Uk Labour Fears As Migrants Go Home

[cockrobin]

so your answer is to allow capitalism, let the situation get to where the rich corrupt the system to take control then have a revolution? ad infinitum

Doesn't sound like a good governance system to me.

The present Government is a shambles, you can see this every day as the Labour Party display their incompetents over and over again, legislating their way into oblivion. The fact that the cost of living and the average wage grows further and further apart is proof of a deteriorating economy, and you cannot just blame the credit crunch for everything that’s going wrong at the moment.

There has only been one Government in this country that has left the economy in a better state than when they found it, and it wasn't because they were any good, it was because the Labour Party of the 70's had almost completely destroyed the economy and things could not get any worse, and now history is repeating itself.

[cockrobin]

TW@t!

I bet you'd love it if you worked hard for years to become a manager of a business only to find out that any old joe could earn the same as you picking strawberries.

[Wuluf]

Migration has brought 'zero' economic benefit

"Our overall conclusion is that the economic benefits of net immigration to the resident population are small and close to zero in the long run," the report will say.

wrong again labour!

That is not true... Even with a zero increase in the GDP p/p an increase in population increases the overall size of the economy which in turn gives the country proportionally greater economic power globally. Compare the GDP/GDP p/p of China, USA and India (for example) with countries like Switzerland, Ireland and Denmark.

Correctly managed the boon gained by an increase in the size of the economy can be leveraged to offset disadvantages associated with infrastructure and resources. The quality of management practice in the UK trails that found in its competitors. See T5 for another classic example of this.

[edi]

That just it, too many people see this problem back to front.

Wages for menial jobs are NOT too low, property is TOO EXPENSIVE and this imapcts on all aspects of the cost of living eg. shops charge higher prices to pay their commercial rents, higher taxes to pay more to teachers, doctors etc.

Somthing has to give, and it aint going to be wages

Not read the rest of this thread (as I'm going to bed ) but this is EXACTLY what I think. I work as a software developer and I honestly don't think anyone in a similar role at my company gets paid enough but I'm totally basing this on the fact that we are young and wanting to be able to afford to rent or buy a smallish place (but in a reasonably nice area), afford to run a reasonably modern car and have a bit of a social life - this to me doesn't sound too much to ask for people that have spent 3 years studying and in most cases also have industry experience.

If property and rents were cheaper then the rest of the money would spread to the other things so much more easily and the wages would seem so much fairer.

Such massive HPI seems to have totally messed up the ecomomy in this country, wages can't keep up with the increase in house prices or people that owned a house already would be stupidly rich, but the massive cost of property just screwes up chances for anyone that doesn't have one.

The main worry I have is that property will never come down enough to address this...

[laurejon]

Immigration has caused hard working British Families to lose their jobs, and their homes.

Immigration should be capped, according to a parliamentary report published today which concludes that record numbers of new immigrants have had “little or no impact” on economic well being.

Some groups, including the low-paid, young people seeking jobs and some ethnic minorities, may have suffered because of competition for work from immigrants willing to accept low wages and poor working conditions.

Today’s report, from the Lords Economic Affairs Committee, whose members include two former Conservative Chancellors of the Exchequer, seeks to undermine the Government’s claim that record levels of immigration have boosted the economy.

It also sets out to demolish a range of arguments in favour of immigration, including the one that foreigners are needed to prevent labour shortages and also to help to support an increasingly ageing population.

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The report endorses the Conservative policy of capping immigration by urging ministers to set an “explicit target range” for numbers entering the country. Controversially, it also raises the prospect of cutting the number of partners and other family members allowed to settle in Britain because a relative is already here.

And it suggests that, if the predicted 190,000-a-year net migration rate continues, house prices would be 10 per cent higher in 2028 than they would have been if there was zero net immigration.

Lord Wakeham, the former Conservative Cabinet minister who chaired the Lords inquiry, said: “The argument put forward by the Government that large-scale net immigration brings significant economic benefits for the UK is unconvincing. We have found no evidence to support their position.”

The Government has said that immigrants are boosting the overall economy by £6 billion a year, but the committee said that this was a misleading measure and a better one would be the impact on income per head of the resident population. “On this measure, immigration has had a largely neutral effect on economic wellbeing, with the income of some groups of low-paid workers actually falling,” it said.

It added that the available evidence suggested immigration had had a small negative impact on the lowest-paid workers and a small positive impact on the earnings of hgher-paid workers. “Resident workers whose wages have been adversely affected by immigrations are likely to include a significant proportion of previous immigrants and workers from ethnic minority groups,” the report added.

