The Bubbly Bitcoin Thread -- Merged Threads

[evetsm]

On-chain tx volume is right column. On-exchange trade volume is middle column. A couple of thoughts:

 

1) $28B USD on-chain tx volume for #bitcoin is insane & shows real usage

2) Next closest in tx volume is $ETH & it's only $3B 3) $BTC & $BCH are only two w/ tx vol>trade vol.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DQ3ee9BWkAAdS--?format=jpg

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/matt_odell/status/940652539388850177

Edited December 15, 2017 by evetsm

[goldbug9999]

13 hours ago, adamLancs said:

Roger Ver is a Bitcoin billionaire and behaves like a spoilt little brat in this video. The more I read about this guy the more I dislike him. He already owns far too many Bitcoins, you can bet he's got at least 10-50x as many Bcash. I'm keeping my forks just because sheep can be unpredictable but I'm looking forward to the day these forks get kicked to the curb. It's just not practical, imho, to have lone wolves piggyback on the work and talent of Bitcoin like this, even if his heart was in the right place (it's not).

If you need to send small payments right now, there are other options with more respectable persons behind them.

He was being a total hypocrite and a cry baby here - hes has used many derogatory terms for bitcoin including bitcoin legacy so hes got no right to be sensitive of it. And regardless of the technicalities he has no moral grounds for claiming that bcash is the real bitcoinw. Bitcoin, is a specific code base, and a specific network - it is not an idea it is not the white paper, otherwise litecoin (for example) could just as easily claim to also be the real bitcoin. But Ver knows that purely on a technical basis he cant beat the competition in the digital cash space so he has to resort to trying to coopt the bitcoin brand and causing confusion on the market place.

[goldbug9999]

10 hours ago, doomed said:

There will only be one winner and it will be the major Sha256 coin so it is a straight fight between BTC and BCH. It's a shame BTC turned up to a gun fight with a spoon.

What does the market care about the hash used ?, if anything the opportunity might be taken to use a PoW that encourages more decentralized mining. As I said BCH has problem that it isn't best at any one thing - BTC is a more stable store of value with much bigger network and hashing power, dash is more scalable and has options for instant and obfuscated transactions and a formalized distributed governance model, litecoin has faster confirmations and transactions and has segwit so can be extended to do the 2nd layer and sidechain stuff that bitcoin can do (for bonus points it has a project leader who isnt a spoil cry baby).

[Saving For a Space Ship]

Why housebuilders shouldn’t ignore cryptocurrencies (from the VI press) 

 http://www.ukconstructionweek.com/news/construction-buzz/2007-why-housebuilders-shouldn-t-ignore-cryptocurrencies-construction-buzz-145

What spare cash ? 

Quote

..Crippled by student debt, zero hour contracts and rising house prices, it comes as no surprise that an increased number of millennials are investing their spare cash into Bitcoin in the hope for quick returns...

 

Edited December 15, 2017 by Saving For a Space Ship

[dgul]

8 minutes ago, Saving For a Space Ship said:

Why housebuilders shouldn’t ignore cryptocurrencies (from the VI press) 

 http://www.ukconstructionweek.com/news/construction-buzz/2007-why-housebuilders-shouldn-t-ignore-cryptocurrencies-construction-buzz-145

What spare cash ? 

 

If it was true that builders would take Bitcoin as a currency for a house purchase, that would be a cheap way to short bitcoin -- pay the 5% deposit (or whatever) and fix the price in Bitcoin, then string out the buying process for as long a time as possible (which, in house buying, can be a long time) hoping for the price to go down a fair whack.  If it didn't, then you're only out by your deposit (ie, the worst-case loss is 5% (or whatever) of the bet, rather than the potentially massive losses if shorting Bitcoin properly), but if it does go down the gains could be substantial..

[not making a point here about Bitcoin crashing, just a way to make use of the volatility.]

But, there will be no doubt that the transaction will be priced in £s and the actual transfer on the day of sale priced at that day's Bitcoin exchange rate.  Well, if they're not doing that they're stupid and deserve to be fleeced by people taking on the opportunity.

[markyh]

Slightly late update today. M25 traffic was terrible!  Well that didn't last long, seems those in the know have now dumped Alts in the last 24hrs and all pilled back into Bitcoin, pushing it back up to $18k level.

So those poor sods who dumped BTC into Alts are left with their dicks hanging if they didn't follow suit!

New all time high last 24hrs to £91800, up £2200 since yesterday. I do ponder if the game is not to push BTC as high as possible for Sunday to drag people in, then drop the price $3-4k over 24hrs just before CME futures launch like they did last week with CBOE futures.

For me it's a guessing game so just still HODL and see what happens.

Edited December 15, 2017 by markyh

[goldbug9999]

3 minutes ago, markyh said:

Slightly late update today. M25 traffic was terrible!  Well that didn't last long, seems those in the know have now dumped Alts in the last 24hrs and all pilled back into Bitcoin, pushing it back up to $18k level.

