What Is The Ulitmate Guide

[ccc]

Why do people always assume that wages have to keep up with inflation? They don't.

Because you were discussing this in terms of debt being paid back.

In that regard - inflation will only help these people pay their debt back if it is wage inflation. Anything else will actually make it more difficult for them to pay their debt back. You don't pay your credit card bill with the price of tomatoes.

Did you actually laugh and did you smile?

A knowning smile is not quite the same as 'laughing' at someone, especially if done in private

I just found the post amusing. I don't laugh at people with downs syndrome. They seem, more often than not, decent folk.

[Guest absolutezero]

Because you were discussing this in terms of debt being paid back.

In that regard - inflation will only help these people pay their debt back if it is wage inflation. Anything else will actually make it more difficult for them to pay their debt back. You don't pay your credit card bill with the price of tomatoes.

If the powers that be wanted to they could fix people's interest rates for the term of the debt while hitting the inflation button. Not saying they will but it wouldn't surprise me one bit.

[ccc]

I'm surprised it's as low as 10 million.

As unemployment rises I expect tax to rise. And I don't expect many of the lost jobs to ever return from India or wherever they've been offshored to.

So you think unemployment will rise, tax will rise, inflation will rise - and this will all help pay back the debt..

One day the debt will have to be paid back. After inflation takes hold that debt will be tiny.

[ccc]

If the powers that be wanted to they could fix people's interest rates for the term of the debt while hitting the inflation button. Not saying they will but it wouldn't surprise me one bit.

How are the powers that be going to make the private sector inflate their workers' salaries ? In fact how are they going to do it in the public sector when it is cuts all round ?

I think many expect a 70's type, everyone gets a nice wage increase on a monthly basis therefore debt isn't a problem anymore, situation.

Whilst possible, I think it is unlikely.

The average amount of spare cash the average Brit has to spend will fall IMO. This will not help anything. Especially house prices or debt repayments.

[Guest absolutezero]

So you think unemployment will rise, tax will rise, inflation will rise - and this will all help pay back the debt..

Pay back the mortgage debt yes.

The mortgage debt will not rise with inflation. There will probably be some kind of emergency mortgage act or something. Other things will rise in price but the mortgage debt will be fixed.

When I say the Government controls markets this is the kind of thing I mean.

[ccc]

Pay back the mortgage debt yes.

The mortgage debt will not rise with inflation. There will probably be some kind of emergency mortgage act or something. Other things will rise in price but the mortgage debt will be fixed.

When I say the Government controls markets this is the kind of thing I mean.

So you think wage inflation will occur ? For the above to work wage inflation has to occur - as I said...

[Guest absolutezero]

How are the powers that be going to make the private sector inflate their workers' salaries ? In fact how are they going to do it in the public sector when it is cuts all round ?

Easy. They're not going to inflate salaries at all. Maybe by 1 per cent annually but I don't see more than that.

I think many expect a 70's type, everyone gets a nice wage increase on a monthly basis therefore debt isn't a problem anymore, situation.

Whilst possible, I think it is unlikely.

So do I.

The average amount of spare cash the average Brit has to spend will fall IMO. This will not help anything. Especially house prices or debt repayments.

Exactly. But if mortgage interest is fixed people will pay the mortgage first and adjust other spending accordingly.

There is so much resting on house prices.

[ccc]

Easy. They're not going to inflate salaries at all. Maybe by 1 per cent annually but I don't see more than that.

So do I.

Exactly. But if mortgage interest is fixed people will pay the mortgage first and adjust other spending accordingly.

There is so much resting on house prices.

Mmm..not sure I can see this ending in your debts will end up tiny scenario. Everything goes up except mortgages. Wages barely rise.

You do realise there will come a point where many people have to pay 100% of their income soley into their mortgage debt ? Even if that debt does not increase with inflation ?

For the above to work IMO - serious wage inflation has to occur. There is not other way I can see.

[chris25]

Dare I say it????

Maybe Ignorance is BLISS?

