit for my children, who live with their mother in another EU country. So the child benefit gets claimed twice for the same kids. Have I got that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 The politics show,,,all they are talking about is the cutting of benefits. they dont even mention job cuts, except that thats what the Tories would have done. Its NOT the benefits thats crippling....ITS THE TOTAL OVERKILLING ADMINISTRATION OF THEM,,, the Quangos, the high salaries, the high pensions. they could cut ALL these...WITHOUT affecting services to the needy. course, they wont. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Yes, some people have said that is the case. Others however, have said that it's not. I don't know who is right. The mothers of these children, claim child benefit in their own country, and the fathers claim it in the UK. Now if that is all legal, I should be able to claim child benefit for my children, who live with their mother in another EU country. So the child benefit gets claimed twice for the same kids. Have I got that right? you should also be able to claim for your neighbours kids as long as you babysit for them at least once a year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uptherebels Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 you should also be able to claim for your neighbours kids as long as you babysit for them at least once a year A great help. Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minos Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 A great help. Thank you. Don't forget to pay for your "I'm not a paedo licence" first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keeprenting Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 (edited) It should be the other way round. The state should be incentivising the middle classes to have children because they will take better care of them and their children will turn out better in the long run. In the twisted vote-buying world of NuLab, however, the country is encouraging to have children the people who will make the worst job of it. I think the best approach would simply be to abolish child benefit altogether. Huge savings, including wiping out the cost of administering it. If you want a child, get off your a*se and do some work so that you have the money to support it. Having children should be a privilege not a right. Edited September 13, 2009 by keeprenting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pindar Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 When will these b@stards stop $hitting on the working population? To save a few pennies here and there to pay for the bailout of failed banks "to pay our national debt" - so we gave taxpayers money to the institutions to which the national debt is owed and now we are doing their bidding to suck ever more liquidity out of the hands of ordinary people (except when it's to buy overpriced houses). Max Keiser is right, it is a financial oligarchy and these people and their minions are financial terrorists of the highest order. I note that the article doesn't have any real facts and figures as it seems entirely driven by ideology and emotional rhetoric. Please "The Observer" - lets get the miniscule amount that's actually paid out in child benefit, "winter warmers" etc. into perspective against a backdrop of MPs expense scandals, bank bailouts and government waste on IT projects. The UK is steadily becoming more like Mexico every day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Storm Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 When will these b@stards stop $hitting on the working population? To save a few pennies here and there to pay for the bailout of failed banks "to pay our national debt" - so we gave taxpayers money to the institutions to which the national debt is owed and now we are doing their bidding to suck ever more liquidity out of the hands of ordinary people (except when it's to buy overpriced houses). When we vote them out? Although I tend to be a Conservative voter, I am far from convinced that its going to be any different under them. Maybe even worse as they up the taxation to try and pay for all the lavish spending. What I really want is a popularist government, where they actually do what people want. You know, like a democracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R K Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 So Gordon's great plan is to first pay the elderly's winter fuel bill and TV licence and then when he needs to find the money to pay the banksters whip it back off them. How does an elderly couple living a very frugal existence on a fixed pension suddenly cover an additional £400 winter fuel payment and £150 to keep watching TV legally? That's £550 additional tax equivalent, in their 80s, on a fixed income - easily a double figures tax hike! Gordon is planning to force the elderly to starve themselves and die from the winter cold to fund the banksters excesses. This shower would kill your grand parents without breaking their stride if they thought they'd get re-elected. :angry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tonkers Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 It should be the other way round. The state should be incentiving the middle classes to have children because they will take better care of them and their children will turn out better in the long run.In the twisted vote-buying world of NuLab, however, the country is encouraging to have children the people who will make the worst job of it. I think the best approach would simply be to abolish child benefit altogether. Huge savings, including wiping out the cost of administering it. If you want a child, get off your a*se and do some work so that you have the money to support it. Having children should be a privilege not a right. +1 However I don't think it will change behaviours! Then we have a child poverty disaster and many more chidren in children's homes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minos Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 So Gordon's great plan is to first pay the elderly's winter fuel bill and TV licence and then when he needs to find the money to pay the banksters whip it back off them.How does an elderly couple living a very frugal existence on a fixed pension suddenly cover an additional £400 winter fuel payment and £150 to keep watching TV legally? That's £550 additional tax equivalent, in their 80s, on a fixed income - easily a double figures tax hike! Gordon is planning to force the elderly to starve themselves and die from the winter cold to fund the banksters excesses. This shower would kill your grand parents without breaking their stride if they thought they'd get re-elected. :angry: I think all Labour can really do now is chose which sword to fall on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Girly girl Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 I think all Labour can really do now is chose which sword to fall on. Which is exactly what they did last time and leave the mess for the other party to clear up, meaning in peoples minds, labour = good lots of money, tories = bad lots of cuts. I say vote the bastards back in and make them sort it out one way or another, force them to live with their actions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Storm Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 Which is exactly what they did last time and leave the mess for the other party to clear up, meaning in peoples minds, labour = good lots of money, tories = bad lots of cuts.I say vote the bastards back in and make them sort it out one way or another, force them to live with their actions. I think last time Labour = winter of discontent, labour = massive inflation, labour = powercuts. People arent quite as stupid as you think, but they do have a short memory and perhaps after another 15 years they will try socialism again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pindar Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 I think last time Labour = winter of discontent, labour = massive inflation, labour = powercuts.People arent quite as stupid as you think, but they do have a short memory and perhaps after another 15 years they will try socialism again. The system relies on this phenomenon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest joeschmo Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 (edited) I think that a sensible start will be to remove all "child/family" allowances, credits or whatever else it is called from any family "unit" earning above say £30 k pa Edited September 13, 2009 by joeschmo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgia O'Keeffe Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 I think last time Labour = winter of discontent, labour = massive inflation, labour = powercuts.People arent quite as stupid as you think, but they do have a short memory and perhaps after another 15 years they will try socialism again. Labour may well have got back in after 1 term last time were it not for the Argies. Im damn sure whoever wins the next election will get no more than 1 term though because they will be dealing with the real fallout from the credit bubble burst and pretty much all real economic data of the last two years suggest its gonna make the 70's seem like Nirvana. As for the voting publics stupidity, this site and that bright blue graph tends to say people tend to be even more stupid than most people could ever imagine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gideon Posted September 13, 2009 Share Posted September 13, 2009 You got it.More means testing just creates more incentives to remain poor. While high earners will apparently leave the country if they face a marginal tax rate over 50%, those on lower earnings face much higher marginal deduction rates (tax, national insurance, tapered reductions in tax credits and benefits). Means testing is part of the problem, not part of the solution. 'Absurd': http://stumblingandmumbling.typepad.com/st.../08/absurd.html +1 Means testing is evil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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