Si1 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 1 hour ago, Killer Bunny said: Not yet. They want the £ materially lower Vs $ and €. 5,4,3... I doubt they'll even have exchange controls. Do you reckon they'll end up having a formal exchange rate target? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 I'm understanding what Killer Bunny's talking about. With regards to the housing market, true capitalism would deliver a price point entry for just about everyone. You only have £10k to spend, you get a one room shack or a converted portacabin. This isn't the way it's working though, as in 2020 ex-council flats and fooking garages in London are selling for £500k/£1 milllion and nonsense like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 19 minutes ago, cnick said: So it's not unreasonable to say we have never known capitalism in our lifetime.......we just got more socialist?......kind of a natural 'progression' ........ down the plug 'ole? We got closer than for decades in the 80s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, Si1 said: Do you reckon they'll end up having a formal exchange rate target? It's already there. Parity with € and $, which means it will likely go below parity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Social Justice League said: I'm understanding what Killer Bunny's talking about. With regards to the housing market, true capitalism would deliver a price point entry for just about everyone. You only have £10k to spend, you get a one room shack or a converted portacabin. This isn't the way it's working though, as in 2020 ex-council flats and fooking garages in London are selling for £500k/£1 milllion and nonsense like that. 'It's working'? You believe we have capitalism??? ??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Killer Bunny said: 'It's working'? You believe we have capitalism??? ??? I'd rather have a system that delivers for the majority of citizens, whatever it is. At the moment the system only delivers for leeches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: I'm understanding what Killer Bunny's talking about. With regards to the housing market, true capitalism would deliver a price point entry for just about everyone. You only have £10k to spend, you get a one room shack or a converted portacabin. This isn't the way it's working though, as in 2020 ex-council flats and fooking garages in London are selling for £500k/£1 milllion and nonsense like that. 10k is a deposit on a help to buy slave box. Bit of mortgage fraud and it's yours. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 1 minute ago, Si1 said: 10k is a deposit on a help to buy slave box. Bit of mortgage fraud and it's yours. 10k should be enough to buy someone some kind of shelter, even if it's only a large garden shed and the tiny plot of land to build it on, but that isn't allowed in our bent system. You have to "buy" a shitty new build from Wimpy and then beg a bank to create you some funny money out of thin air to buy it with. It's nonsense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluestone59 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: At the moment the system only delivers for leeches. Yes, very true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhole Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: true capitalism would deliver a price point entry for just about everyone. Indeed, until Financialization gets its dirty claws in. Then we're in ponzi land, but we tell the masses "your getting richer!!!11" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: 10k should be enough to buy someone some kind of shelter, even if it's only a large garden shed and the tiny plot of land to build it on, but that isn't allowed in our bent system. You have to "buy" a shitty new build from Wimpy and then beg a bank to create you some funny money out of thin air to buy it with. It's nonsense. Yes. All about vested interests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluestone59 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 On those occasions when we do venture into real productive work, we then come up with Britain's loveable mass market housebuilders. Purveyors of one of the worst value for money products on the planet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 11 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: I'd rather have a system that delivers for the majority of citizens, whatever it is. At the moment the system only delivers for leeches. Socialism/corporatism/cronyism ... which lead to nazism/communism/fascism/feudalism. Again. Yet again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Social Justice League Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 Either what is needed is pure socialism where the state provides what the people need or pure capitalism which provides what the people need at multiple price points that anyone with an income can afford. At the moment we have a system that delivers fook all to just about everyone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnick Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 22 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: I'd rather have a system that delivers for the majority of citizens, whatever it is. At the moment the system only delivers for leeches. Yes, and they're leaching on the very system that tries (fails) to 'deliver' to the majority? ..... we've never known true capitalism. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: Either what is needed is pure socialism where the state provides what the people need or pure capitalism which provides what the people need at multiple price points that anyone with an income can afford. At the moment we have a system that delivers fook all to just about everyone. There is no such thing as pure socialism. It is entirely against human nature. Capitalism works when given a chance. See the 19th C US for example, up to 1921. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 35 minutes ago, Killer Bunny said: Yes. The natural course is deflation - technology, efficiency etc. Nonsense on stilts, Tufton Street. Even by your standards. Economies inflate and deflate for all manner of reason: war; drought; pestilence; population explosion and migration; malinvestment and the vagaries of the business cycle. In accordance the whims and vicissitudes of the market, the creation and destruction of money is fundamentally unpredictable. Until 2008, most of it existed outside of the banking system, beyond the reach of any govt regulator or supervisory authority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnick Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Social Justice League said: 10k should be enough to buy someone some kind of shelter, even if it's only a large garden shed and the tiny plot of land to build it on, but that isn't allowed in our bent system. You have to "buy" a shitty new build from Wimpy and then beg a bank to create you some funny money out of thin air to buy it with. It's nonsense. Yes, they create it from thin air..........but you (we) have to 'repay' ???!!? 15 minutes ago, Killer Bunny said: There is no such thing as pure socialism. It is entirely against human nature. Capitalism works when given a chance. See the 19th C US for example, up to 1921. Absolutely, but who 'supplies' the money ....... perhaps no one......just people to look after it under pain of death if they attempt to defraud....?. ......... kindof rhetorical Edited July 10, 2020 by cnick the usual....spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 19 minutes ago, Killer Bunny said: There is no such thing as pure socialism. It is entirely against human nature. Not completely. During times of economic stress, famine, etc, tribes and societies tend to mush together, which is a natural tendency to socialism when survival requires it. In my amateur opinion. Most of the time competition, capitalism and informed self interest rule, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Si1 said: Not completely. During times of economic stress, famine, etc, tribes and societies tend to mush together, which is a natural tendency to socialism when survival requires it. In my amateur opinion. Most of the time competition, capitalism and informed self interest rule, though. And what then happens in the tribe? Mr Knuckles or Mr Devious wants more. Self Interest is the greatest thing ever. How else would we have the wheel? Or modern agriculture? Or the smartphone? Or democracy? Or the decimation of poverty for billions? Edited July 10, 2020 by Killer Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnick Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, Killer Bunny said: And what then happens in the tribe? Mr Knuckles or Mr Devious wants more. Self Interest is the greatest thing ever. How else would we have the wheel? Or modern agriculture? Or the smartphone? Or democracy? Or the decimation of poverty for billions? So, how are Messrs Knuckle & Devious dealt with......or anyperson who causes or threatens another with harm or loss? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 20 minutes ago, cnick said: So, how are Messrs Knuckle & Devious dealt with......or anyperson who causes or threatens another with harm or loss? They rise to the top and screw the majority. Corporatism/Feudalism/Socialism/Fascism/Communism/Nazism What do you think a King is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cnick Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, Killer Bunny said: They rise to the top and screw the majority. Corporatism/Feudalism/Socialism/Fascism/Communism/Nazism What do you think a King is? Yes, I know, but how would...or should.... they be dealt with?....practically......as a capitalist I would like to know......I certainly wouldn't advocate violence to attack.....but think it reasonable that people have the right to defend themselves against attack......I think this may go to the heart of the difference between true socialism & true capitalism?......maybe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, cnick said: Yes, I know, but how would...or should.... they be dealt with?....practically......as a capitalist I would like to know......I certainly wouldn't advocate violence to attack.....but think it reasonable that people have the right to defend themselves against attack......I think this may go to the heart of th “Government has three primary functions. It should provide for military defense of the nation. It should enforce contracts between individuals. It should protect citizens from crimes against themselves or their property. When government-- in pursuit of good intentions tries to rearrange the economy, legislate morality, or help special interests, the cost come in inefficiency, lack of motivation, and loss of freedom. Government should be a referee, not an active player.” ― Milton Friedman Edited July 10, 2020 by Killer Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killer Bunny Posted July 10, 2020 Author Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) https://twitter.com/nlw/status/1281595291444170754?s=20https:/ /twitter.com/nlw/status/1281595291444170754?s=20 Edited July 10, 2020 by Killer Bunny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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