Jobseekers Referred To As "lying Thieving Bastards" By Government Contractor

[winkie]

Whatever anyones opinion on welfare and welfare spending,these people are simply costing millions for no gain at all,only misery.

The job centres imo are not fit for purpose....they do little and know little about finding work, if you are not claiming benefits they are not interested at all, as good as useless, the one time I entered their offices for advise told me the whole story.......the staff don't know enough about the businesses in the local area and who is taking on workers, what real training options there are that can make a difference...all they do is process claims and provide a web site address for people to do it themselves.....they are not interested in helping people to find long-term jobs, they are more incentivised to getting people temporary off of benefits and off their books.

[Injin]

Fortunately, we had Full Employment before Thatcher!

Oh wait...

And by 'full employment', do you mean public sector jobs plus the state supporting non-viable industries (i.e. like Banking?)?

That was indeed the policy. A position best expressed by Tony Benn, who pointed out that there had been no problem finding something for everyone to do during the war, so there was no reason to have people sat round doing nowt during peacetime either.

Capitalism wants to make a machine that provides everything that you could ever want, powered by fresh air. This means ever escalating unemployment (good thing, right?) but our social and other systems, plus a lot of our handed down morality don't know how to cope with it.

[byron78]

Is this the Labour Party meme for 2013 now?

I.e. that the evil, wicked tories are beating the unemployed people down, abusing them and taking away what's left of their dignity?

Pray tell, what did Labour do in all their years in power?

I'm a Tory (without a party I'd vote for currently), but in my opinion you've got this the wrong way round.

It's the Tories using the unemployed as a meme (they're all just feckless/lazy) NOT Labour using them for cheap political gain IMHO.

[erranta]

Everything to distract from the real lying thieving bastards, the banksters!

'Divide and conquer' at work, when will people finally stop falling for it?

Only 1 in 10 are allowed to be passed as disabled by ATOS scammers

(Set Targets whether well or not by faceless, unaccountable scum in head office based on twisted computer algorithyms)

Over the 'target' - the doctors are 're-educated'

(loads resign from the stress or hatred of themselves for the deception on seriously ill people - hypocratic oath etc)

1 in 6 are passed disabled after judicial process that is extended for months and months for maximum hassle - (knowing some will just give up or be forced to by personal circumstances)

Why are the bent scum in UK GOVT allowed to contract these outed frauds?

Atos (a French company) is banned from operating in the USA, and barred from 12 other countries for their scams.

Atos take 10's millions from UK taxpayers a year, the boss paid himself a few million bonus last year.

Oberst I.D.S. and other fascist Govt officials are a disgrace - as they they keep releasing total lies about the disabled

Loads just give up (cos they can't read 'n write propa) many have committed suicide (hushed up by IDS but you can find this if you seek)

These disabled are 'reclassified' in Govt propaganda as though they were scamming the system!

- whilst letting Starbucks type companies pay tax if they feel like it.

[richc]

That was indeed the policy. A position best expressed by Tony Benn, who pointed out that there had been no problem finding something for everyone to do during the war, so there was no reason to have people sat round doing nowt during peacetime either.

Seriously???

What was the national debt in 1939? What was it in 1945?

Of course you can have full employment. For a brief period of time. At the expense of national bankruptcy. Tony Blair and Gordon Brown know all about that.

What exactly does it take for you people to learn?

[Injin]

Seriously???

What was the national debt in 1939? What was it in 1945?

Of course you can have full employment. For a brief period of time. At the expense of national bankruptcy. Tony Blair and Gordon Brown know all about that.

What exactly does it take for you people to learn?

I've no idea why you think I was advocating that position. All I was doing was outlining what was the case as far as government policy towards employment before the late 70's.

I'll refrain from mocking you demonising the unemployed on the one hand while saying full employment is impossible on the other, btw.

