eric pebble Posted September 5, 2012 Author Share Posted September 5, 2012 (edited) Eric, I presume you know that Jimmy Jams is now fronting up a subprime auto loan arranger ..///.... Would you buy a second-hand car from this man? Yuk. I just CANNOT see how the whole HBOS scandal has not even VAGUELY been addressed!.... Just to remind all of you.....HBOS was "rescued" from TOTAL COLLAPSE by YOU - THE TAX PAYER - to the sum of £37 MILLION!! THIS BANK WAS BUST THANKS TO MASSIVE, MASSIVE FRAUD.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HBOS AND READ THIS ESPECIALLY: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Moore_(banking_manager) Edited September 5, 2012 by eric pebble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 (edited) I just CANNOT see how the whole HBOS scandal has not even VAGUELY been addressed!.... I can't understand why things have played out how they have on this score, either. It was obvious to everyone here that HBOS were destined to be the next Northern Rock - so, it's hard to see how LloydsTsb could not have been aware of the risks of acquiring HBOS - which subsequently (and quickly) saw them forced to take a government bale-out. There are two possibilities, as far as I can tell... either everyone involved in the take-over knew that it was a terrible deal - and that would mean it defrauded shareholders... or no-one realised how bad the situation was at HBOS - where such incredible ineptitude surely precludes these people from effective management of a bank. Or... were there equally big problems at Lloyds - all be it better hidden? It seems, to me, that nothing has happened... almost as if the whole situation has been swept under the rug... Edited September 5, 2012 by A.steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zugzwang Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 There are two possibilities, as far as I can tell... either everyone involved in the take-over knew that it was a terrible deal - and that would mean it defrauded shareholders... or no-one realised how bad the situation was at HBOS - where such incredible ineptitude surely precludes these people from effective management of a bank. Or... were there equally big problems at Lloyds - all be it better hidden? It seems, to me, that nothing has happened... almost as if the whole situation has been swept under the rug... Interesting. That's a strand of inquiry I've never seen considered elsewhere. The default assumption has always been of a shotgun affair to rescue HBoS, not of HBoS being deployed as a beard for Lloyds' greater indiscretions. Coincidentally there's a report tonight suggesting the FSA is accusing Lloyds in particular of using incentive schemes that encourage staff to sell products regardless of the risk to bank or customer. Hmmm... Your final point about it feeling as if nothing has happened. Extraordinary, isn't it? The one example that still gets me is that of AIG. How can 400 people lose a notional $2 trillion and remain 1. at liberty and 2. essentially anonymous to this day?! It beggars belief. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
South Lorne Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 (edited) Yuk. I just CANNOT see how the whole HBOS scandal has not even VAGUELY been addressed!.... Just to remind all of you.....HBOS was "rescued" from TOTAL COLLAPSE by YOU - THE TAX PAYER - to the sum of £37 MILLION!! THIS BANK WAS BUST THANKS TO MASSIVE, MASSIVE FRAUD.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HBOS AND READ THIS ESPECIALLY: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Moore_(banking_manager) ...ahh ...but the other Banker Knight from Clown ...the one of the 'Shred'....he lost his....is this guy still a Knight....a Gordo Clown Knight ..?.... Edited September 5, 2012 by South Lorne Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammo Posted September 5, 2012 Share Posted September 5, 2012 Yuk. I just CANNOT see how the whole HBOS scandal has not even VAGUELY been addressed!.... Just to remind all of you.....HBOS was "rescued" from TOTAL COLLAPSE by YOU - THE TAX PAYER - to the sum of £37 MILLION!! THIS BANK WAS BUST THANKS TO MASSIVE, MASSIVE FRAUD.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HBOS AND READ THIS ESPECIALLY: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Moore_(banking_manager) The Brown Knight Rises Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted September 6, 2012 Author Share Posted September 6, 2012 The Brown Knight Rises Knighted by Gordon Idiot Brown... :angry: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted September 13, 2012 Author Share Posted September 13, 2012 The Brown Knight Rises .....And they've gone for Cummings --- and left the Knight of the Realm get away with it..... Hmmmm... