Mse - Property Crash ?

[cybernoid]

I'm not sure if this is irony or if they are just dumb!

Sir sir I know I know !

I feel sorry for them, why aren't they 'getting on with their lives' now that they have… gasp…. a mortgage! What a life well lived that is! A mortgage! Living the dream!! And with nothing better to do than brag on the internet. A person that believes having a debt secured against a home is something worthy of bragging about is a tragic waste of life.

There is so much more. Its terribly sad. The british disease, an obsession with some bricks. You're a long time dead and what would they have done when they breathe their last? Sat in one place for years and felt moderately smug despite others living far more interesting and worthwhile lives than them. The bar is so so low. Wasted lives. Deserved I suppose, when they have that attitude to others.

Plenty on here have lump sums of instantly available cash utterly beyond their means, earn more than they ever will, have travelled more than they ever will, have experienced living in different places including overseas, been involved in all kinds of work, whilst they sit in their tedious semi on some soul destroying cookie cutter housing estate pretending they're so superior. Its rather tragic.

B&Q again this weekend suckers?

Edited April 24, 2014 by cybernoid

[winkie]

At the peak of tulip mania, in March 1637, some single tulip bulbs sold for more than 10 times the annual income of a skilled craftsman.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

[dances with sheeple]

Sir sir I know I know !

I feel sorry for them, why aren't they 'getting on with their lives' now that they have… gasp…. a mortgage! What a life well lived that is! A mortgage! Living the dream!! And with nothing better to do than brag on the internet. A person that believes having a debt secured against a home is something worthy of bragging about is a tragic waste of life.

There is so much more. Its terribly sad. The british disease, an obsession with some bricks. You're a long time dead and what would they have done when they breathe their last? Sat in one place for years and felt moderately smug despite others living far more interesting and worthwhile lives than them. The bar is so so low. Wasted lives. Deserved I suppose, when they have that attitude to others.

Plenty on here have lump sums of instantly available cash utterly beyond their means, earn more than they ever will, have travelled more than they ever will, have experienced living in different places including overseas, been involved in all kinds of work, whilst they sit in their tedious semi on some soul destroying cookie cutter housing estate pretending they're so superior. Its rather tragic.

B&Q again this weekend suckers?

Ouch! So true though, people wear their debt slavery like a badge, no wonder the bankers are just laughing at us.

Edited April 24, 2014 by dances with sheeple

[dances with sheeple]

I've lost all perspective. A similar house but with 1 acre came on market a couple of weeks back at 400K and went STC next day.

But there are stacks that have not moved for a year, some for over 5.

I think we've hit a maximum leverage situation now - property is priced just outside the max most people are able to borrow. As new mortgage products come on market (like 95%s back) more people can buy again, but within weeks the prices have moved above. A situation which doesn't bode well if IR move up faster than wages.

With the new lending criteria prices are falling back a bit to keep to top of buyers maximum gearing.

Still not sure we'll see a crash in next 2 years - can see a lot of ways this can become the norm for a while - but anyone who thinks London will go up another 9% next year is going to need some new mechanism for leverage to make that happen (which could be wages, who knows).

Depends where you are sitting I suppose

[Debbiebegood]

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=4954624

they seem hopefully that there is no crash coming. I do not wish to point out we are in the middle of a crash.

No mention of the London mega bubble/state propaganda driving sentiment or ALL of the lending coming from dodgy government printed money or the that the government borrowing/spending/money printing is unsustainable, or the Americans are tapering, or the potential of war in russia etc etc etc.

It's all good news.

We should buy now before we miss out....

Now, own up, who started that thread ?

It cannot be that ALL the money comes from the Government.

There are endless ques of cash rich pensioners and cash rich foreigners who will endlessly put ever higher bids for madly overpriced derelict UK's rabbit hutches and snap them up.Only then they will fulfill their dream of owning the above hutch or live of comfortably at 3% gross yield from BTL.

In either case, they surely (wisely) invested in the world's safest heaven for investments, namely London.

[londislagerhound]

MSE is just Mumsnet for the barren.

[ursus darling]

Personally, I think credit is the main driver of house prices.

personally think supply and demand is the main driver ..... and can't see supply increasing much and demand decreasing much in the near too distant future

[interestrateripoff]

100000
110000
121000
133100
146410
161051
177156.1
194871.71
214358.881
235794.7691
259374.246

These are the numbers for 10 years growth at 10%, still it's just a gentle increase.

[winkie]

personally think supply and demand is the main driver ..... and can't see supply increasing much and demand decreasing much in the near too distant future

Well take away credit/debt/borrowing/lending and make it so all property is to be purchased with cash savings investments only....see then how fast prices would fall to secure a sale...supply and demand sure but the demand still has to have a way to pay....

[cybernoid]

personally think supply and demand is the main driver ..... and can't see supply increasing much and demand decreasing much in the near too distant future

The money has to come from somewhere. Supply and demand is a mechanism for competitive bidding, but there is a ceiling. Its set by the amount that can be borrowed. When that lending drops theres less money to spend on housing so less can be paid so prices have to drop.