Lord Layard, an economist and Labour member of the committee, gave warning that Britain would face significant pressure from immigration for years. “We will have a permanent pressure of people to move in our direction. Britain has an extra resource, the English language, for attracting people here. There is no doubt whatever that the pressure will remain for half a century or more,” he said.

The findings of the 82-page report were seized on by the Conservatives and Migrationwatch, the organisation that campaigns against mass immigration. David Davis, the Shadow Home Secretary, said: “This cross-party committee of distinguished peers has demolished the Government’s case on several fronts. They show unequivocally that the benefits of the current immigration policy to ordinary UK citizens are largely non-existent.”

Sir Andrew Green, chairman of Migrationwatch, said that the report was a watershed. “A heavyweight committee of Parliament has torn to shreds the Government’s economic case for the massive levels of immigration which they have actively encouraged.

“Having lost their smokescreen of dodgy economic arguments, they now have no alternative but to implement a sharp reduction in numbers. The public will accept nothing less.”

But Neil Carberry, head of employment at the CBI, said: “In the global economy, businesses need a flexible immigration system that allows them to source the skills they need when appropriate UK-born staff cannot be found.”

He said that businesses were daily filling jobs which, without migration, would have been left empty.

Liam Byrne, the Immigration Minister, welcomed the report and insisted it proved that the Government was right to ask the independent Migration Advisory Committee to tell ministers which workers the new Australian-style points system should keep out or let in. He added: “What’s more, our plan for earned citizenship will mean that only those who can speak English, pay taxes and obey Parliament’s law will be able to earn the right to stay.”

The Lords committee comprised five Labour and five Conservative peers, including Lord Lamont of Lerwick and Lord Lawson of Blaby, both former Tory Chancellors, two Liberal Democrats and four crossbenchers.

[dredwerker]

I just wanted to point out again that most people I know in the government sector get paid b*gger all. Even the people who do get paid well - have lots of responsibilities. There is a lot of dead wood but to be honest they have to be somewhere. Local government is a lot like 'yes minister' and so it is hard to get anything done and it suits a certain type of person.

I just checked www.jobsgopublic.com for anything with environment in it and this is what I came up with for jobs over £50k - not a lot and it even includes lawyers who could get paid much more.

Your job search results

Showing 1 to 14 of 14 vacancies for 'environment' Ref Title Salary Employer Closing Date Posted

£60,660 to £75,114 + benefits Head of Health Intelligence £60,660 to £75,114 + benefits In Association with Hays 26/04/2008 (24 days) 4 days ago

LGA Local Government Adviser Secondment opportunity unti... Electoral Commission, The 11/04/2008 (10 days) 4 days ago

n/a Headteacher ISR L23-L29: £62,805 - £72,306 Harrow Council 14/04/2008 (13 days) 5 days ago

EDC0966 ICT Manager £43,750 - £50,485 pa Reading Borough Council 04/04/2008 (2 days) 13 days ago

ACS/AW/2542 Registration Manager MG6 £33,830 - £50,744 p.a. London Borough of Bromley 08/04/2008 (6 days) 14 days ago

LG-SL1507 Senior Lawyer - Planning £48,780 - £54,315 Harrow Council 11/04/2008 (9 days) 15 days ago

LG-SL1507 Senior Lawyer - Property £48,780 - £54,315 Harrow Council 11/04/2008 (9 days) 15 days ago

ADV332971JG8 Budget Allocations Manager Flexible starting salary fr... In Association with Hays 03/04/2008 (1 day) 19 days ago

ADV333054JG25 Senior Finance Business Partner £44,980 - £ 61,100 In Association with Hays 10/04/2008 (8 days) 19 days ago

ADV333054JG26 Senior Finance Business Partner £44,980 - £ 61,100 In Association with Hays 10/04/2008 (8 days) 19 days ago

ADV333054JG27 Senior Finance Business Partner £44,980 - £ 61,100 In Association with Hays 10/04/2008 (8 days) 19 days ago

045103/ZW/5756 SPPS Lead Manager £51,228 - £61,200 Surrey County Council 05/04/2008 (3 days) 19 days ago

N/A Jobs and Career Opportunities West Sussex County Council 01/07/2009 (about 1 year) 9 months ago

ED/Q090 ED/Q092 Playworker/Enablers Qualified: £9.38 per hour (... Royal Borough of Windsor and Maidenhead 01/04/2008 (about 8 hours) 9 months ago

Also if its that easy and pays so well you could always join them. Those who can - work - those who can't consult

[Mr Yogi]

No sane British person would work in a field of mud, breaking their back for £5 an hour.