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9539259/FSA-hands-life-ban-to-HBOS-director-Peter-Cummings.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted September 13, 2012 Share Posted September 13, 2012 .....And they've gone for Cummings --- and left the Knight of the Realm get away with it..... Hmmmm... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9539259/FSA-hands-life-ban-to-HBOS-director-Peter-Cummings.html Is he banned from any city job or just full time jobs? Can he do a part time consultancy perhaps? RBS's Johnny Cameron returns to the City at Gleacher Shacklock Johnny Cameron, the banker who oversaw the dramatic rise and fall of Royal Bank of Scotland's (RBS) investment banking arm, is returning to the City in an advisory role at Gleacher Shacklock. By Graham Ruddick, Property and Industry Correspodent5:30AM BST 26 Oct 20101 Mr Cameron will take up the position with the privately-owned investment banking firm just five months after he was banned from a full-time job in banking by the Financial Services Authority (FSA) and accepted a "share of responsibility" in the near-collapse of RBS. As part of that ruling, the regulator told the former RBS executive he could take on "part-time consultancy work" in the sector. The FSA has already cleared his role with Gleacher Shacklock. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/8086670/RBSs-Johnny-Cameron-returns-to-the-City-at-Gleacher-Shacklock.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 (edited) Is he banned from any city job or just full time jobs? Can he do a part time consultancy perhaps? " Telegraph report - 30th October 2012: HBOS whistleblower was 'abused' by top executive: ...responsibility lay with former chief executive Sir James Crosby." I seriously think that Crosby should be stripped of this knighthood - as was done with that RBS guy Fred Goodwin..... :angry: "Questioned on who he would blame for the growth of HBOS’s sales culture that has been blamed in large part for the lender’s collapse in October 2008, Mr Moore said responsibility lay with former chief executive Sir James Crosby." http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9644126/HBOS-whistleblower-was-abused-by-top-executive.html Edited November 2, 2012 by eric pebble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 " Telegraph report - 30th October 2012: HBOS whistleblower was 'abused' by top executive: ...responsibility lay with former chief executive Sir James Crosby." I seriously think that Crosby should be stripped of this knighthood - as was done with that RBS guy Fred Goodwin..... :angry: "Questioned on who he would blame for the growth of HBOS’s sales culture that has been blamed in large part for the lender’s collapse in October 2008, Mr Moore said responsibility lay with former chief executive Sir James Crosby." http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/9644126/HBOS-whistleblower-was-abused-by-top-executive.html Eric have you seen this one before? http://www.ianfraser.org/re-examining-hbos/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Peter Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Eric have you seen this one before? http://www.ianfraser.org/re-examining-hbos/ Quite stunning. Since we're a couple of years on, has anyone been jailed yet? Peter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Quite stunning. Since we're a couple of years on, has anyone been jailed yet? Peter. In the UK bankers and politicians are largely above the law. If they get caught doing something they either just say sorry and/or give some of the money back. A couple of small fish were sent to jail about the MPs expenses scandal with minor sentences that were ended early. This was just to distract attention from some of the main culprits who should be in prison today instead of running the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue Peter Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 In the UK bankers and politicians are largely above the law. If they get caught doing something they either just say sorry and/or give some of the money back. Or just ignore it, apparently: FSA: HBoS would you like us to investigate these allegations of fraud against you? HBoS: No thanks. FSA: Okay. Unbelievable, Peter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 (edited) Or just ignore it, apparently: FSA: HBoS would you like us to investigate these allegations of fraud against you? HBoS: No thanks. FSA: Okay. Unbelievable, Peter. Peter Cummins was the official HBoS scapegoat and was fined £500k http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/sep/12/hbos-banker-peter-cummings-banned-fined-fsa His statement about it For the past three and a half years I have been singled out and subjected to an extraordinary Orwellian process by an organisation that acts as lawmaker, judge, jury, appeal