So those poor sods who dumped BTC into Alts are left with their dicks hanging if they didn't follow suit!

New all time high last 24hrs to £91800, up £2200 since yesterday. I do ponder if the game is not to push BTC as high as possible for Sunday to drag people in, then drop the price $3-4k over 24hrs just before CME futures launch like they did last week with CBOE futures.

For me it's a guessing game so just still HODL and see what happens.

Well I am 90% BTC 10% mostly top 5  alts as an insurance policy, am letting it run and trying not to fiddle and chase the market which as you say is what those doing this are tying to coax us into doing.

[adamLancs]

Good to see the total market cap trundling on this morning. $527 billion and making steady headway.

https://coinmarketcap.com/charts/

Get this one on a 1m chart. Looks like it's setting the stage for a push to the $1 trillion mark.

Alts getting drained as usual, several warnings gone out on cryptocurrencies recently. Bitcoin back to taking the lead imo. Shorters gonna get squashed soon.

[markyh]

4 minutes ago, goldbug9999 said:

Well I am 90% BTC 10% mostly top 5  alts as an insurance policy, am letting it run and trying not to fiddle and chase the market which as you say is what those doing this are tying to coax us into doing.

I have never sold any BTC, only Litecoin into other Alts , and my free BCH and BTG.  This gives me 78% BTC and 22% Alts, which as it happens seems to be an amazing hedge since the CBOE futures launched as the BTC drops or sideways movement results in Alts rocketing, and when Alts are dumped BTC rockets.

Look at the gains and (tiny) losses since Sunday.

Monday +19.66%

Tue + 2.66%

Wed +5.64%

Thur -0.15%

Fri +2.46%

If this is Futures price action for the near future , great! All upside.

 

[goldbug9999]

1 hour ago, markyh said:

I have never sold any BTC, only Litecoin into other Alts , and my free BCH and BTG.  This gives me 78% BTC and 22% Alts,

Thats probably a good balance, and what I'd recommend as a starting point for anyone getting into cryto.

For reference the etoro cypto copy fund is I think 60% BTC 40% alts.

[markyh]

3 minutes ago, fru-gal said:

It would be interesting if cryptos ended up being a transfer of wealth from the older generation to the young ones, with boomers having to pay £500k plus to some spotty teenager in order to get a place on the "crypto" ladder .

And the Government launch HTIC (Help to invest in Crypto) , where boomers sign over 20% of their house and the government part own a Bitcoin with them to the same value. But it's only interest free for the first 5 years then the gov charge the boomers RPI + 2% on the loan.

If Bitcoin goes up the Gov have a stake of every coin you own, if Bitcoin crashes they make the boomer sell their house!

[adamLancs]

2 minutes ago, fru-gal said:

It would be interesting if cryptos ended up being a transfer of wealth from the older generation to the young ones, with boomers having to pay £500k plus to some spotty teenager in order to get a place on the "crypto" ladder .

Technology is moving faster than minds can keep up. Education isn't keeping up, too many still glued to Facebook and Twitter. People on HPC represent an unusually savvy small vocal minority but the resistance to Bitcoin, crypto and technology has been great even here. I'm gonna have to give the mods a 1-up at some point for letting this topic ride in the main forum for so long, as I am very thankful for the discussion here. It is a notch or two above other places on the web.

Teaching programming and crypto is the best investment a kid can have right now, as it will cover technologies, finance & economics, politics, IT, programming, business etc all sorts of things. For programmers it will be the best industry to be in for salary in 5 years time. For investors, S&S are coming to an end, and investment will be run via token sales and you will keep your tokens yourself. No more too big to fail banks, this is the market coming up with it's own solution to the corporate monster.

[goldbug9999]

19 minutes ago, adamLancs said:

Technology is moving faster than minds can keep up. Education isn't keeping up, too many still glued to Facebook and Twitter. People on HPC represent an unusually savvy small vocal minority but the resistance to Bitcoin, crypto and technology has been great even here. I'm gonna have to give the mods a 1-up at some point for letting this topic ride in the main forum for so long, as I am very thankful for the discussion here. It is a notch or two above other places on the web.

I may well have not invested if it were not for this thread

[goldbug9999]

8 minutes ago, fru-gal said:

Perhaps. I think the cryptos will wax and wane in popularity but the blockchain technology is where the future lies because it can be used for so many different applications. The problem with all these things is the rich and powerful end up cannibalising the technology for their own benefit (I read a while ago that big banks want to use blockchain technology but in a centralised way with their own crypto that has no minimum cap so that could "print" more). They will always find a way to crush their competitors or pay off Governments to make rules in their favour. Just look what has happened with Net Neutrality. 

