Warning To Uk Govt: Pay The Police And Army Well..

[Guest_chris c-t_*]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/sep/30/ecuador-chaos-police-rafael-correa

President Rafael Correa pelted with tear gas as police angry at new law that cuts their benefits launch chaotic rebellion.

...

I think I recall that Thatcher was told to pay the police and army well in order to execute cuts. It remains to be seen what will happen in the UK now, I suppose. However, getting the police to work free for 18 months and cutting defence spending doesn't seem like ideal self-preservation planning by the Govt!

[pie-eater]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/sep/30/ecuador-chaos-police-rafael-correa

President Rafael Correa pelted with tear gas as police angry at new law that cuts their benefits launch chaotic rebellion.

...

I think I recall that Thatcher was told to pay the police and army well in order to execute cuts. It remains to be seen what will happen in the UK now, I suppose. However, getting the police to work free for 18 months and cutting defence spending doesn't seem like ideal self-preservation planning by the Govt!

I was in the armed forces in 1990 and recall getting a healthy 20% hike in pay thanks to Mags.

[Charlie The Tramp Returns]

I was in the armed forces in 1990 and recall getting a healthy 20% hike in pay thanks to Mags.

Yes dear old Thatcher knew what she was doing, it was rumoured in the early 80s she was prepared to call in the Territorials if civil disobedience got out of control and the Police could not handle any out of control situation, another purpose of the TA`s duties, as similar to the National Guard in the US.

I remember at the time believing I was still a Reservist sharpening my bayonet up ready to do a bit of prodding.

[General Congreve]

Had to admire President Rafael Correa balls though. He stood there while the police kicked off and basically told them "Come on then, lynch me!".

[Injin]

Had to admire President Rafael Correa balls though. He stood there while the police kicked off and basically told them "Come on then, lynch me!".

And now he's sat in a small room somewhere with his head in his hands going "what the ****** was I thinking???"

[pie-eater]

Yes dear old Thatcher knew what she was doing, it was rumoured in the early 80s she was prepared to call in the Territorials if civil disobedience got out of control and the Police could not handle any out of control situation, another purpose of the TA`s duties, as similar to the National Guard in the US.

I remember at the time believing I was still a Reservist sharpening my bayonet up ready to do a bit of prodding.

I'm a copper now, so would welcome another hike in pay........

The feeling is that unrest is coming - riots as per the early 80s. Hope not, but people are poor again, and the cuts will hurt.

[South Lorne]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/sep/30/ecuador-chaos-police-rafael-correa

President Rafael Correa pelted with tear gas as police angry at new law that cuts their benefits launch chaotic rebellion.

...

I think I recall that Thatcher was told to pay the police and army well in order to execute cuts. It remains to be seen what will happen in the UK now, I suppose. However, getting the police to work free for 18 months and cutting defence spending doesn't seem like ideal self-preservation planning by the Govt!

...don't know whether she was 'told' but the Police were well remunerated under Maggie if I remember , correctly.....

[mdman]

The difference between now and the 1980s is that the police don't please anyone now. By laying into poor unemployed black men and unions back then, they kept the support of the core Tory vote. Now that they've harassed the law-abiding middle class while ignoring the misery inflicted by anti-social yobs, they've lost public support.

The threat of recruiting the TA in the event of police strikes should keep them on their toes. Let's hope they get the **** culled out of them

['Bart']

I think I recall that Thatcher was told to pay the police and army well

Might have been a 1979 election promise. A mate of mine who was in the army at the time (and is a bit of a "Red Robbo" at the bus depot he works at now) voted for Thatcher in the expectation of a decent pay rise.

and the Police could not handle any out of control situation

Given the state of modern British policing, maybe it's time call call in the TAs now?

Now that they've harassed the law-abiding middle class while ignoring the misery inflicted by anti-social yobs, they've lost public support.

They'll come to regret such an ill-advised course of action. Ain't Karma a bitch?

[Bloo Loo]

I'm a copper now, so would welcome another hike in pay........

