Minos Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Thanks, everyone, for responding.I'm very low in the hierarchy, so my bargaining power is restricted. However I am useful in that my charge-out rate to clients is accordingly very low. I can do the work at a reduced cost, and I'm the only person of my level left in Scotland (the rest having been made redundant). I think my best bet is to eat humble pie and accept the cut. You'll never make it as a lawyer with that attitude. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Bowman Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Thanks, everyone, for responding.I'm very low in the hierarchy, so my bargaining power is restricted. However I am useful in that my charge-out rate to clients is accordingly very low. I can do the work at a reduced cost, and I'm the only person of my level left in Scotland (the rest having been made redundant). I think my best bet is to eat humble pie and accept the cut. My experience of working in Scotland is that they are loyal to their own (nothing wrong with that) how would these clients respond if they felt your sassanach (sorry for spelling) bosses were screwing you over? Surely an opportunity to approach them directly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bogbrush Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 My experience of working in Scotland is that they are loyal to their own (nothing wrong with that) how would these clients respond if they felt your sassanach (sorry for spelling) bosses were screwing you over?Surely an opportunity to approach them directly? Yes, depending on the nature of what you do that's a fair suggestion. Indeed if you can do it that's the way to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crashologist Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 You will probably have to accept your employer's plans. Keep an eye out for other jobs. Best of luck - hope things work out for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timak Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 If you do agree to a salary cut now I think it is only fair that if/when the business does see an improvement in fortunes that you receive a bonus for your loyalty. I once agreed to a lower salary / delayed wages in the bad times for a small company yet when we exceeded our targets got nothing in the way of extra pay. The only thing I had in writing was something that said they would "look into the possibility of giving equity in the company" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minos Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 If you do agree to a salary cut now I think it is only fair that if/when the business does see an improvement in fortunes that you receive a bonus for your loyalty.I once agreed to a lower salary / delayed wages in the bad times for a small company yet when we exceeded our targets got nothing in the way of extra pay. The only thing I had in writing was something that said they would "look into the possibility of giving equity in the company" You can also look forward to a reduced redundancy payment, based on your reduced salary, when you are 'let go'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goat Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 I think the only other point worth mentioning is that you should push for a temporary rather than permanent reduction in salaries, so that in 6 months time you return to your normal salary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neverland Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Thanks, everyone, for responding.I'm very low in the hierarchy, so my bargaining power is restricted. However I am useful in that my charge-out rate to clients is accordingly very low. I can do the work at a reduced cost, and I'm the only person of my level left in Scotland (the rest having been made redundant). I think my best bet is to eat humble pie and accept the cut. Ask for time off in lieu instead of a pay cut If there isnt much going on they may go for that - your bosses have a vested interested in not cutting base pay too widely themselves (or they'll be next) Use the time off to look for a next job - sounds like these guys are either going down the tubes or want to get rid of your department Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abharrisson Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 I'm due to have a group discussion with my bosses about a pay cut that's been proposed, and am looking for some advice on how to (tactfully) approach this.My department is the only one targeted for the pay cut, having been subjected to several redundancy procedures and a previous pay cut in the recent past. Other departments are undergoing redundancy at the moment, but trail in our wake. Pointers/advice would be helpful, as I don't want to give my employers an excuse to give me the chop in the near future! If you really want to stay with the frim then my advice would be as follows: 1/ Don't complain, don't "consider" your options, don't sit there with your arms crossed exuding a negative attitude.... just accept it and move on. You don't have to be happy but being negative or questioning or ansty is liable to move your name up the redundancy list if thats the next step.... no one will keep someone on who causes trouble or makes things more difficult than others. 2/ Show some commitment but recognise that when /if the company recovers there will be no guarantees about when pay will come back to previous levels... you may find that you ahve a 20% cut or whatever and even when things get better all you'll get are inflationary type rises... you'd be better recognising that now.... committment can be shown by for instance asking some more positive general questions not related to your personal circumstances.... eg When do they think the situation may well improve, are there any signs that things will get better quickly etc etc positive company wide questions rather than "when will you repay the money you have taken from us", "is there going to be a guarantee that our pay will go back up again, if so when" .... these questions should all be covered off by either the company or others... if you are going to stick your own hand up be positive and don't ask a question related to your own personal situation. I suspect a lot will have pay cuts put on them and for the most part theres precious little you can do if you want to stay with the firm.... of course pay cuts for politicians, teachers, doctors, council workers, public servants etc are a long way off yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fudge Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Of course when the business was making big profits they shared it out amongst their loyal workers didnt they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbga9pgf Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 I'm due to have a group discussion with my bosses about a pay cut that's been proposed, and am looking for some advice on how to (tactfully) approach this.My department is the only one targeted for the pay cut, having been subjected to several redundancy procedures and a previous pay cut in the recent past. Other departments are undergoing redundancy at the moment, but trail in our wake. Pointers/advice would be helpful, as I don't want to give my employers an excuse to give me the chop in the near future! Sounds as if you work in back office Admin, HR, in which case, you dont deserve your job. Either that, or you are the Health and safety Spod, and guess what, you dont deserve your job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midnight_caller Posted July 20, 2009 Author Share Posted July 20, 2009 If you really want to stay with the frim then my advice would be as follows: Thanks for that. I'm mindful to keep positive and just accept that I'm going to have to swallow the usual corporate shit sandwich. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