They would if there was no alternative.

Anyway, I've got a day off today so I'm off down the allotment in the rain, breaking my back for fun!

[Nicolaj]

It's all very well that brown wants cheaper labour.

but he fails to realise that our infrasturture cannot cope anymore its bursting at the seams in some parts of Britian already.

I know Birmingham is.

hospitals

gps

schools

policing

prisions

courts

when will he feel fit to deal with this?

never

[stuckmojo]

Gordon Brown was a genius in his own right. Put the chavs on benefit and blackmail their vote, "no vote, no cider", and get non-voting, hard working poles to do the dirty work for 1p an hour and pretend that there's no inflation.

Add the huge HPI pyramid scam, more tax, and more unnecessary regulation to create more voting non-jobs and you got the recipe for the Miracle.

Time's up though

[Rain'ard]

They would if there was no alternative.

Anyway, I've got a day off today so I'm off down the allotment in the rain, breaking my back for fun!

Only a few though, because all the beakbreaking £5 an hour jobs would be taken, so the rest will have to go on jobseekers

[chichi]

but he fails to realise that our infrasturture cannot cope anymore its bursting at the seams in some parts of Britian already.

Indeed you can't add 1000 houses/flats to an area without increasing facilities. Many of the new estates being thrown up are being built on the last bits of open space.

You need an extra GP per 1000 houses I think - extra dentist etc

Noticed the state of the roads recently? They're at breaking point in terms of congestion and physically.

[Mr Yogi]

Only a few though, because all the beakbreaking £5 an hour jobs would be taken, so the rest will have to go on jobseekers

So remove the jobseekers allowance.

The only reason to be unemployed today is if you're a lazy tw@t.

Unfortunately, this may change as a recession hits.

On the plus side, if house prices fall far enough £5.00 an hour may become a living wage!

Edited April 1, 2008 by Mr Yogi

[Rain'ard]

So remove the jobseekers allowance.

The only reason to be unemployed today is if you're a lazy tw@t.

Unfortunately, this may change as a recession hits.

On the plus side, if house prices fall far enough £5.00 an hour may become a living wage!

Not necessarily. When I was a caretaker a few years ago I met contractors who were mostly self employed and hard working, such as, plasterers, decorators, electricians etc. When we discussed my wages, (For some reason probably me raising the issue of house prices) they used to say. “I wouldn’t get out of bed for that” and I would believe them. I think they would rather die than have to be paid peanuts by somebody else.

Your plus side point I agree entirely, I posted the same thing on this thread earlier

[Injin]

Not necessarily. When I was a caretaker a few years ago I met contractors who were mostly self employed and hard working, such as, plasterers, decorators, electricians etc. When we discussed my wages, (For some reason probably me raising the issue of house prices) they used to say. “I wouldn’t get out of bed for that” and I would believe them. I think they would rather die than have to be paid peanuts by somebody else.

Your plus side point I agree entirely, I posted the same thing on this thread earlier

If you asked them now, you would get Cyrillic answers in return.

[Nicolaj]

Indeed you can't add 1000 houses/flats to an area without increasing facilities. Many of the new estates being thrown up are being built on the last bits of open space.

You need an extra GP per 1000 houses I think - extra dentist etc

Noticed the state of the roads recently? They're at breaking point in terms of congestion and physically.

Exactly whats happened by me..aprox 1800 new homes built by persimmon..yet no new schools.. ..

yes the road ..and how many of these drivers are actually insured? How many have a licence?

Schools are chocka-block around my area Birmingham, when my eldest son was at primary in yr 3 which was 5 years ago, his school had 37 different languages going on...the school even made it in The Sun... and still they had same amount of teachers..and the situation is still the same. I desprately want to change my younger sons school...2yr waiting list..if Im lucky.

My local GP two weeks for an appointment, otherwise you have to call in daily and hope they can fit you in.

The situation is only getting worse all around this country.

we can see it...why is the goverment turning a blind eye?...

[piece of paper]

The present Government is a shambles, you can see this every day as the Labour Party display their incompetents over and over again, legislating their way into oblivion. The fact that the cost of living and the average wage grows further and further apart is proof of a deteriorating economy, and you cannot just blame the credit crunch for everything that’s going wrong at the moment.

There has only been one Government in this country that has left the economy in a better state than when they found it, and it wasn't because they were any good, it was because the Labour Party of the 70's had almost completely destroyed the economy and things could not get any worse, and now history is repeating itself.

Maybe BBC Parliament wasn't such a good idea.

p-o-p