The feeling is that unrest is coming - riots as per the early 80s. Hope not, but people are poor again, and the cuts will hurt.

take on the people at your peril. strike them down now, and learn to forever sleep with a gun under your pillow.

[pyracantha]

Now that they've harassed the law-abiding middle class while ignoring the misery inflicted by anti-social yobs, they've lost public support.

Agreed. I have no problems with individual policemen and women - I dated a (female) DS and respected what she did.

However we hear too many stories of high numbers of police retiring early on full pensions due to medical ('stress') reasons getting more money than new recruits ever will.

The police have allowed themselves to get sucked into the whole Political Correctness nonsense and in doing so have become toothless. The rate of crime reporting in this country is low, clearance rates likewise.

Speed cameras are lazy policing and widely resented as piggy-banks while criminalising drivers. (Some more enlightened forces are offering driving courses as an alternative to points).

What might help is if the police could actually "grow some" and tell the government what they need, to do the job properly.

[erranta]

Might have been a 1979 election promise. A mate of mine who was in the army at the time (and is a bit of a "Red Robbo" at the bus depot he works at now) voted for Thatcher in the expectation of a decent pay rise.

Given the state of modern British policing, maybe it's time call call in the TAs now?

They'll come to regret such an ill-advised course of action. Ain't Karma a bitch?

I'm pretty sure a quick phone call or two from Maggie to her Dictator 'Confident' and the Malvinas Invasion was deliberately created to deflect the UK public anger at the time which was getting out of hand and threatening the Govt!

All that full marching band on the quayside 'pomp & ceremony' as the liners left etc!

['Bart']

All that full marching band on the quayside 'pomp & ceremony' as the liners left etc!

That was a very, very odd time IMO. It was a bit like the collective mass grieving for Diana. It was almost as if the country had gone collectively crackers. Or maybe the place had always been like that and I just hadn't noticed.

Refusing to buy Argentinean corned beef.

Heckling a singer so much that she had to remove "Don't Cry for me Argentina" from her repertoire.

The Sun's "Gotcha" headline regarding what was, after all, the deaths of 323 Argentinean sailors.

Maybe the UK had taken so many knocks over the previous 10-15 years that we needed to win at something. After all, we even lost the Cod War.

[monks]

That was a very, very odd time IMO. It was a bit like the collective mass grieving for Diana. It was almost as if the country had gone collectively crackers. Or maybe the place had always been like that and I just hadn't noticed.

Refusing to buy Argentinean corned beef.

Heckling a singer so much that she had to remove "Don't Cry for me Argentina" from her repertoire.

The Sun's "Gotcha" headline regarding what was, after all, the deaths of 323 Argentinean sailors.

Maybe the UK had taken so many knocks over the previous 10-15 years that we needed to win at something. After all, we even lost the Cod War.

I think you are forgetting a key point... They started it !

[xux42]

but people are poor again, and the cuts will hurt.

They always were poor and have been cruelly misled.

[Caius]

I think you are forgetting a key point... They started it !

If history begins in the 80's.....then yes.

[monks]

If history begins in the 80's.....then yes.

Correct. Modern history relevant to this discussion.

But perhaps you are being sarcastic, in which case, I suppose you will be petitioning David Cameron to apologise for the 1762 British invasion of Cuba.

[Big Orange]

There's always been yobs in this country, except in recent decades they've got access to cars, with less of a barrier between the well off and crappy areas. And also you cannot really deal with the chavs because they're less embedded in society and they're less accountable than property owners.

And as flawed as the police are and overworked as the military are, I was wondering what's going through the heads of the current plutocrats if they think they can push around hundreds of thousands of highly trained people who have access to weapons, and not respecting the troops has been the downfall of any regime. It will probably be thousands of armed men that will march on London eventually.

Edited October 1, 2010 by Big Orange

[Minos]

There's always been yobs in this country, except in recent decades they've got access to cars, with less of a barrier between the well off and crappy areas. And also you cannot really deal with the chavs because they're less embedded in society and they're less accountable than property owners.

