Realistbear Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20...320662,00.html# The Sunday Times August 20, 2006 Public wants much harsher immigration policy, says poll Ipsos MORI interviewed a representative sample of 975 adults aged 18 and over by telephone on behalf of the Sunday Times between 11 and 13 August 2006. Data are weighted to match profile of population..../ The poll covered a range of political issues, including attitudes to the prime minister, support for Gordon Brown, the chancellor, and the extent to which the main party leaders are tainted by “spin”. However, the most striking findings relate to public attitudes to immigration, with the results exposing serious and widespread public concern about current government policy. Many people appear convinced that immigration is bad for Britain , with a significant number calling for borders to be closed completely. The Poll: http://www.times-archive.co.uk/onlinespeci...toplinepoll.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realistbear Posted August 20, 2006 Author Share Posted August 20, 2006 http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,701...1,00.html?f=rss Restrictions Are Needed' Updated: 07:35, Sunday August 20, 2006 The Tories want tighter restrictions on workers from Bulgaria and Romania moving to Britain when they join the EU next year. Immigration spokesman Damian Green said the Government must learn lessons from "unprecedented numbers" who arrived in the UK after the last EU expansion. The move, reported by The Sunday Telegraph, comes amid concerns about the impact of a potential surge of new migrant workers when the two states enter the EU in January. There are claims that British workers have already lost their jobs and wages have been driven down by an influx from Poland, in particular, since 2004. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackholeshine Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 20,000 Romanians sign up to build London's Olynmpics -- they are cheaper to employ. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkshock Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 (edited) http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20...320662,00.html# The Sunday Times August 20, 2006 Public wants much harsher immigration policy, says poll Ipsos MORI interviewed a representative sample of 975 adults aged 18 and over by telephone on behalf of the Sunday Times between 11 and 13 August 2006. Data are weighted to match profile of population..../ The poll covered a range of political issues, including attitudes to the prime minister, support for Gordon Brown, the chancellor, and the extent to which the main party leaders are tainted by “spin”. However, the most striking findings relate to public attitudes to immigration, with the results exposing serious and widespread public concern about current government policy. Many people appear convinced that immigration is bad for Britain , with a significant number calling for borders to be closed completely. The Poll: http://www.times-archive.co.uk/onlinespeci...toplinepoll.pdf I looked at the figures and the split is 50/50 when considering the question "immigration is generally good for britain" - and thats actually a lot more positive than I anticipated. It's also interesting to note that while 77% advocate limits on immigration, more than 60% of respondents have no idea what the limit on numbers of immigrants should be, which is slightly confusing, and probably reflects the uncertainty in respondents minds when answering. There was an almost even spread across the board when asked about the numbers that should be allowed in, suggesting even those who did write a number are unsure of their ground. The picture in terms of the responses given is actually a lot murkier than the headlines make out. Edited August 20, 2006 by Milkshock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingCash Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 20,000 Romanians sign up to build London's Olynmpics -- they are cheaper to employ. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770 Thing is, are they cheaper for the country? It means 20,000 workers in Britain will need benefits, and much of the wages of the immigrants will be sent back to their homeland. Also it means the slumlords will get a further boost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
expatowner Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 20,000 Romanians sign up to build London's Olynmpics -- they are cheaper to employ. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770 If I still lived in the UK I would want much stricter rules on those numbers of immigrants being admitted to the UK. As I live here I dont mind so much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
talby Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 Even Ken Livingstone is against shipping in cheap labour at the expense of local workers when it comes to the Olympics. At the peoples question time in Hackney back a few months (See webcast at http://www.london.gov.uk/webcast/pqt_280206.asx at 1:25 in) he said how he was disgusted at Heathrow Terminal 5 being built by imported Yugoslavian workers at the expense of the local labour force, and how he wanted Olympics construction work to go to "our people" as being an ethical construction policy. Why shouldn't that point of view apply more generally ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DabHand Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 I looked at the figures and the split is 50/50 when considering the question "immigration is generally good for britain" - and thats actually a lot more positive than I anticipated. It's also interesting to note that while 77% advocate limits on immigration, more than 60% of respondents have no idea what the limit on numbers of immigrants should be, which is slightly confusing, and probably reflects the uncertainty in respondents minds when answering. There was an almost even spread across the board when asked about the numbers that should be allowed in, suggesting even those who did write a number are unsure of their ground. The picture in terms of the responses given is actually a lot murkier than the headlines make out. You cant expect the average person in the street to be able to come up with specific figures. e.g. "Do you think a UN force should be sent to lebanon/israel?"