dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 I am 4 years in this one. The fundamentals are a mess, as is the economy of the world but the goobermint is going to do everything in their power to prop up prices. They cant do it forever but they can do it for longer than I want to wait. £1200 a month would be better going towards getting rid of a mortgage, especially whilst inflation will eat away at it and the ptb are on my side. That said, if this place doesnt tick all the boxes and is the right price then I will go back to watching and waiting, I am in no rush. They are not forcing the banks to lend, they are cutting housing benefits, and sales volumes are tumbling? How is that "doing everything in their power to prop up prices", or maybe they are concentrating all their firepower on your back yard, which is obviously special Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 From SKY Average earnings increased by 1.8% in the year to August, up 0.1% on the previous month. Why isn`t the economy improving then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 They are not forcing the banks to lend, they are cutting housing benefits, and sales volumes are tumbling? How is that "doing everything in their power to prop up prices", or maybe they are concentrating all their firepower on your back yard, which is obviously special are you serious? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 are you serious? Yes. Do you have a link to the house you mentioned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Yes. Do you have a link to the house you mentioned? I do but it wouldnt be sensible to share location info given how much time I have spent discussing precious metals here. We all laugh at deluded sellers believing their house and area to be special - I have no such vested interest in believing the same, quite the opposite. But, I have watched for 4 years now and whilst it may go against the grain of the majority my observations here are genuine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Also from SKY: EU industrial production declined -2.5% month on month in September. Wages here are rising less than inflation and things people need to buy (food, energy etc) rising significantly. No one wants to invest as things look bad in Europe and people are not spending in UK. New jobs are part-time, minimum wage so unemployment is down but number of job seekers is up. So wage inflation eating up mortgage debt isn`t going to work then? Maybe the majority who own their house outright will just need to cut their prices so they can sell to all those struggling to pay their bills? Although, as I might as well keep mentioning, my rent has rocketed by £100 over the last 15 years, and this PC nearly sent me bust at £260 from PC World Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 I do but it wouldnt be sensible to share location info given how much time I have spent discussing precious metals here. We all laugh at deluded sellers believing their house and area to be special - I have no such vested interest in believing the same, quite the opposite. But, I have watched for 4 years now and whilst it may go against the grain of the majority my observations here are genuine. Ok, so we assume your area is special, quiet, friendly English village? great views, low crime, maybe commutable to London? So a detached house there is worth bidding £385,000 for, but this can`t be generalised to the rest of the country, North of England, less special parts of London, Scotland? The latest headlines from Scotland say "Buyers down, prices down, sellers up" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worried1 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Anyone had a look at 4 to 5 bed houses in places like pinner, northwood, ruislip, elstree? Yes, its an expensive area and its nice and commutable to London however they were 100% middle and lower upper class professionals a decade ago. Now you are talking millions.... I think that this is the same all around London. In my area, you can tell who has recently moved into the roads of standard semi detached houses because of the new BMW or Mercedes on the drive when the people who have lived there for a while are more likely to have a black cab or a white van instead. It is the type of displacement that happened in central London years ago, and is now fully entrenched in the suburbs. The purchase of a standard semi now demands two very good professional salaries or one mega salary. The people that haved lived there since the 80s have probably never earned much more than the national average wage and been able to live reasonably comfortably on that. When you move up to the traditional 'executive' houses like you are talking about, it is only those from the banking fraternity and a few lucky inheritees that can really afford to buy in, not the middle class people earning perhaps twice the average wage that would have bought these in the 80s. I guess this will prop the market up for a while, but it can't last forever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Ok, so we assume your area is special, quiet, friendly English village? great views, low crime, maybe commutable to London? So a detached house there is worth bidding £385,000 for, but this can`t be generalised to the rest of the country, North of England, less special parts of London, Scotland? The latest headlines from Scotland say "Buyers down, prices down, sellers up" Agreed, and that is why I specifically discuss my personal situation and do not generalise. I know how the majority of the country is fairing. This will give a general idea http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-24782862.html Place has no central heating, no gas, no mains sewage (sess tank), needs complete rewire, no pics inside as it is small and hasnt been touched in 30 years, the kitchen is a cupboard with a sink in it. It wont stay on long, someone/builder will buy it - build an extension the full width of the drive and completely renovate. As it happens, all things aside, this is looks good for the price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 I think that this is the same all around London. In my area, you can tell who has recently moved into the roads of standard semi detached houses because of the new BMW or Mercedes on the drive when the people who have lived there for a while are more likely to have a black cab or a white van instead. It is the type of displacement that happened in central London years ago, and is now fully entrenched in the suburbs. The purchase of a standard semi now demands two very good professional salaries or one mega salary. The people that haved lived there since the 80s have probably never earned much more than the national average wage and been able to live reasonably comfortably on that. When you move up to the traditional 'executive' houses like you are talking about, it is only those from the banking fraternity and a few lucky inheritees that can really afford to buy in, not the middle class people earning perhaps twice the average wage that would have bought these in the 80s. I guess this will prop the market up for a while, but it can't last forever. It is the same in Swansea. You see newly bought semis with big 4x4s or BMWs in the drive but the house next door, which was bought 10 plus years ago, is often owned by a white van man or taxi driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 It is the same in Swansea. You see newly bought semis with big 4x4s or BMWs in the drive but the house next door, which was bought 10 plus years ago, is often owned by a white van man or taxi driver. I think that the percentage of the last generation who could afford to buy their homes now is tiny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 It is the same in Swansea. You