If its all down to supply and demand what happened in the last 10 years to triple prices? Did two thirds of houses fall down? Population change has its affects as do other things but they are small compared to the affects of what can be borrowed.

With that lending tightening, we shall see just how much affect it has had. Have to say, I'm rather relieved to just be watching on from the sidelines with no recent purchase to worry about.

[ursus darling]

The money has to come from somewhere. Supply and demand is a mechanism for competitive bidding, but there is a ceiling. Its set by the amount that can be borrowed. When that lending drops theres less money to spend on housing so less can be paid so prices have to drop.

If its all down to supply and demand what happened in the last 10 years to triple prices? Did two thirds of houses fall down? Population change has its affects as do other things but they are small compared to the affects of what can be borrowed.

With that lending tightening, we shall see just how much affect it has had. Have to say, I'm rather relieved to just be watching on from the sidelines with no recent purchase to worry about.

i've been saying the same for over 10 years and look what has happened to house prices in that time.

until there is a reduction of population or demand for housing the prices will continue to rise. big businesses backed by government will do everything they can to get future generations in debt.

help to buy schemes and ridiculously low interest rates are just the beginning imo

[cybernoid]

i've been saying the same for over 10 years and look what has happened to house prices in that time.

Look what happened to lending in that time. I don't think that invalidates my point?

[zugzwang]

i've been saying the same for over 10 years and look what has happened to house prices in that time.

until there is a reduction of population or demand for housing the prices will continue to rise. big businesses backed by government will do everything they can to get future generations in debt.

help to buy schemes and ridiculously low interest rates are just the beginning im

Look what happened? We had an almighty crash that took prices down by 25% in real terms across the entire country ex London and which Osborne has still not managed to fully reverse despite a plethora of market defying subsidies financed by putting an additional £120bn on the national debt every single year.

Interest repayments are already set to top £80bn/yr by 2017. Realistically Osborne can't do more spending without expanding the QE program to pay for it, but we know from the US and Japan that QE is ultimately self-defeating.

Catch-22.

[Sour Mash]

Well take away credit/debt/borrowing/lending and make it so all property is to be purchased with cash savings investments only....see then how fast prices would fall to secure a sale...supply and demand sure but the demand still has to have a way to pay....

Can't say it would apply nation wide, but I suspect that in the case of London you'd see investors with ready access to funds stepping in to grab an ever larger share of the housing stock. As long as there are lots of people there who can afford to pay large amounts of rent, there will be rentiers to make money out of them.

I'm thinking in London we'll ultimately see a return to the bad old days of the past where actually owning a home was an impossible dream for normal people and there was little choice but to pay large amounts of cash to rent anywhere half decent, or live in a slum if you didn't have the money.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

personally think supply and demand is the main driver ..... and can't see supply increasing much and demand decreasing much in the near too distant future

How come then ferrari's aren't sellling for £100M each ?

Supply demand credit ability to pay desire to pay stupidy common sense.

Life's more complicated than the sheeple think

[VeryMeanReversion]

personally think supply and demand is the main driver ..... and can't see supply increasing much and demand decreasing much in the near too distant future

Demand means willing and able to buy. Credit allows the willing to become able.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

Demand means willing and able to buy. Credit allows the willing to become able.

And credit should be based on ability to pay back....that's where the current system has fallen down. Sub-prime government backed loans + sub-prime government back deposits is not the way to lend to people to buy a simple shelter for themselves all it has done it give people hope of a making a quick buck ( again ) and give the 2nd steppers hope that they can afford the boomers big houses that have been prices at 2007+20% bubble prices for the last 5 years.

Why do you think the free market pre-election home owning tories are doing this ?

Edited April 25, 2014 by TheCountOfNowhere

[VeryMeanReversion]

Credit has to be at a rate people can afford. If they cant afford zero (ie repayment only, no interest), prices aint going higher. Its the rate of credit itself that changes prices.

It is both the rate and availability of credit.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

It is both the rate and availability of credit.

The availability is one thing but people must be able to pay back a loan that is being freely offered. If people lie to take on loans that they can't afford then use some of the loan/equity in the house to keep up payments in the hope they can cash in when prices rise ( forever ) then what you end up with is the 2007 collapse.

When bankers are getting bonuses to sell mortgages and people are allowed to bypass simple checks on their ability to pay it back....the housing market is nothing more than a corrupt debt fuel scam that will ( and has ) collapse at the drop of a hat.

The only people who can think this is a great idea are the rich who are profiting massively from being at the top of the pyramid.

Caveat Emptor.

Edited April 25, 2014 by TheCountOfNowhere

[fluffy666]

And credit should be based on ability to pay back....that's where the current system has fallen down. Sub-prime government backed loans + sub-prime government back deposits is not the way to lend to people to buy a simple shelter for themselves all it has done it give people hope of a making a quick buck ( again ) and give the 2nd steppers hope that they can afford the boomers big houses that have been prices at 2007+20% bubble prices for the last 5 years.