And as flawed as the police are and overworked as the military are, I was wondering what's going through the heads of the current plutocrats if they think they can push around hundreds of thousands of highly trained people who have access to weapons, and not respecting the troops has been the downfall of any regime. It will probably be thousands of armed men that will march on London eventually.

So to summarise, the police and army are more than happy to beat the crap out of the peasants if the money is right, if it's not they will turn against the paymasters?

[blankster]

Many people in the police and the military will have friends and relations who work in the public sector and are at risk of losing their jobs. With CND, animal rights or the pro-hunting protests, or even the Scargill's big miner's strike, there will have been didvided loyalties to some extent because some policemen will have had relations who were protesters or strikers. But the head of steam building up in the public sector about the cuts (forced on them by Gordon Brown's great 'socialist' act of robbing the poor to pay the rich) is likely to be much bigger if it gets organised. Add to this that many of the angry people this time round will be articulate middle-management in the public sector, not just a load of sheep like Scargill's coal miners were.

[RufflesTheGuineaPig]

I don't get it... where are these troops you think they will use to repress the british population.... are these the ones in Germany, the ones in the Falklands, the ones in Nortern Ireland or the ones in Afganistan.

Because most of the troops left in the UK aren't up to much... they are a mix on pen pushers, coffin dodgers and injured troops recuperating befre return to duty/dismissal. Almost anyone who can hold a gun is currently on active operations.

We do however, have a heavily armed near paramilitary police force.

TIP: The police force report to the prime minister, the troops report to the queen.

[blankster]

Many people in the police and the military will have friends and relations who work in the public sector and are at risk of losing their jobs. With CND, animal rights or the pro-hunting protests, or even the Scargill's big miner's strike, there will have been didvided loyalties to some extent because some policemen will have had relations who were protesters or strikers. But the head of steam building up in the public sector about the cuts (forced on them by Gordon Brown's great 'socialist' act of robbing the poor to pay the rich) is likely to be much bigger if it gets organised. Add to this that many of the angry people this time round will be articulate middle-management in the public sector, not just a load of sheep like Scargill's coal miners were. (I'm not a class snob, I'm a Southerner and I guess it's that north-south divide showing through )

Edited October 1, 2010 by blankster

[I want a house!]

Yes dear old Thatcher knew what she was doing, it was rumoured in the early 80s she was prepared to call in the Territorials if civil disobedience got out of control and the Police could not handle any out of control situation, another purpose of the TA`s duties, as similar to the National Guard in the US.

I remember at the time believing I was still a Reservist sharpening my bayonet up ready to do a bit of prodding.

So, you are willing to use force to suppress the citizens of a country? That makes me question your loyalty to your people. Governments are mostly corrupt and self serving. Only time the army should ever be used is in defense, that's my personal opinion. I was conscripted and I refuse to kill another man for any government unless in self defense.

Just my opinion.

[Big Orange]

So to summarise, the police and army are more than happy to beat the crap out of the peasants if the money is right, if it's not they will turn against the paymasters?

Yes, just ask Csar Nicholas the 2nd.

[Snugglybear]

Well...

What remains of the armed forces is already pretty fully committed.

The Defence Review is apparently taking a very close look at the TA - story from this Tuesday 28th

David Cameron will today discuss the scale of cuts to the armed forces at a meeting of the government's new national security council, amid doubts about the size and role of the Territorial Army.

The council will debate the strategic defence and security review, the first exercise of its kind for 13 years, which aims to identify military priorities against a backdrop of public spending cuts.

One of the options for saving costs is to cut the Territorial Army from its existing level of 35,000 troops to just 9,000, according to the Daily Telegraph.

The Metropolitan Police are proposing that no-one gets to join until they've done 18 months as a volunteer unpaid copper.

There are already plans to axe jobs in most police forces.

It seems like that the very generous police pensions arrangements are being scrutinised.

So... Good luck to the Government if the populace ever does start rioting. I'm struggling to imagine who exactly will be standing between the two sides.

I suppose those in power could try the Big Society idea and call on volunteers to defend them.