Ignorance is complete bliss.

I can honestly say if I had no idea about the catastrophic state of the UK in general I would be a far happier person.

Can't do nowt now apart from keep busy, prep, keep fit.

[Guest absolutezero]

Mmm..not sure I can see this ending in your debts will end up tiny scenario. Everything goes up except mortgages. Wages barely rise.

You do realise there will come a point where many people have to pay 100% of their income soley into their mortgage debt ? Even if that debt does not increase with inflation ?

Why? Let's say a £200,000 mortgage at a fixed 4 percent.

That's fixed interest of £8000 a year. Plus capital repayments.

Wages of say £40,000 between the husband and wife. Other goods rise in price. The wages stay the same.

How would 100 percent of wages equal the mortgage payment?

[Guest DestroyBrown]

Why? Let's say a £200,000 mortgage at a fixed 4 percent.

That's fixed interest of £8000 a year. Plus capital repayments.

Wages of say £40,000 between the husband and wife. Other goods rise in price. The wages stay the same.

How would 100 percent of wages equal the mortgage payment?

disposable income dropping due to rampant inflation of goods and services?

[Dorkins]

I can't help but notice that a thread about happiness has turned into a thread about wages, interest rates, and inflation. These things are connected, but they are not the same.

If you want to be happy, get your living costs way down and learn to make do with the simple basics. Cook healthy food and exercise a bit if you have a non-manual job. Try to live within 5 miles of work. Watch little or no TV. Don't read newspapers, they are designed to stress you out. Socialise as much as possible. Buy people presents that are thoughtful, not expensive. Fancy clothes/cars/TVs/mansions will not make you happy. The world cup final will be just as exciting on a 10 year old CRT as a 2 week old HDTV that cost the same as this month's mortgage.

[the coming storm]

Alas the vast majority do not see the fnords. Once you can see them there's no going back.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord

[/quote

I wouldn’t suggest going back and i certainly take the point once you know something you can’t ignore it, but I wondering (and i stress wondering) – when you understand a bit more about how the UK and for that matter the world economy works, you have a dilemma, because from my experience most people don’t

Not trying to suggest that somehow HPC’rs are more enlightened than the sheeple in ‘superior sense’ i.e. better human beings, but they do have more of a grasp on certain realities, which puts you at odds with a lot of your friends/families

Unless you can leave the UK for a different environment, i’m wondering if its worth suppressing some of those thoughts, if only for a more content life, because I don’t see things changing for the better anytime soon

]

Leave the UK for where? Do you not think that houseprices are fairly high in other first world countries, and if they are lower then its because wages are lower, or there are less jobs. You will still have to work pretty much to retirement, playing rent or a mortgage of some kind. It is not a bit naive to think that its really different anywhere else in the world from the point of view of making a living and house prices- you may go somewhere and pay less tax but then your going to have make up for by having private health care - I just hate listening expats who say oh its great here the tax is less - yes thats because you have private health care, and you already had your education paid for. Or the types that have sold their property, and managed to buy something bigger in another - and they say the standard of living here is so much better - no thats because the pound is stronger than the local currency, and you have sold at the height of property boom, you got a pension you have built up in the UK - so the standard of living is not higher, its because you are cushioned against living like the locals. Go out to another country with nothing for 5 years, and see if you think the standard of living is higher.

Can you honestly think of anywhere thats going to be radically different to the UK - everywhere is the same, we all watch the same tv and movies, work in offices and shops, drive the same cars, go on holidays to the same places, buy the same products in the shops. And if you go some where there is a very good social security system, then your going to pay for it with higher taxes - why can't people just accept that basic fact of life, you don't get something for nothing. While going outside the UK, might be a change in lifestyle and interests its not that much of change.

[Horridbloke]

Sorry, I couldn't resist:

[88Crash]

I can't help but notice that a thread about happiness has turned into a thread about wages, interest rates, and inflation. These things are connected, but they are not the same.

