Cars, Earnings And Status

[Bob Loblaw]

So that's £1,900 a year car ownership cost. My Fiesta cost me £2,300 to buy outright in August 2007. Assuming I write it off tomorrow and get zero for it, it has cost me £460 a year to own thus far. If I'd had a Golf at thse figures, it would have cost me £9,500 to own over five years, meaning that I've made a net saving of £2,300. Of course those figures don't include fuel, maintenance and insurance. I would guess that the Golf would cost slightly less on fuel, about the same on maintenance and a bit more to insure, but even so, the price you pay for snob value alone on owning cars from new to 3-5 years is thousands a year.

I wasn't arguing the financial case for a Golf, just pointing out to the OP that you can drive a relatively smart car for a relatively small layout.

Then again there is something nice about a new car. Top Gear always springs to mind when they did the scientific analysis of the interior of used cars. They found all manner of bodily excretions including urine, mucus, faeces and sperm.

[longtomsilver]

Before I moved abroad I always used to drive company cars. Even with unlimited personal and business fuel included the last car I had (a Saab 93) only cost me around 150 a month in tax. Bargain. Hard to argue against the case for not accepting a company car.

^^^ this

My wife pays ~£150 a month for a fully maintained, insured and fuel'd 2litre Golf TDi that's nearly 4 years old with 100,000 miles on the clock. Fuel alone would have cost us nearly double this.

[dangermaus]

Then again there is something nice about a new car. Top Gear always springs to mind when they did the scientific analysis of the interior of used cars. They found all manner of bodily excretions including urine, mucus, faeces and sperm.

so the choice is between poop, piss and jizz in an old car and carcinogenic off-gassing in a new car

http://www.presstv.ir/detail/227053.html

hmmm

[Guest TheBlueCat]

I know this is exactly not what the OP asked, but there's a perverse satisfaction to had from telling people you don't have one at all. And I say that as a real petrol head. These days I use zipcar on the odd occasion that I need a car, otherwise I cycle, use public transport or get a taxi. I do however have a bike which cost more than my first car did even allowing for inflation.

[libspero]

small diesel car, 1.4l fiesta?

I think it was £54 a month I paid for it

Ahh.. that makes more sense. Perhaps I was taking you too literally

[Cosmic Apple]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

For the record I have no intention of reacting to this in any way except this thread. While I like cars, I also look at the costs closely and what else I could do with that money every time I think of changing the car.

My current motor is on a 55 plate, and today was filled full of laylandai.. I always remind my self I wouldn't want to do that in a newer car either

I think the only thing that would make me change in the next few years is the desire for an estate car so I can pack more of my garden in it at once!

Just wanted an insight into the mentality of those who drive expensive cars and swap them every few years.

Very interesting reading some of your guys views on the whole car subject... I think if I didn't have to do long trips for work I would go the banger route.

[dangermaus]

Ahh.. that makes more sense. Perhaps I was taking you too literally

Ah I get ya, i thought that was self explanatory but I probably should have said that was monthly.

[MrB]

Interesting thread, seemingly polarised views with hardly any shades of light and dark.

Recently replaced my knackered 13 yr old Focus with a 2.5 yr old Audi A4 2.0 tdi. Cost 15k, plan to own for 6 years, expect 2k p/a depreciation.

Alternative for me would have been a 5 yr old ford mondeo type for 4-5 k.

The 'premium' in terms of opportunity cost is probably about £110 a month over the alternative, and I'm happy to pay it as the Audi is an awesome car!

Not really bought it to make a statement or anything like that - it's just great having a quality newish car that's pretty good value imo!

[chris25]

In response to the chap who started this thread, I personally wouldn't worry about it.

From my perspective, scraping together adequate savings to buy a decent home, to make sure my depedents are provided for and secure, and to see me through my dotage, is task enough. Additionally spending obscene amounts on buying what will ultimately become a useless lump of rusty metal and decaying plastic, so as to advertise a perceived social status just seems bizarre.

I used to think the same. Now I think the complete opposite.

Buying a (liveable) house is pretty much an impossible task for me.

Most people (like me) are stuck in boring, shitty jobs and owning a nice car is the only thing they can aspire to.

[19 year mortgage 8itch]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

For the record I have no intention of reacting to this in any way except this thread. While I like cars, I also look at the costs closely and what else I could do with that money every time I think of changing the car.