court and executioner ...'"In 2007 and 2008 the banking industry was almost destroyed in a global liquidity crisis that exposed deep structural flaws in the industry and rocked and in some cases brought down so many institutions, including HBOS, where I had worked for almost 36 years. "Many people must bear collective responsibility for what happened, including governments and regulators as well as the boards of the banks themselves. But the fact that I am the only individual from HBOS to face investigation defies comprehension. "For the past three and a half years I have been singled out and subjected to an extraordinary Orwellian process by an organisation that acts as lawmaker, judge, jury, appeal court and executioner. The FSA has never had to prove its case to anyone other than itself, and sits safe in the knowledge that few individuals can afford to take it on. "The decision to single me out for investigation is even more grotesque given that even the FSA has to admit in its notice that other senior people were involved in the critical decisions for which I am taken to task. This is tokenism at its most sinister, and has made it feel throughout like institutional oppression. "The FSA failed even to interview a significant number of HBOS's senior executives and non-executives, including its former group finance directors and the divisional finance director, in its investigation. This alone highlights the fundamental shortcomings in its investigation, which failed for example to address the question of who set the financial targets that the Corporate Division had to meet. "When I was appointed to run the Corporate Division in 2006 I took strenuous efforts to improve risk controls and to embed risk as a core competence with the full co-operation and knowledge of the FSA. I appointed a Chief Risk Officer and carried out a series of structural changes to ensure the Division complied with the Basel II capital adequacy rules. I cannot reconcile the close engagement I had with the FSA then with the criticisms they level against me today, other than with their application of lavish portions of hindsight. "I believe there should be a wholly independent inquiry into the failure of HBOS to identify the full reasons for the failure of the bank. This should not be conducted by the FSA, which has such a clear conflict of interest in the matter given it was responsible for the bank's regulation throughout this period. I reject the notion that work on the substantive Report into the failure of HBOS could only commence at the conclusion of this investigation and find it difficult to understand why a Report of such public significance was delayed in preference to proceedings against one individual said to be involved in it. It is, of course, unrealistic to suggest that action leading to a financial penalty can now be taken against any other individual." http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/sep/12/peter-cummings-statement-fsa-lifetime-ban-hbos He makes a valid point that the FSA should not be involved in any inquiries about the financial crisis because they cannot be impartial. If they decided that too much went wrong, it would be admitting their own regulation failed. I've said on here before that we should have a full independent inquiry and they should be sat in the dock not in the judges box. Edited November 2, 2012 by Democorruptcy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 Eric have you seen this one before? http://www.ianfraser.org/re-examining-hbos/ Well yeah... That guy Ian Fraser deserves a medal --- like a lone voice - he has doggedly pursued this case for a v long time --- It is disgraceful that the proper authorities have not put people in jail years ago. DISGRACEFUL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 13, 2012 Author Share Posted November 13, 2012 (edited) I see that Crosby is getting a £572,000 pension..... along with all the other failed banksters.... It is just beyond belief; well over half a million quid a year -- for what? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2232097/Failed-bank-bosses-hit-100m-pension-jackpot-Cosseted-retirement-directors-led-disaster.html For bringing down the entire UK banking system to near armageddon...... INCREDIBLE. Beyond words. Edited November 13, 2012 by eric pebble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I see that Crosby is getting a £527,000 pension..... along with all the other failed banksters.... It is just beyond belief; over half a million quid -- for what? http://www.dailymail...d-disaster.html For bringing down an entire UK bank...... INCREDIBLE. Beyond words. shut up Eric, he is clearly ENTITLED to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 13, 2012 Author Share Posted November 13, 2012 shut up Eric, he is clearly ENTITLED to it. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 15, 2012 Author Share Posted November 15, 2012 noop noop Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 ESSENTIAL that your children watch this. ESSENTIAL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloo Loo Posted November 17, 2012 Share Posted November 17, 2012 Hi Eric. I was just reading your sig and i thought i would tell you about something i remember. Back in 1997 when i was buying my first flat, i handed the mortgage application to the hr women at my workplace, i remember her saying "i will add a bit on your salary to make it look good". She was in her late forties ish. So how long has this been going on? I wonder if she had been doing the same in the 80s boom, maybe on her own salary. Just how long has this been going on? To add tho, i doubt she inflated my salary by 5x and im afraid i cant remember the amounts. Bob my boss did this too...he asked me what to write. we were looking for a tiny mortgage compared to today so we wanted to end up with 4 times mine...he agreed. Lucky for me, with commission, I made it. Later, in 1988 when we moved on, I was able to pick my value with a self cert. That wasnt the killer for me...It was when the bank pulled the rug on the MEW part ( which made up some deposit), and insisted we added the "business Loan" to the mortgage. As soon as they got the security, they pulled it.....THEN I was in big trouble....what I should have done, and would have done today, was told them to shove it....I would then have had a chance tosurvive GC1....saying that, the weekly £20 letters to remind me I owed them wouldhave added even more to the stress. Today, If a bank started that trick, Id just let it ride.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 17, 2012 Author Share Posted November 17, 2012 (edited) Hi Eric. I was just reading your sig and i thought i would tell you about something i remember. Back in 1997 when i was buying my first flat, i handed the mortgage application to the hr women at my workplace, i remember her saying "i will add a bit on your salary to make it look good". She was in her late forties ish. So how long has this been going on? I wonder if she had been doing the same in the 80s boom, maybe on her own salary. Just how long has this been going on? To add tho, i doubt she inflated my salary by 5x and im afraid i cant remember the amounts. Bob Thanks Bob. Basically -- you are not alone. FAR from it, in fact. The sad truth is that the whole LIAR LOAN thing was [& I reckon still is] ENDEMIC. It is EVERYWHERE. It is completely THE NORM -- PAR for the course......... There is simply no other way 99% of ordinary people could otherwise "afford" property. The trouble is, of course, ...like ANY Ponzi scam..... When the music stops....... It's time to smell the coffee..... What we are now left with is -- a false market -- in which the "price" is completely skewed upwards from what it should be - i.e. from wages/income - from what is AFFORDABLE -- and SUSTAINABLE for the market to actually operate PROPERLY - and TRUTHFULLY.... Edited November 18, 2012 by eric pebble Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted December 2, 2012 Author Share Posted December 2, 2012 EXCELLENT. Crosby should FINALLY be put under fierce cross-examination -- and MUST be asked about LIAR LOANS - which became endemic - and MASSIVELY DESTRUCTIVE - under his watch..... Read all about him & his role in the Financial Catastrophe we are now experiencing below.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 Thanks Bob. Basically -- you are not alone. FAR from it, in fact. The sad truth is that the whole LIAR LOAN thing was [& I reckon still is] ENDEMIC. It is EVERYWHERE. It is completely THE NORM -- PAR for the course......... There is simply no other way 99% of ordinary people could otherwise "afford" property. The trouble is, of course, ...like ANY Ponzi scam..... When the music stops....... It's time to smell the coffee..... What we are now left with is -- a false market -- in which the "price" is completely skewed upwards from what it should be - i.e. from wages/income - from what is AFFORDABLE -- and SUSTAINABLE for the market to actually operate PROPERLY - and TRUTHFULLY.... How long will sellers continue to cling to the silly price illusion? Are many now realising what happened to pump up prices? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecrashingisles Posted December 2, 2012 Share Posted December 2, 2012 How long will sellers continue to cling to the silly price illusion? Are many now realising what happened to pump up prices? Unfortunately many are now realising what is still being done to pump up prices and are buying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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