If you want to be happy, get your living costs way down and learn to make do with the simple basics. Cook healthy food and exercise a bit if you have a non-manual job. Try to live within 5 miles of work. Watch little or no TV. Don't read newspapers, they are designed to stress you out. Socialise as much as possible. Buy people presents that are thoughtful, not expensive. Fancy clothes/cars/TVs/mansions will not make you happy. The world cup final will be just as exciting on a 10 year old CRT as a 2 week old HDTV that cost the same as this month's mortgage.

It certainly has and maybe you have got part of the answer to my initial question on this thread above, namely how to be a bit happier living in the UK

Its a good thing to understadn about interest rates and inflation etc, but if you spend too much time thinking about it, it isn't the happiest of subjects. Having a few beers with good company is a far happier pursuit (or for that matter a cup of coffee)

[88Crash]

ame='88Crash' date='23 May 2010 - 02:05 AM' timestamp='1274576742' post='2535143']

Leave the UK for where? Do you not think that houseprices are fairly high in other first world countries, and if they are lower then its because wages are lower, or there are less jobs. You will still have to work pretty much to retirement, playing rent or a mortgage of some kind. It is not a bit naive to think that its really different anywhere else in the world from the point of view of making a living and house prices- you may go somewhere and pay less tax but then your going to have make up for by having private health care - I just hate listening expats who say oh its great here the tax is less - yes thats because you have private health care, and you already had your education paid for. Or the types that have sold their property, and managed to buy something bigger in another - and they say the standard of living here is so much better - no thats because the pound is stronger than the local currency, and you have sold at the height of property boom, you got a pension you have built up in the UK - so the standard of living is not higher, its because you are cushioned against living like the locals. Go out to another country with nothing for 5 years, and see if you think the standard of living is higher.

Can you honestly think of anywhere thats going to be radically different to the UK - everywhere is the same, we all watch the same tv and movies, work in offices and shops, drive the same cars, go on holidays to the same places, buy the same products in the shops. And if you go some where there is a very good social security system, then your going to pay for it with higher taxes - why can't people just accept that basic fact of life, you don't get something for nothing. While going outside the UK, might be a change in lifestyle and interests its not that much of change.

There are a few exceptions and it also depends on individual circumstances, but I pretty much agree with all your points above, even though i no longer live in the UK, hence my question what can (specifically younger) people do to enjoy the UK a bit more, increase their quality of life, I was not suggesting the alternative was to actually leave the UK

[the coming storm]

I fear you're right. All the x factor watching sheeple at work all seem pretty happy and relaxed and view me with faint derision as i sit gibbering in the corner clutching my crate of gunz 'n' beanz.

I wonder if the sheeple we meet who make us HPCers irritated - are really just acting dumb - they manage to get on with there life in every other way fine, just because their not obsessed with houseprices and the general state of the economy does not mean they are stupid . perhaps they know they are up to debt to the eyeballs, a few pay checks away from getting their house repocessed, that the UK is to its eyeballs in debts, they are in jobs where they earn enough to pay there bills, and get a reasonable standard of living - watching x factor, getting pissed at the weekend, and buying the latest rubbish.

perhaps the sheeple have worked out that unless your actually earning a lot more money - which is going to take a lot of work, then whats the point of saving every penny, and being frugal, and getting obsessed the economy and houseprices. Surely the only thing somewhat within your control is the job or business your working in.

Its easier to fit in and outwardly and play the sheeple game and discuss who won x factor.

[Pick It Down]

I wonder if the sheeple we meet who make us HPCers irritated - are really just acting dumb - they manage to get on with there life in every other way fine, just because their not obsessed with houseprices and the general state of the economy does not mean they are stupid . perhaps they know they are up to debt to the eyeballs, a few pay checks away from getting their house repocessed, that the UK is to its eyeballs in debts, they are in jobs where they earn enough to pay there bills, and get a reasonable standard of living - watching x factor, getting pissed at the weekend, and buying the latest rubbish.

perhaps the sheeple have worked out that unless your actually earning a lot more money - which is going to take a lot of work, then whats the point of saving every penny, and being frugal, and getting obsessed the economy and houseprices. Surely the only thing somewhat within your control is the job or business your working in.