[SHERWICK]

The job centres imo are not fit for purpose....they do little and know little about finding work, if you are not claiming benefits they are not interested at all, as good as useless, the one time I entered their offices for advise told me the whole story.......the staff don't know enough about the businesses in the local area and who is taking on workers, what real training options there are that can make a difference...all they do is process claims and provide a web site address for people to do it themselves.....they are not interested in helping people to find long-term jobs, they are more incentivised to getting people temporary off of benefits and off their books.

True.

[SHERWICK]

That was indeed the policy. A position best expressed by Tony Benn, who pointed out that there had been no problem finding something for everyone to do during the war, so there was no reason to have people sat round doing nowt during peacetime either.

Capitalism wants to make a machine that provides everything that you could ever want, powered by fresh air. This means ever escalating unemployment (good thing, right?) but our social and other systems, plus a lot of our handed down morality don't know how to cope with it.

I don't really want to go down the Luddite discussion route (again ), but if Capitalism really only destroyed jobs, then there wouldn't be new industries (with associated new jobs) created out of thin air over the past couple of hundred years.

[richc]

I've no idea why you think I was advocating that position. All I was doing was outlining what was the case as far as government policy towards employment before the late 70's.

I'll refrain from mocking you demonising the unemployed on the one hand while saying full employment is impossible on the other, btw.

I didn't say that full unemployment is impossible (and I didn't say that you beat your wife, either ). Cut unemployment benefits to zero (like Asian economies), and the unemployment rate would fall to close to zero (like Asian economies). Paying people to be unemployed generally results in people being unemployed, but the social consensus in the UK is that that's an acceptable situation.

[Injin]

I don't really want to go down the Luddite discussion route (again ), but if Capitalism really only destroyed jobs, then there wouldn't be new industries (with associated new jobs) created out of thin air over the past couple of hundred years.

The end point of capitalism is a machine that does everything, letting everyone get on cheerfully with being unemployed.

This is a good thing.

[SHERWICK]

I'm a Tory (without a party I'd vote for currently), but in my opinion you've got this the wrong way round.

It's the Tories using the unemployed as a meme (they're all just feckless/lazy) NOT Labour using them for cheap political gain IMHO.

Which tories have said that all unemployed are feckless/lazy/scum of the earth?

[durhamborn]

Is this the Labour Party meme for 2013 now?

I.e. that the evil, wicked tories are beating the unemployed people down, abusing them and taking away what's left of their dignity?

Pray tell, what did Labour do in all their years in power?

My experience of workfare was under a Labour government.Why does the fact i think the government treating people so badly and wasting so much money simply to abuse people make me a Labout voter?

Iv never voted Labour in my life.The fact is this policy,started by Labour,put onto steroids by the Tories is nothing more than state abuse.

I have been on the scheme and i have seen what a waste of money it is.I was on for a day because i signed on after leaving a top 3 employer while i set up my own business.

I have no concerns now about my tax paying peoples £71 a week JSA,i do have a massive concern my tax is going to workfare "providers" simply to abuse people who lose their jobs ,destroy them,and stop them finding work.

I have no doubt some/many people dont want work ,but that doesnt mean i like to see the state abuse people,and pay my tax out to workfare providers who stop people finding work in so many ways.

[erranta]

The end point of capitalism is a machine that does everything, letting everyone get on cheerfully with being unemployed.

This is a good thing.

Why do our overlords get us hooked on TV 'Soaps' (a rendering of animal fats + caustic soda)

Take away our time by forcing husband + wife out to work train delays + massive traffic jams deliberately planned to steal your time off - filled with guilt from neglecting your kids and their 'demands' from advert indoctri-nation at weekends?

It's so you don't do any/have time research!

"Dan 12:10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

Therefore, Christians who assert that knowledge must remain the same, and that no new doctrine can appear in the time of the end, are fooling themselves, thinking something contrary to what the scriptures say, which is that "knowledge shall be increased". This truth is so self evident that even unbelievers see it today, especially with the coming of the internet. Computer search tools that can help us search the Bible and help us search out the various doctrines on the Bible in web sites online are extremely important for increasing knowledge, and these tools for increasing knowldege simply were not widely available before about 1995."