...Doesnt follow that a person saying yes can then answer "How many troops would you send? From what countries? How many planes? etc.." Most disingenious of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkshock Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 (edited) You cant expect the average person in the street to be able to come up with specific figures. e.g. "Do you think a UN force should be sent to lebanon/israel?"...Doesnt follow that a person saying yes can then answer "How many troops would you send? From what countries? How many planes? etc.." Most disingenious of you. well the figures in the survey actually show a 50/50 split between those against immigration, and those for it, which is actually pretty tolerant if you think about it, and (at best for the anti-immigration lobby) indicates uncertainty one way or the other in the minds of the public, towards an issue which, if you read the majority of the stuff on the topic here, is made out to be an open and shut case . i dont think the headline accurately reflects the survey at all. thats the point i was trying to make. Edited August 20, 2006 by Milkshock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grime- skint wouldbe ftb Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 well the figures in the survey actually show a 50/50 split between those against immigration, and those for it, which is actually pretty tolerant if you think about it, and (at best for the anti-immigration lobby) indicates uncertainty one way or the other in the minds of the public, towards an issue which, if you read the majority of the stuff on the topic here, is made out to be an open and shut case . i dont think the headline accurately reflects the survey at all. thats the point i was trying to make. What do you think the figure would be if you could somehow undo the decades worth of pro-immigration government propaganda, and brainwashing of the populace into thinking that any sort of dissent is "racism, a thought crime darker than any other possible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkshock Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 (edited) What do you think the figure would be if you could somehow undo the decades worth of pro-immigration government propaganda, and brainwashing of the populace into thinking that any sort of dissent is "racism, a thought crime darker than any other possible? yes well, even if that was true - which it may be for all i know - you cant, can you? you have to be realistic. the survey results are not as clear cut as many on here would like - far from it. Edited August 20, 2006 by Milkshock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realistbear Posted August 20, 2006 Author Share Posted August 20, 2006 Are NuLabour get the message? http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml...08/20/uimmi.xml Darling promises immigration will be 'controlled' (Filed: 20/08/2006) Tories demand limit on migrants from Europe Immigration from Romania and Bulgaria will be "properly controlled" when the two countries join the EU next year, Alistair Darling, the Trade and Industry Secretary, has said. He insisted there would be no open-door policy after the Tories demanded tough restrictions on migrant workers from the accession states. Damian Green, the shadow immigration minister, said the Government had to learn the lesson of the "unprecedented numbers" who arrived in the UK after the last EU expansion in 2004. Mr Darling said the Government had now introduced a points system to match the economy's requirements with migrant labour. He said: "We will need to consider along with other countries, along with other institutions in this country, what our requirements are, so that this is done in a managed way - in a way that is reasonable, in a way that is balanced." If Gordon is going to be deprived of a huge influx of cheap labout to keep HPI and low wages going how is the miracle economy going to perpetuate itself? More borrowing I suppose. The reality is more likely that the "controls" will exist in name only as they will have no idea how many people are coming in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faloos Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 The cannot admit that they have cocked it up !! Like I have said many btimes "why do we have to have immigrants like Somalis who bring ten of a family with them just so the father can work in Mcdonalds !!" The rest will work probably escaping paying tax along with sending most of their cash back to Somalia. Very little of their income will be spent here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkshock Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 The cannot admit that they have cocked it up !! Like I have said many btimes "why do we have to have immigrants like Somalis who bring ten of a family with them just so the father can work in Mcdonalds !!" The rest will work probably escaping paying tax along with sending most of their cash back to Somalia. Very little of their