My current motor is on a 55 plate, and today was filled full of laylandai.. I always remind my self I wouldn't want to do that in a newer car either

I think the only thing that would make me change in the next few years is the desire for an estate car so I can pack more of my garden in it at once!

Just wanted an insight into the mentality of those who drive expensive cars and swap them every few years.

Very interesting reading some of your guys views on the whole car subject... I think if I didn't have to do long trips for work I would go the banger route.

I think you should join a car forum to see how they think.

I like to think I can appreciate the metal and know whether the driver is a **** or not.

[Habeas Domus]

my company car cost £60 in tax. what's to understand about that? short of the £500 banger i have now it's probably the cheapest way to drive going.

Not quite sure how you managed that.

The only way I can see you could get a nearly tax free company car is by off-setting the same amount into a pension scheme with the plan of retiring to a country with very low income tax..

I think that proves my point, your employer might send you a letter detailing the car costs, but that won't include the changes to your tax code which is where they really hit you.

[InlikeFlynn]

The really rich have theirs made for them by a tailor who doesn't even need to advertise.

My tailor makes rubbish cars, although the seats are beautifully uphostered and fit well.

I can't get excited about flash cars. I was brought up in a family in which they were seen as a rather naff way of showing off. Later I lived for a long time in one of the poorer rural areas of the UK and my habit for driving very old cars fitted in well.

[Rave]

Recently replaced my knackered 13 yr old Focus with a 2.5 yr old Audi A4 2.0 tdi. Cost 15k, plan to own for 6 years, expect 2k p/a depreciation.

Alternative for me would have been a 5 yr old ford mondeo type for 4-5 k.

The 'premium' in terms of opportunity cost is probably about £110 a month over the alternative, and I'm happy to pay it as the Audi is an awesome car!

The Mondeo is the better car. Uglier, but better to drive.

[LaceUp]

Thanks for all the replies guys.

For the record I have no intention of reacting to this in any way except this thread. While I like cars, I also look at the costs closely and what else I could do with that money every time I think of changing the car.

My current motor is on a 55 plate, and today was filled full of laylandai.. I always remind my self I wouldn't want to do that in a newer car either

I think the only thing that would make me change in the next few years is the desire for an estate car so I can pack more of my garden in it at once!

Just wanted an insight into the mentality of those who drive expensive cars and swap them every few years.

Very interesting reading some of your guys views on the whole car subject... I think if I didn't have to do long trips for work I would go the banger route.

Thanks for the post and all the subsequent posts. I'm thinking of changing my current car 2003 X-Trail which I have owned for 7 years. I hate 'wasting' money on cars, but I do like like a bit of luxury and a few toys and a auto box. I'm now looking to buy a fully loaded estate or 4x4 for about £10k and I'll keep that for a similar time I guess.

[Austin Allegro]

Top Gear always springs to mind when they did the scientific analysis of the interior of used cars. They found all manner of bodily excretions including urine, mucus, faeces and sperm.

Wasn't that just the ones that Clarkson had been sitting in?

[jamesbond33]

Having a new car - well its going to sit in your work car park 8 or 9 hours a day, as you need to pay for it, probably only be driven a few hours at the weekend - then your worried about the slightest scrape or bit of damage, someone banging a door against it, or any slight rattle that their is something wrong with it, taking it to the garage worried about invalidating a warranty, your not going to fix yourself

Actually many people with quite new cars, actually rent a car for long drives because they don't want run up too many miles and lower the value, or drive a second older car - then 3 yrs later the car has lot 50 per cent of its value - if you just enjoy driving new cars then good for you.

Personally If i have 20K sitting in the bank with nothing to do, I'd maybe buy another buy to let, or invest, or go travelling somewhere interesting - at least you might get your money back eventually, or experience something new.

I am much more impressed by people who make their money grow into more money.

[ScrewsNutsandBolts]

SNIP

I am much more impressed by people who make their money grow into more money.

But the only way you could know that someone is making their money work is if they tell you about it.

Generally speaking... people who do that are nobs and don't impress me a jot.

[Gigantic Purple Slug]

Having a new car - well its going to sit in your work car park 8 or 9 hours a day, as you need to pay for it, probably only be driven a few hours at the weekend - then your worried about the slightest scrape or bit of damage, someone banging a door against it, or any slight rattle that their is something wrong with it, taking it to the garage worried about invalidating a warranty, your not going to fix yourself

Actually many people with quite new cars, actually rent a car for long drives because they don't want run up too many miles and lower the value, or drive a second older car - then 3 yrs later the car has lot 50 per cent of its value - if you just enjoy driving new cars then good for you.