Great stuff

[byron78]

Which tories have said that all unemployed are feckless/lazy/scum of the earth?

IDS has certainly implied it.

Many of the electorate (including yourself) seem genuinely confused and unsympathetic towards the unemployed and statistics would suggest this is (at least in part) the result of government misinformation. It's either a deliberate Tory ploy or just good old fashioned incompetence on their part. I'm guessing most of the folk slating the unemployed haven't had the misfortune to directly experience it.

Which Labour MPs have said the Tories are beating the unemployed down and abusing them btw?

[@contradevian]

I don't really want to go down the Luddite discussion route (again ), but if Capitalism really only destroyed jobs, then there wouldn't be new industries (with associated new jobs) created out of thin air over the past couple of hundred years.

The problem is that capitalism can get along just fine with a huge number of jobless. What are you suggesting people do, commit mass suicide?

Blaming people who are jobless as feckless is clearly a nonsense. In 1939 people didn't just decide to stop being feckless and help in the war effort. Needless to say the 75 who have lost their jobs at David Browns in my town this month haven't suddenly downed tools to become worthless dole scum.

[SHERWICK]

The end point of capitalism is a machine that does everything, letting everyone get on cheerfully with being unemployed.

This is a good thing.

Actually, captialism does require SOME unemployment, due to the wage elasticity of demand for labour, i.e. as we get closer to full employment, the amount is costs for a business to hire an unemployed person rises greatly.

[SHERWICK]

IDS has certainly implied it.

Many of the electorate (including yourself) seem genuinely confused and unsympathetic towards the unemployed and statistics would suggest this is (at least in part) the result of government misinformation. It's either a deliberate Tory ploy or just good old fashioned incompetence on their part. I'm guessing most of the folk slating the unemployed haven't had the misfortune to directly experience it.

Which Labour MPs have said the Tories are beating the unemployed down and abusing them btw?

Where has IDS implied that all unemployed are feckless/lazy/scum of the earth?

Believe me, I've been unemployed for short periods before. I took whatever job I could get (and did have to move, once away from my fiance, as in a different continent, for 10 months).

[erranta]

Speaking to you from over 2000 years ago >

Matthew 26:11 The poor you will always have with you, but you will not always have me.

Mark 14:7 The poor you will always have with you, and you can help them any time you want. But you will not always have me.

John 12:8 You will always have the poor among you, but you will not always have me."

Deuteronomy 15:7 If there is a poor man among your brothers in any of the towns of the land that the LORD your God is giving you, do not be hardhearted or tightfisted toward your poor brother.

Proverbs 31:20 She opens her arms to the poor and extends her hands to the needy.

Ezekiel 18:7 He does not oppress anyone, but returns what he took in pledge for a loan. He does not commit robbery but gives his food to the hungry and provides clothing for the naked.

[doomed]

Why do our overlords get us hooked on TV 'Soaps' (a rendering of animal fats + caustic soda)

Take away our time by forcing husband + wife out to work train delays + massive traffic jams deliberately planned to steal your time off - filled with guilt from neglecting your kids and their 'demands' from advert indoctri-nation at weekends?

It's so you don't do any/have time research!

"Dan 12:10 Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried; but the wicked shall do wickedly: and none of the wicked shall understand; but the wise shall understand.

Therefore, Christians who assert that knowledge must remain the same, and that no new doctrine can appear in the time of the end, are fooling themselves, thinking something contrary to what the scriptures say, which is that "knowledge shall be increased". This truth is so self evident that even unbelievers see it today, especially with the coming of the internet. Computer search tools that can help us search the Bible and help us search out the various doctrines on the Bible in web sites online are extremely important for increasing knowledge, and these tools for increasing knowldege simply were not widely available before about 1995."