Sorry youve got it completely back to front, the utility is in the specific value pools like bitcoin and the top 5 or so alts because they are (by various degrees) too big in terms of concensus by hashing power to be subverted by any single organization or government, this the whole USP of crypto and blockchain. As a standalone technology it is useless compared to other distributed data technologies that we have.

Edited December 15, 2017 by goldbug9999

[Eddie_George]

47 minutes ago, fru-gal said:

Perhaps. I think the cryptos will wax and wane in popularity but the blockchain technology is where the future lies because it can be used for so many different applications. The problem with all these things is the rich and powerful end up cannibalising the technology for their own benefit (I read a while ago that big banks want to use blockchain technology but in a centralised way with their own crypto that has no minimum cap so that could "print" more). They will always find a way to crush their competitors or pay off Governments to make rules in their favour. Just look what has happened with Net Neutrality. 

They've already tried to do this. It's funny because they misunderstood the technology. Private blockchains are just databases, yet some companies sprung up to take the banks' money and try and develop them. 

What's novel about Bitcoin and its clones is that they are global, like the Internet. Private blockchains are akin to intranets or walled gardens like AOL tried to create, and sites such as Facebook and LinkedIn continue to experiment with.

Edited December 15, 2017 by Eddie_George

[markyh]

Ok really dumb question from a Bitcoin / Crypto holder and a ex (an ZEC current) miner.

How do I get a message onto the blockchain?

 

[Eddie_George]

15 minutes ago, markyh said:

Ok really dumb question from a Bitcoin / Crypto holder and a ex (an ZEC current) miner.

How do I get a message onto the blockchain?

Why bother? It just bloats the blockchain. You're better off using https://opentimestamps.org/ or https://poex.io/

Edited December 15, 2017 by Eddie_George

[Scramz]

Anyone here mining alt coins and moving them into Bitcoin?

[markyh]

18 minutes ago, Scramz said:

Anyone here mining alt coins and moving them into Bitcoin?

Should be everyone! As an old timer the Alts you can still mine for profit vs electricity you should convert to BTC, or at worst LTC (because LTC has much broader range of trading pairs to smaller Alts).

But even if moving into LTC every few months you must trade them into BTC.

This is how I got most of my stash back n 2013/14, I maybe in total mined 1 BTC directly, but my other stash came from firstly mining Litecoin and converting into Bitcoin, then towards the end Q2 2014 mining Dogecoin, trading into Litecoin , whicjh was then traded nto Botcoin. I stopped summer of 2014 with, 5.3 BTC, 108.5 LTC  and 100k Dogecoin.

I still have them.

I am currently mining ZEC directly on 1 GTX 1070 PC and every month will move it into Litecoin. Roughly every 3-4 months will move LTC into BTC.

Edited December 15, 2017 by markyh

[jiltedjen]

45 minutes ago, Scramz said:

Anyone here mining alt coins and moving them into Bitcoin?

yes. what would you like to know?

[ddd]

What the haters and nocoiners don’t understand and appreciate yet is that Bitcoin is the new protocol of wealth. With each day and each new ATH for Bitcoin and it’s sibling altcoins that passes they are getting left further and further behind the curve. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity. Now imagine having to explain to your grandchildren why your total wealth is 0.0000001 BTC. 

[ddd]

1 hour ago, markyh said:

Ok really dumb question from a Bitcoin / Crypto holder and a ex (an ZEC current) miner.

How do I get a message onto the blockchain?

 

You sign the transaction. 

[adamLancs]

22 minutes ago, ddd said:

Now imagine having to explain to your grandchildren why your total wealth is 0.0000001 BTC. 

[jiltedjen]

26 minutes ago, ddd said:

What the haters and nocoiners don’t understand and appreciate yet is that Bitcoin is the new protocol of wealth. With each day and each new ATH for Bitcoin and it’s sibling altcoins that passes they are getting left further and further behind the curve. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity. Now imagine having to explain to your grandchildren why your total wealth is 0.0000001 BTC. 

haha, 'NOCOINERS' shun the non believers, Shunnnnn
 

 

[kibuc]

24 minutes ago, ddd said:

What the haters and nocoiners don’t understand and appreciate yet is that Bitcoin is the new protocol of wealth. With each day and each new ATH for Bitcoin and it’s sibling altcoins that passes they are getting left further and further behind the curve. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity. Now imagine having to explain to your grandchildren why your total wealth is 0.0000001 BTC. 

There's a lot of people out there that appreciate the new technology, but at the same time are weary of the bubble (not just the bitcoin bubble, but the everything bubble) and are waiting for it to pop first. Like, you still made crazy money if you picked Amazon @100 in 1999, but you made way more if you waited and got it @10 in 2001.

If you subscribe to @durhamborn theory of an incoming apocalypse, then it makes sense to wait until dust settles and see which cryptos made it out at the other end.