Its easier to fit in and outwardly and play the sheeple game and discuss who won x factor.

But their choices show that also they inwardly play the sheeple game.

One of my main drinking buddies has just spent £75k on a place in Armley, when he told me he'd done this he mentioned it sheepishly as he knew my thoughts on the subject, as if he expected a bollocking . However like you say, you play the sheeple game and say well done etc etc, when are you having the BBQ?

[88Crash]

But their choices show that also they inwardly play the sheeple game.

One of my main drinking buddies has just spent £75k on a place in Armley, when he told me he'd done this he mentioned it sheepishly as he knew my thoughts on the subject, as if he expected a bollocking . However like you say, you play the sheeple game and say well done etc etc, when are you having the BBQ?

Its almost a choice of doing that or having NO friends, it seems

This Sheeple thing seems to be infectious

[Pick It Down]

Its almost a choice of doing that or having NO friends, it seems

This Sheeple thing seems to be infectious

The best way to find a sheeple seems to be to come out with something that is sensible but runs against the popular meme.. They don't know what to say.

[Blue Nose Bear]

How to be happy in the UK?

Same as being happy anywhere really - have a challenging but ultimately achievable dream and work for it, re-evaluate and refine as necessary to ensure continued motivation.

[billfunk]

How to be happy in the UK?

Same as being happy anywhere really - have a challenging but ultimately achievable dream and work for it, re-evaluate and refine as necessary to ensure continued motivation.

Excellent response.

How would you go about convincing millions of disenfranchised, undereducated people to do this in our system? What constitutes an achievable dream for them? ASDA, Tesco? How to ensure continued motivation with no stake in society?

[winkie]

I can't help but notice that a thread about happiness has turned into a thread about wages, interest rates, and inflation. These things are connected, but they are not the same.

If you want to be happy, get your living costs way down and learn to make do with the simple basics. Cook healthy food and exercise a bit if you have a non-manual job. Try to live within 5 miles of work. Watch little or no TV. Don't read newspapers, they are designed to stress you out. Socialise as much as possible. Buy people presents that are thoughtful, not expensive. Fancy clothes/cars/TVs/mansions will not make you happy. The world cup final will be just as exciting on a 10 year old CRT as a 2 week old HDTV that cost the same as this month's mortgage.

..all of that and to share it with a like minded person, have a strong network of reliable and trustful support, be grateful for what you have been given...don't worry about what others think, be your own person, and enjoy saving even if it is only £1 per week and spend what you have earned wisely. ...many would disagree, but always do what you think is best, not what others think is best for you.

[Pick It Down]

Excellent response.

How would you go about convincing millions of disenfranchised, undereducated people to do this in our system? What constitutes an achievable dream for them? ASDA, Tesco? How to ensure continued motivation with no stake in society?

But you can be happy working as ASDA or Tesco. Personally I'd make it a social event to make it bearable, chat with a lot of the customers, ask them how they're doing, in that it'd be like going to the pub and chatting. Being stuck in a boiling office with the same twenty faces might seem a lot less interesting by comparison.

It's about how you look at it I suppose.

[the coming storm]

Its almost a choice of doing that or having NO friends, it seems

This Sheeple thing seems to be infectious

Its the same with for example politics, notice how much coverage there was on TV, but no discussion with anyone you know. Its all you get out of people is tedious banal small talk - its seems that everyone strives these days to be an x factor watching, middle of the road , middle class, facebook using, middle management, sheeple with no independent thoughts, opinions or will of their own - its a way of avoid getting criticised, if you constantly play a game of being outwardly bland, vague and appear to be popular then its hard for people to attack you, its conformism... I have seen the same trait in people who are very inteliigent - but for some reason they play dumb in public.

So don't always assume people are stupid.