Great stuff

Not to derail the thread, but you do realise organised religion was invented to control people. It is all made up!

[SHERWICK]

The problem is that capitalism can get along just fine with a huge number of jobless. What are you suggesting people do, commit mass suicide?

Blaming people who are jobless as feckless is clearly a nonsense. In 1939 people didn't just decide to stop being feckless and help in the war effort. Needless to say the 75 who have lost their jobs at David Browns in my town this month haven't suddenly downed tools to become worthless dole scum.

Which tory, other than some people on HPC, has blamed the jobless as feckless?

Which tory has said that those losing their jobs are worthless dole scum?

Or has even implied either of the above?

I have yet to see any evidence that capitalism can get along 'just fine' with a 'huge number of jobless'.

[erranta]

Where has IDS implied that all unemployed are feckless/lazy/scum of the earth?

Believe me, I've been unemployed for short periods before. I took whatever job I could get (and did have to move, once away from my fiance, as in a different continent, for 10 months).

Tory hatchet man Iain Duncan Smith's weasel-worded letter to boy who said Atos test killed dad

http://www.dailyreco...-duncan-1453863

Wot the evil scum are doing is twisting the Biblical call to help poor/needy RELATIVES IN YOUR LAND (Govts throwing taxpayer Millions at countries who don't want it or are totally corrupt dictatorships) by contracting a load of scum companies which bleed the system of cash to cause taxpayer rage when a rise is shown in payouts

ID Smith is a NET sponger off the state himself - after leaving the army!

(Wolfy) Smith was the character in 1984 Blair/Orwell

Wayland Smithy is his creed

[erranta]

After all, IDS has promised to cut another £10billion off the state's handout bill and it has to be found somewhere. Obviously, the people who take handouts they don't deserve should be the first to take a cut.

So let's start by talking about someone who lives off the state and has little experience of the world of work you and I know.

He is 58 years old and has suckled upon the publicly-funded teat for most of his life.

He's signed on the dole. He's had four children and received child benefit for all of them. He has put them each through private school, too.

His wife hasn't worked since they married, except for 15 months in which he got her a job paid by the taxpayer.

He and his colleagues eat and drink food you subsidise in a palace you pay for, he is driven around in a car you own, and when he is too old to 'work' any more you will pay for him to have a better pension than you, too.

He started out at the age of 21 with six years of taxpayer-funded military service, during which he acted as bag-carrier to a Major-General.

Then in 1981, aged 27, he left the Army and signed on the dole for several months.

He then began a period of ordinary work based upon the skills he had gained at the taxpayer's expense, and worked in sales for arms dealer GEC-Marconi.

He then moved on to a property firm, where he was made redundant after six months, and then sold gun-related magazines for Jane's Information Group.

After 11 years of this all-too brief career he succeeded in once again boarding the publicly-funded gravy train in 1992.

In the intervening 20 years he has been paid by the taxpayer every year more money than most taxpayers earn. He has topped it up, along the way, to more than six figures for a few years here and there by being more pompous than the other pigs.

In 2001 he helped his unemployed wife to have a suckle, arranging for you to pay her £15,000 to be his diary secretary.

These days he is given the grand total of £134,565 a year from the taxpayer.

He lives for free in a £2million Tudor farmhouse on his father-in-law's ancestral estate in Buckinghamshire.

He has three acres of land, a tennis court, swimming pool and some orchards, which is not bad for a life in the pay of the state.

'Who is this scumbag?' you might cry. 'Tell us his name, let the authorities know his address, let's get this guzzler out of the cushy life and show him what life is like for the rest of us,earning £7 an hour with a rise once every eight years and a pension consisting entirely of penny sweets if you're lucky.'

His name is Iain Duncan Smith, and his address is the Palace of Westminster, LondonSW1A 0AA.