see newly bought semis with big 4x4s or BMWs in the drive but the house next door, which was bought 10 plus years ago, is often owned by a white van man or taxi driver. This indicates to me that prices can easily slide back to late 90`s levels? Most of the "new" money is equity and banking money, a pool that is now drying out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swissy_fit Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Agreed, and that is why I specifically discuss my personal situation and do not generalise. I know how the majority of the country is fairing. This will give a general idea http://www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-24782862.html Place has no central heating, no gas, no mains sewage (sess tank), needs complete rewire, no pics inside as it is small and hasnt been touched in 30 years, the kitchen is a cupboard with a sink in it. It wont stay on long, someone/builder will buy it - build an extension the full width of the drive and completely renovate. As it happens, all things aside, this is looks good for the price. That looks good for the price? Wow. There are some really mad parts of the UK re. property prices. In no particular order : Swansea and area Reading and area Parts of Devon and Cornwall Places where prices are very high with no justification (that I can see) whatsoever. London is mad, but there are arguments that go some way to justifying the prices. Surrey and some of the other nice parts of the Home Counties are mad, but ditto... The nice parts of Devon and Cornwall are mad, but ditto... Where is the justification in a price like that for a grotty cold badly-built shell on a plot in the middle of nowhere near Reading? Are there free jobs nearby, 60-80k a pop? Thought not. These parts of the UK have a long way to fall IMO, but I think the route is going to be gradual devaluation and inflation not by huge nominal price falls. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 This indicates to me that prices can easily slide back to late 90`s levels? Most of the "new" money is equity and banking money, a pool that is now drying out? something often overlooked since the last generation is the effect of women entering the workplace - there is now a double income to be spent/required Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Agreed, and that is why I specifically discuss my personal situation and do not generalise. I know how the majority of the country is fairing. This will give a general idea http://www.rightmove...y-24782862.html Place has no central heating, no gas, no mains sewage (sess tank), needs complete rewire, no pics inside as it is small and hasnt been touched in 30 years, the kitchen is a cupboard with a sink in it. It wont stay on long, someone/builder will buy it - build an extension the full width of the drive and completely renovate. As it happens, all things aside, this is looks good for the price. Interesting, not bad if your neighbour doesn`t do band rehearsals every day in the front room, and people with kids would love the space, but this has been pumped up by the general bubble/ponzi, and must come back down IMO. How much was this 12 or more years ago? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 the route is going to be gradual devaluation and inflation not by huge nominal price falls. This^^^ A long slow grind sideways/down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 the route is going to be gradual devaluation and inflation not by huge nominal price falls. This^^^ A long slow grind sideways/down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 something often overlooked since the last generation is the effect of women entering the workplace - there is now a double income to be spent/required Women were well entrenched in the workplace when I bought an ex-council house, two bedrooms, back and front garden near Aberdeen for 11k in 1995. There has to be another cause......Eric? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 (edited) something often overlooked since the last generation is the effect of women entering the workplace - there is now a double income to be spent/required Joint income mortgages did as much for the boom as liar loans. Government plans this week about flexible working to get another 1m women into work. If the people want to sacrifice their lives to sleep inside more expensive walls and debt servitude, that's what they will get. Edit to add women Edited November 14, 2012 by Democorruptcy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Interesting, not bad if your neighbour doesn`t do band rehearsals every day in the front room, and people with kids would love the space, but this has been pumped up by the general bubble/ponzi, and must come back down IMO. How much was this 12 or more years ago? Hasnt been touched in 30 years. Next door sold for 385k in nov 2010 having had the full side extension done. This area is cheaper as it has no mains sewage or gas and is out on its own Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce Banner Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 something often overlooked since the last generation is the effect of women entering the workplace - there is now a double income to be spent/required When we bought our house in the mid 70s we needed two incomes to get the mortgage, as did most people. After a year or two the wife commenced sprogging duties, as did most, and never returned to work. Some things never change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 When we bought our house in the mid 70s we needed two incomes to get the mortgage, as did most people. After a year or two the wife commenced sprogging duties, as did most, and never returned to work. Some things never change. What were the salary multiples on the mortgage? 3 times main plus 1 times second? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Number79 Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 When we bought our house in the mid 70s we needed two incomes to get the mortgage, as did most people. After a year or two the wife commenced sprogging duties, as did most, and never returned to work. Some things never change. needed? I assume that you managed once she stopped working. When do you think was the last real time that it was more common that only the man had a propper job and his wage paid the mortgage and living? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19 year mortgage 8itch Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 When we bought our house in the mid 70s we needed two incomes to get the mortgage, as did most people. After a year or two the wife commenced sprogging duties, as did most, and never returned to work. Some things never change. Wage inflation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 That looks good for the price? Wow. There are some really mad parts of the UK re. property prices. In no particular order : Swansea and area Reading and area Parts of Devon and Cornwall Places where prices are very high with no justification (that I can see) whatsoever. London is mad, but there are arguments that go some way to justifying the prices. Surrey and some of the other nice parts of the Home Counties are mad, but ditto... The nice parts of Devon and Cornwall are mad, but ditto... Where is the justification in a price like that for a grotty cold badly-built shell on a plot in the middle of nowhere near Reading? Are there free jobs nearby, 60-80k a pop? Thought not. These parts of the UK have a long way to fall IMO, but I think the route is going to be gradual devaluation and inflation not by huge nominal price falls. Unfortunately sellers can`t put their lives on hold for years until this gradual process happens? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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