Why do you think the free market home owning tories are doing this ?

Because in the westminister bubble - generally composed of people who have never had a day's worry about money - rising house prices means votes. And quite frankly either party would happily throw the firstborn of every family on a bonfire if they thought it'd get them a majority.. Nuking the economy for the sake of an election that's still 13 months away is mild stuff. Hell, if the Tories ever work out that a nuclear war with Russia would affect city-dwelling Labour voters more than countryside-dwelling tories.. run.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

Because in the westminister bubble - generally composed of people who have never had a day's worry about money - rising house prices means votes. And quite frankly either party would happily throw the firstborn of every family on a bonfire if they thought it'd get them a majority.. Nuking the economy for the sake of an election that's still 13 months away is mild stuff. Hell, if the Tories ever work out that a nuclear war with Russia would affect city-dwelling Labour voters more than countryside-dwelling tories.. run.

That was a joke mate, wasn't expecting a reply. it's like the question asked to Debbie Magee,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debbie_McGee

"McGee was a guest on The Mrs Merton Show when she was famously asked, "So, what first attracted you to the millionaire Paul Daniels?"^[15]"

We all have a good opinion on exactly why they are doing this.

[TheCountOfNowhere]

Because in the westminister bubble - generally composed of people who have never had a day's worry about money - rising house prices means votes. And quite frankly either party would happily throw the firstborn of every family on a bonfire if they thought it'd get them a majority.. Nuking the economy for the sake of an election that's still 13 months away is mild stuff. Hell, if the Tories ever work out that a nuclear war with Russia would affect city-dwelling Labour voters more than countryside-dwelling tories.. run.

" rising house prices means votes"

I'm not sure that's true. I'm voting against the government and labour purely on their stance on house prices, I suspect many others are too.

Edited April 25, 2014 by TheCountOfNowhere

[fluffy666]

" rising house prices means votes"

I'm not sure that's true. I'm voting against the government and labour purely on their stance on house prices, I suspect many others are too.

In the 'Westminister bubble', rising house prices = votes..

Bear in mind the sheer proportion of our politicians who have never had any kind of money worries, who have never worked to pay a mortgage, and who have never worked outside of the University politics/Think tank/PR/SPAD/Party area. No wonder that these people have no problem with a basic 3 bed semi in an average location costing two hundred thousand pounds.

[(Blizzard)]

MSE is just Mumsnet for the barren.

I thought it was more a sort-of support group for people who's main income is money-off vouchers and tesco clubcard points?

Edited April 25, 2014 by (Blizzard)

[Venger]

HPI forever.

Different MSE story. http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5323273

Property = http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-49047097.html

Last sold
£587,000 on 20 Jun 2014
£490,000 on 21 Jul 2010
http://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/detailMatching.html?prop=45130892&sale=51342905&country=england

Help me sell this stunning period property ASAP please!!
Juliejoobs
12-09-2015, 3:23 PM

Default Help me sell this stunning period property ASAP please!!
Hi everyone, my property has been on the market since March 23rd - not that long I know, but I really need it to be sold now. It's going to have two estate agents now, and is on all the usual websites like Rightmove, Zoopla etc. Having to sell due to some very sad circumstances and hoping to start a new life with my little kids asap Ex is threatening to default on mortgage and that would be disastrous.
Any ideas for marketing it??
Please help...
I'm not allowed to post a link to the house as I'm a new user , but it is on Rightmove in SG9 9AG (Buntingford), 1hr and 10min drive from London, beautiful 4 bedroom, three bathroom, Grade II Listed, massive basement, wine cellar, high ceilings and spacious rooms, so much character, very private but close to the high street of a picturesque Market Town with fab shops, boutiques and wonderful community. 20 minutes from Cambridge. Train stations only a short drive. Excellent and saught after schools. It is a real gem and I can't understand why it hasn't been snapped up!! Originally on at £650 000, now reduced to £625 000!!

Thanks for reading and advice much appreciated :-)

Grumpelstiltskin
This one?
Sold in 2014 for much less?

Juliejoobs
Hi, yes that's the one! You are right it did sell for less, but the EA said it was u
nder valued in his opinion and additionally our low offer was accepted as the seller had an offer on it that fell apart and needed a quick sale due to having somewhere else already lined up to buy. So the fact that it sold for less then is a bit misleading.
Thanks

Grumpelstiltskin
Julie You may say it's misleading but it's one of the first things a potential buyer sees. Also a house back on the market after a few months does send alarm bells ringing for some potential buyers. They think why? what is wrong with the house?

marksoton
But in your original post you state you now need it sold as soon as. So really you're in a similar position to the previous vendor.

Juliejoobs
You are right Grumplestiltskin, all very valid points. There is nothing wrong with the house at all. The sad situation is that only two weeks after moving in my husband (now ex) told me of the affair he was having and all the others I was also unaware of during our ten years. I'm not being greedy, just trying to sell this house so to have a deposit on another property (or may have to rent if can't get a mortgage) and start again with my two little uns.