It's not the insistence that the welfare bill needs cutting I object to; it's that the scissors have been given to people who really can't be trusted not to stab everyone else in the eye.

http://www.mirror.co...ld-look-1400558

So a dealer in death (guns) Govt sponger and Targets/destroys lives of the poor - what a MAN

He reminds me of the vicious Head Prison Warder of Shawshank - as he's led off sobbing when his life of crime comes to an end.

[Harry Sacks]

The notion of full employment is a folly. It's nothing more than a cultural expectation. There is no evidence to support a policy of full employment.

The benefits paid to "lazy bastards" are spent where? They are spent paying the wages of the employed, who in turn pay their debts to the banks, usually just the interest in practice.

What would happen if we stopped paying the "lazy bastards", ultimately the savings would be leveraged by the banks and lent back to the collective "us" at interest.

"On December 1, 1930, at the start of the Great Depression, W.K. Kellogg replaced the traditional three daily, eight-hour shifts in the Battle Creek, Michigan, cereal plant with four six-hour shifts. From now on, W.K. declared, his Cornflakes and Shredded Wheat would be produced by a company with a conscience, willing to do its share to fight the depression. By adding one entire shift, he reasoned, 30 percent more jobs would be added at the plant – jobs desperately needed by the unemployed in the city.

Kellogg’s six-hour day was an instant success, attracting national media coverage and the attention of Herbert Hoover’s administration. The initiative won strong support from prominent businessmen and labor leaders all over the country, and from community leaders and workers in Battle Creek. Observers throughout the world speculated that Kellogg’s experiment offered a practical way out of the depression, and in light of the fact that hours of labor had been steadily declining for over a century, was almost certainly a foretaste of things to come."

http://www.context.org/iclib/ic37/hunnicut/

[erranta]

The notion of full employment is a folly. It's nothing more than a cultural expectation. There is no evidence to support a policy of full employment.

The benefits paid to "lazy bastards" are spent where? They are spent paying the wages of the employed, who in turn pay their debts to the banks, usually just the interest in practice.

What would happen if we stopped paying the "lazy bastards", ultimately the savings would be leveraged by the banks and lent back to the collective "us" at interest.

"On December 1, 1930, at the start of the Great Depression, W.K. Kellogg replaced the traditional three daily, eight-hour shifts in the Battle Creek, Michigan, cereal plant with four six-hour shifts. From now on, W.K. declared, his Cornflakes and Shredded Wheat would be produced by a company with a conscience, willing to do its share to fight the depression. By adding one entire shift, he reasoned, 30 percent more jobs would be added at the plant – jobs desperately needed by the unemployed in the city.

Kellogg's six-hour day was an instant success, attracting national media coverage and the attention of Herbert Hoover's administration. The initiative won strong support from prominent businessmen and labor leaders all over the country, and from community leaders and workers in Battle Creek. Observers throughout the world speculated that Kellogg's experiment offered a practical way out of the depression, and in light of the fact that hours of labor had been steadily declining for over a century, was almost certainly a foretaste of things to come."

http://www.context.o.../ic37/hunnicut/

Fine - but this is Kellogs propaganda.

The policies of The US admin & Franklin Roosevelt (under consultation/advice from Keynes) during Great Depression made it hundreds of times worse.

Millions of Yanks died and esp. farmers foreclosed on (= population starvation).

Kellogs was one of the huge conglomerates (now one of 'their' Global enterprises) which was a main beneficiary of the lengthened, deeper recession which wiped out most of their main competition.

Loads of other Global company 'names' ROSE to Global dominance after this period

[RufflesTheGuineaPig]

Cost of emptying bins - pennies per householdm but I get to put you down as getting £150 and I can still charge other people the £150 because you won't sort something else out for yourself.

I used to have a certain level of respect for you but comments like this make you look ridiculous.

It's not pennies. It might be pennies per household to fuel the truck each month. It's a lot more when you have to pay the wages and then pay landfill costs. You don't have to be genius to work that out on the back of an envelope. Anyone who can count to 21 without taking his pants off can work it out.