Personally If i have 20K sitting in the bank with nothing to do, I'd maybe buy another buy to let, or invest, or go travelling somewhere interesting - at least you might get your money back eventually, or experience something new.

I am much more impressed by people who make their money grow into more money.

So they can spend it on what, exactly ?

[19 year mortgage 8itch]

Having a new car - well its going to sit in your work car park 8 or 9 hours a day, as you need to pay for it, probably only be driven a few hours at the weekend - then your worried about the slightest scrape or bit of damage, someone banging a door against it, or any slight rattle that their is something wrong with it, taking it to the garage worried about invalidating a warranty, your not going to fix yourself

Actually many people with quite new cars, actually rent a car for long drives because they don't want run up too many miles and lower the value, or drive a second older car - then 3 yrs later the car has lot 50 per cent of its value - if you just enjoy driving new cars then good for you.

Personally If i have 20K sitting in the bank with nothing to do, I'd maybe buy another buy to let, or invest, or go travelling somewhere interesting - at least you might get your money back eventually, or experience something new.

I am much more impressed by people who make their money grow into more money.

Late night trolling?

Do you have nothing better to do?

apprentice royalties dried up? No more nightclub appearances in Slough? Giving motivational speeches to an empty room?

[OnionTerror]

I find all the lower-middle-class snobbery about cars hilarious. People showing off about owning flashy mass produced tin heaps from Ford that they've bought on tick. If money was really no object and I cared about cars, I'd drive something like a hand made Bristol or a Jensen Interceptor. Playing Top Trumps over mass market cars is like arguing whether your suit from Burton's is better than your suit from Marks and Spencers. The really rich have theirs made for them by a tailor who doesn't even need to advertise.

I like my cars too much, but I'd only spend semi serious amount of money on something a little more unusual (I have an Alfa at the mo)...certainly wouldnt even consider spending 30 or 40k on an Audi or Beemer, unless it was a company car...

[rxe]

The whole car thing is messed about by leasing. If you can lay your hands on £2K a month, you can easily stick a Porsche on your drive. You don't need to find 60K or whatever they cost, but you will end up paying a tidy chunk of that over 3 years. So the whole "he drives a Porsche, he must be loaded" is just rubbish. All "he" needs is a good enough credit rating to sign a lease.

In terms of my own cars, I tend to buy ones that are a few years old, and then keep them for a long time. So someone else has taken the brunt of the depreciation, and you get a good car at a knockdown price. I like Alfas because the depreciation is catastrophic, and they are engaging to drive. If they are well looked after, then reliability is not an issue, and I do pretty much all of the servicing myself.

In terms of the whole status thing, if someone actually gives a monkeys that someone else is driving a 12 model with a bigger engine that them, they have a bit of a problem. I know loaded people who drive Bentleys, and I know loaded people who drive Fiestas. The common thread between them is that they don't give a shit about their choice or anyone elses.

[Downside]

I like my cars too much, but I'd only spend semi serious amount of money on something a little more unusual (I have an Alfa at the mo)...certainly wouldnt even consider spending 30 or 40k on an Audi or Beemer, unless it was a company car...

I have a similar view to you, if I had a serious amount of cash burning a hole in my pocket I would probably put it towards a classic American muscle car or something similar from that era.

Even if I had to be driven around in a limo I would probably get a Mercedes Benz 600 Pullman as oposed to something modern.

[dangermaus]

If you can lay your hands on £2K a month, you can easily stick a Porsche on your drive. You don't need to find 60K or whatever they cost, but you will end up paying a tidy chunk of that over 3 years.

Tbh if someone has 2k a month spare I'd consider them pretty loaded.

[davidg]

Where I work the company car park is full of status cars - BMW x5s, Cayennes that kind of thing. People spend lunchtimes admiring (or at least having to sit in and listen too) anyone who has just bought a new car. It is a bit tedious to be honest.

[OnionTerror]

I have a similar view to you, if I had a serious amount of cash burning a hole in my pocket I would probably put it towards a classic American muscle car or something similar from that era.

Even if I had to be driven around in a limo I would probably get a Mercedes Benz 600 Pullman as oposed to something modern.

I would have a three car garage -

an Ariel Atom

a Lancia Delta Integrale Evo 2

and a sensible car, possibly an Alfa 159, Brera, or something like that...

I'd also consider a bike, but when you've an Atom, would you need one?