midnight_caller Posted July 20, 2009 Author Share Posted July 20, 2009 Sounds as if you work in back office Admin, HR, in which case, you dont deserve your job.Either that, or you are the Health and safety Spod, and guess what, you dont deserve your job. Wrong - I'm a solicitor in a commercial firm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neverland Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 (edited) Thanks for that. I'm mindful to keep positive and just accept that I'm going to have to swallow the usual corporate shit sandwich. If I might suggest that would be a mistake History has a habit of repeating itself and you seemed to expect job cuts from your previous posts? If you suspect more job cuts then its more than likely you are right Therefore its highly important by no later than early September you have started a new job search Why wait to lose your job before looking? You're a lot more employable with a job already than without one Edited July 20, 2009 by Neverland Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uriah Heap Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 When business is down something has to give somewhere, so the trick is to not be seen as a dead weight. I greeted the news that the company I work for has lost a big customer with enthusiasm. At last, I said, I can finally get working on that project which will generate far more business. I don't know if it will work. I suppose I should be trying to come up with a project that will generate far more business in case they remember what I said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim B. Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 If you really want to stay with the frim then my advice would be as follows:1/ Don't complain, don't "consider" your options, don't sit there with your arms crossed exuding a negative attitude.... just accept it and move on. You don't have to be happy but being negative or questioning or ansty is liable to move your name up the redundancy list if thats the next step.... no one will keep someone on who causes trouble or makes things more difficult than others. 2/ Show some commitment but recognise that when /if the company recovers there will be no guarantees about when pay will come back to previous levels... you may find that you ahve a 20% cut or whatever and even when things get better all you'll get are inflationary type rises... you'd be better recognising that now.... committment can be shown by for instance asking some more positive general questions not related to your personal circumstances.... eg When do they think the situation may well improve, are there any signs that things will get better quickly etc etc positive company wide questions rather than "when will you repay the money you have taken from us", "is there going to be a guarantee that our pay will go back up again, if so when" .... these questions should all be covered off by either the company or others... if you are going to stick your own hand up be positive and don't ask a question related to your own personal situation. I suspect a lot will have pay cuts put on them and for the most part theres precious little you can do if you want to stay with the firm.... of course pay cuts for politicians, teachers, doctors, council workers, public servants etc are a long way off yet. And while your at it bend over and let them f*ck you up the **** as well. That advice is not good. You should make it as difficult as possible for them. Who do you think they will sack further down the line? The one they think will go quietly without making a fuss or the one they are terrified will take them to an industrial tribunial. Make sure you record the meeting as well for future reference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest X-QUORK Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 And while your at it bend over and let them f*ck you up the **** as well. My thoughts entirely. I think abharrison is an HR manager, can I claim my £5? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neverland Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 And while your at it bend over and let them f*ck you up the **** as well. That advice is not good. You should make it as difficult as possible for them. Who do you think they will sack further down the line? The one they think will go quietly without making a fuss or the one they are terrified will take them to an industrial tribunial. Make sure you record the meeting as well for future reference. -1 abharrison is talking sense, troublemakers are the first to go in the professions (the poster's a solicitor) There are no unions or appeals there They are probably going to have another go, but why be a sacrificial lamb who gets shot for speaking out :angry: Sit meekly, but plan your escape I've seen both approaches over the years and I know which one works in the real world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trampa501 Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Thanks, everyone, for responding.I'm very low in the hierarchy, so my bargaining power is restricted. However I am useful in that my charge-out rate to clients is accordingly very low. I can do the work at a reduced cost, and I'm the only person of my level left in Scotland (the rest having been made redundant). I think my best bet is to eat humble pie and accept the cut. If you're being charged out to clients I assume they're making a tidy mark-up on your services. You're making the company money, so why are you acting like an unwelcome expense? If the mark-up is currently 60% tell your company you're quite happy with that percentage, and if they reduce the fee to the client you're prepared to reduce accordingly (ie both you and your company take a proportionate reduction). I think you'll find the company doesn't bother reducing the rate (if as you say it's already low). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HXO Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 -1abharrison is talking sense, troublemakers are the first to go in the professions (the poster's a solicitor) There are no unions or appeals there They are probably going to have another go, but why be a sacrificial lamb who gets shot for speaking out :angry: Sit meekly, but plan your escape I've seen both approaches over the years and I know which one works in the real world Oh my, you like emoticons don't you? It's like listening to someone who gesticulates excessively. On the OP's point I suspect somewhere between abharrison and DYIV would work, if you are the only one left in Scotland then you have some bargaining power and not discussing the situation and or opening them up to alternatives, which they may have not considered, is nonsensical. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neverland Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 If you're being charged out to clients I assume they're making a tidy mark-up on your services.You're making the company money, so why are you acting like an unwelcome expense? If the mark-up is currently 60% tell your company you're quite happy with that percentage, and if they reduce the fee to the client you're prepared to reduce accordingly (ie both you and your company take a proportionate reduction). I think you'll find the company doesn't bother reducing the rate (if as you say it's already low). Very clever Exactly the sort of remark to get you noticed as a troublemaker and smarta1se Thereby ensuring you will be top of the list for the chop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bogbrush Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 -1abharrison is talking sense, troublemakers are the first to go in the professions (the poster's a solicitor) There are no unions or appeals there They are probably going to have another go, but why be a sacrificial lamb who gets shot for speaking out :angry: Sit meekly, but plan your escape I've seen both approaches over the years and I know which one works in the real world Yeah, but you'll have struck a blow for the workers of the World, right? That's worth more than money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Wrong - I'm a solicitor in a commercial firm. then eat the shit sandwich and plan you exit strategy, quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cogs Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Sounds as if you work in back office Admin, HR, in which case, you dont deserve your job.Either that, or you are the Health and safety Spod, and guess what, you dont deserve your job. So, what do you do? I'm interested in judging you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest theboltonfury Posted July 20, 2009 Share Posted July 20, 2009 Why not go on strike? I don't think he's French....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.