income will be spent here. because he will work in mcdonalds, which most of the indigenous population will not. the sad fact is that the types of immigrant required in the uk are for low-skilled, low-waged jobs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkG Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 (edited) I looked at the figures and the split is 50/50 when considering the question "immigration is generally good for britain" - and thats actually a lot more positive than I anticipated. Why? It's a stupid question: it's perfectly reasonable to believe that 'immigration is generally good for Britain', but also want to see an end to Labour's mass immigration policies. There's a huge difference between allowing controlled immigration of skilled workers and allowing vast numbers of unskilled workers to come here with no effective controls. And that's supported by the fact that 75% of people in the poll want 'much tougher' immigration laws or a complete halt to immigration. the sad fact is that the types of immigrant required in the uk are for low-skilled, low-waged jobs. Crap. The problem is not that 'British people won't do the jobs', it's that the companies won't pay enough for a British person to be better off doing those jobs than living on the dole. Whether you fix that by reducing welfare, paying more or reducing the cost of living is up to you, but importing vast numbers of unskilled workers so that British workers can stay on the dole and companies can increase their profits is an absolutely absurd and short-termist policy. Edited August 20, 2006 by MarkG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sun n sea Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 because he will work in mcdonalds, which most of the indigenous population will not. the sad fact is that the types of immigrant required in the uk are for low-skilled, low-waged jobs. You tried buying a house or renting a BTL on minimum wage? Maybe peole just can't afford to work for minimum wage due to the cost of living in this country. Come to think of it a lot of professional people aren't getting paid enough to afford the cost of living. Are we all lazy b@stards or are we looking for a decent living standard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faloos Posted August 20, 2006 Share Posted August 20, 2006 Why? It's a stupid question: it's perfectly reasonable to believe that 'immigration is generally good for Britain', but also want to see an end to Labour's mass immigration policies. There's a huge difference between allowing controlled immigration of skilled workers and allowing vast numbers of unskilled workers to come here with no effective controls. And that's supported by the fact that 75% of people in the poll want 'much tougher' immigration laws or a complete halt to immigration. Crap. The problem is not that 'British people won't do the jobs', it's that the companies won't pay enough for a British person to be better off doing those jobs than living on the dole. Whether you fix that by reducing welfare, paying more or reducing the cost of living is up to you, but importing vast numbers of unskilled workers so that British workers can stay on the dole and companies can increase their profits is an absolutely absurd and short-termist policy. True MarkG- They should shave some cash off their profits and pay staff a proper wage then we wont have to import some undesirables into the uk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 20,000 Romanians sign up to build London's Olynmpics -- they are cheaper to employ. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770 You see you can say that without it being racist but as soon as you say something like 59% off Muslims men or something don’t have a job it’s deemed racist. Big brother is using immigrants to force wages down and the demand for houses up and all them people being PC are helping them carry out these plans thinking it will make a better world for them, they are wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whitemice Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 I think most people are unsure of whether wanting to stop Britain becoming even more overcrowded is racist or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkshock Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 Why? It's a stupid question: it's perfectly reasonable to believe that 'immigration is generally good for Britain', but also want to see an end to Labour's mass immigration policies. There's a huge difference between allowing controlled immigration of skilled workers and allowing vast numbers of unskilled workers to come here with no effective controls. And that's supported by the fact that 75% of people in the poll want 'much tougher' immigration laws or a complete halt to immigration. Crap. The problem is not that 'British people won't do the jobs', it's that the companies won't pay enough for a British person to be better off doing those jobs than living on the dole. Whether you fix that by reducing welfare, paying more or reducing the cost of living is up to you, but importing vast numbers of unskilled workers so that British workers can stay on the dole and companies can increase their profits is an absolutely absurd and short-termist policy. you cannot expect sandwich shop workers and cleaners to be paid much more than someone drawing benefits - capitalism demands a highly flexible, undemanding and lowly-paid workforce (at the delivery end of the system) due to competition and need for increased profits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzMosiz Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 If a 99% of the population wanted harsher immigration rules it wouldn't make any difference to the government. VOTES COUNT NOT VOICES!! I think most people are unsure of whether wanting to stop Britain becoming even more overcrowded is racist or not. I'm not racist. I just want the door shut and locked whether you're white, black, orange or purple! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cuckoo Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 Once again someone starts an anti immigration diatribe. Immigrants are the life blood of this country and make such a positive contribution. No one likes scroungers but there are plenty of "natives" who are exactly that and an awful lot of immigrants who are very hard working, fuly paid up and loyal citizens. As far as i'm concerned it is a wonderful thing to be able to walk down my street in London and hear a multitude of voices and languages from all over the world, its not true that everyone's just moved here to scrounge and send money home, for all those that do there's ten that come here permanently. They all add positive things to our culture. This mass immigration is not a threat to our way of life - it is a wonderful oppurtunity that is happening in this country. people want to come here rather than anywhere else, and its not because we're a soft touch and suckers, its to better themselves and its making our economy more dynamic and our culture enriched. As far as i'm concerned the doors can be opened to all those Europeans, yes Bulgarians and Romanians and Albanians and Russians and others who wish to take the opportunities this wonderful nation has to offer. And it does work both ways ; a couple of friends of mine moved to Bulgaria a couple of years ago from the UK and have settled are working there and have started a family! Please lets stop this little englander "this immigration madness must stop" type post every single day, for goodness sake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamnumerate Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 (edited) people want to come here rather than anywhere else, and its not because we're a soft touch and suckers, its to better themselves I am sorry but do you really know any immigrants very well ? My wife is an immigrant and she did not come here to scrounge off the UK. However she would admit that there are people like that. I know people who have lived here 9 years and have never paid the same rent as someone migrating from eg Sheffield would. There are lots of good things about immigration however to say there are no negative is to ignore the truth. There are 3 problems :- 1) Some immigrants raise the average IQ of their own country by coming here 2) Terrorism would not happen without Muslim immigration 3) Overcrowding - in the last 6+ years London has got even more overcrowded. And it does work both ways ; a couple of friends of mine moved to Bulgaria a couple of years ago from the UK and have settled are working there and have started a family! Do they get help from the Bulgarian government to pay their rent or get council housing which Bulgarians can't get ? If not then it is not the same both ways !! No one likes scroungers but there are plenty of "natives" who are exactly that and an awful lot of immigrants who are very hard working, fuly paid up and loyal citizens. True but why do we let immigrants who are scroungers in ? Why not only hard working ones who obey the law ? Edited August 21, 2006 by iamnumerate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OzzMosiz Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 This mass immigration is not a threat to our way of life - it is a wonderful oppurtunity that is happening in this country. What effect does it have on me? None that are positive. Immigration means wages are kept down. It is also one of the causes for historically low IRs - not good for my savings. Why can't they make 'wonderful opportunities' in their own countries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
make my day Posted August 21, 2006 Share Posted August 21, 2006 (edited) Once again someone starts an anti immigration diatribe. Immigrants are the life blood of this country and make such a positive contribution. No one likes scroungers but there are plenty of "natives" who are exactly that and an awful lot of immigrants who are very hard working, fuly paid up and loyal citizens. As far as i'm concerned it is a wonderful thing to be able to walk down my street in London and hear a multitude of voices and languages from all over the world, its not true that everyone's just moved here to scrounge and send money home, for all those that do there's ten that come here permanently. They all add positive things to our culture. This mass immigration is not a threat to our way of life - it is a wonderful oppurtunity that is happening in this country. people want to come here rather than anywhere else, and its not because we're a soft touch and suckers, its to better themselves and its making our economy more dynamic and our culture enriched. As far as i'm concerned the doors can be opened to all those Europeans, yes Bulgarians and Romanians and Albanians and Russians and others who wish to take the opportunities this wonderful nation has to offer. And it does work both ways ; a couple of friends of mine moved to Bulgaria a couple of years ago from the UK and have settled are working there and have started a family! Please lets stop this little englander "this immigration madness must stop" type post every single day, for goodness sake. This reads as though it was written in cloud cuckoo land ..........dream on Edited August 21, 2006 by make my day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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