Caius Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 In fact, three of my cousins are nationalists, but one of them married an Englishman! Love conquers all... dalek, I think you are confused. Being a 'nationalist' doesn't mean you hate the English. In fact, this may surprise you but I now of many English people who are Welsh nationalists including some politicians. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalek Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 dalek, I think you are confused. Being a 'nationalist' doesn't mean you hate the English. In fact, this may surprise you but I now of many English people who are Welsh nationalists including some politicians. :-) That is exactly the point I was trying to make Caius... people often think Welsh nationalists are English-haters. I was making the observation that they're not. However, there are distinctions: I'm a Welsh patriot, but not a nationalist - I wouldn't be living in London if I were. All three nationalist cousins wouldn't dream of leaving Wales, send their children to welsh medium only schools and work in exclusively Welsh-speaking jobs. The word nationalist still worries me though as it does have connotations... but that's just me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 That is exactly the point I was trying to make Caius... people often think Welsh nationalists are English-haters. I was making the observation that they're not. However, there are distinctions: I'm a Welsh patriot, but not a nationalist - I wouldn't be living in London if I were. All three nationalist cousins wouldn't dream of leaving Wales, send their children to welsh medium only schools and work in exclusively Welsh-speaking jobs. The word nationalist still worries me though as it does have connotations... but that's just me. If it wasn't for 'vile' Welsh nationalism......we would have long disappeared down the tubes of history. On the other hand, British Nationalism as one can see in all its glory during the Olympics and Jubilee etc is quite acceptable. Talking of the Olympics....why is the BBC so Brit Nationalistic and at the same time, basically celebrate the black Panther movement and the independence of Jamaica from Britain? On the other hand, Scottish or Welsh Nationalism is unacceptable. I get quite confused at times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@contradevian Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Talking of the Olympics....why is the BBC so Brit Nationalistic and at the same time, basically celebrate the black Panther movement and the independence of Jamaica from Britain? On the other hand, Scottish or Welsh Nationalism is unacceptable. I get quite confused at times. BBC facing both ways at once isn't unusual. Jamaica leaving the British Empire doesn't threaten the BBC. The breakup of the UK would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Masked Tulip Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Anyway, isn't it time you learnt your own language? Even Catherine Zeta Jones - who's from your neck of the woods, i.e. the Mumbles - speaks Welsh as a first language, for God's Sake! PMSL. You seriously do not believe that do you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 PMSL. You seriously do not believe that do you? I think it would be good for you as it would go a long way towards removing that enormous chip on your shoulder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalek Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 (edited) If it wasn't for 'vile' Welsh nationalism......we would have long disappeared down the tubes of history. On the other hand, British Nationalism as one can see in all its glory during the Olympics and Jubilee etc is quite acceptable. Talking of the Olympics....why is the BBC so Brit Nationalistic and at the same time, basically celebrate the black Panther movement and the independence of Jamaica from Britain? On the other hand, Scottish or Welsh Nationalism is unacceptable. I get quite confused at times. Caius, control yourself! I didn't say 'vile' Welsh nationalism did I? I can't stress enough how Welsh nationalists are not, on the whole, anti-English. As to British nationalism, now it's you who's confused. You're wrong about British nationalism being acceptable. To me, and most people here in London anyway, a British nationalist is someone to be avoided, and the term is used to mean members of the BNP or English Defence League. Hence my worries about the word. What we are seeing at the Olympics is pure, unadulterated patriotism! But you are quite right to suggest that Welsh nationalism isn't the same as extremism, like that of real British 'nationalists' (or German national socialists during the 30s/40s). And it's a shame that many English people, maybe because of their experience here in England with nationalists, equate Welsh and Scottish nationalists with anti-English sentiment. In fact, Caius, my cousins' mum and dad - my aunt and uncle - who, like their children are Welsh nationalists, used to climb road signs in the 60s to deface the English-only road signs. I was and still am immensely proud of them for doing so. Now, thanks to people like them we have bilingual signs, with the Welsh first. And quite right too. It's just me who has a problem with the word nationalism, even as it is used in Wales. Words, and the use of, can be extremely complicated, and powerful... Edited August 10, 2012 by dalek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalek Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 (edited) PMSL. You seriously do not believe that do you? Tulip, Catherine Zeta Jones speaks fluent Welsh as her first language. I've heard her do so on't telly with an S4C interviewer, and it was perfect. In fact, she's also bringing up her children Dylan and Carys (good Welsh names) to speak Welsh, having even employed a Welsh-speaking nanny on a £70,000 a year salary. Wish I didn't know this, actually... I detest celebrity culture. There was a great sketch on TV, with Armando Ianucci playing Michael Douglas and his female sidekick playing CZJ. You'll have to imagine her South-walian accent: CZJ: As my old mother used to say: 'Ach, cach, iach, bach, zach, ech, dach' MD: Gee, Catherine, that's beautiful. She was speaking Welsh, yes? CZJ: Noooh. She was just maaad! So Tulip, when are you going to sign up to your first Gwers Cymraeg (Welsh lesson)?! (and imagine, a whole new world of Welsh-speaking dominatrixes opening up to you: 'Ar dy ben-gliniau, bachgen!' - on your knees, boy! - doesn't the sound of that send a shudder down your spine?) Edited August 10, 2012 by dalek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 So Tulip, when are you going to sign up to your first Gwers Cymraeg?! (and imagine, a whole new world of Welsh-speaking dominatrixes opening up to you...) Paid a gwneud i mi chwerthin. Anyway, here is one for TMT : Forced Cymraeg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dalek Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 (edited) Paid a gwneud i mi chwerthin. Anyway, here is one for TMT : Forced Cymraeg Digrif dros ben Caius! Dwi'n licio'r: 'I'll 'ave a six-foot-seven Welsh-speaker standing orver me in bed, Cymraeg in hand, ready to ram it right good and proper down my breathin' tube.' Fetish go iawn! (a 'dwi di adio tipyn bach mwy i'r darn ynglun a'r dominatrix...) Edited August 10, 2012 by dalek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19 year mortgage 8itch Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 Great post. Buy a house? Unseen? At auction? FWIW, I'm fairly sympathetic to TMT's worldview having grown up and been educated in S Wales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tankus Posted August 10, 2012 Share Posted August 10, 2012 avoid the grey bits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 If I remember correctly Tankus.....you're the one who wouldn't tell me where you lived when we crossed swords before only for me to later read that you weren't actually living in Wales at all and wanted to move to somewhere near Bridgend as long as it was south of the M4. Oh yes.....the the north of the M4 you have those awful people of 'Welsh Wales' to use your map. In that last couple of weeks....I've learnt of two new Welsh medium schools in your 'British Wales' ; one in Tenby and the other in Wrexham. The march onwards continues..........No place to hide.....LOL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEO72 Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Ooh....it must be so wonderful being Anglicised and all that. Isn't Wrexham there? They've just started to build a Welsh medium school there havn't they? And it's not the first in the area. http://www.wrexham.c...-gwersyllt.html Wow, and you've been accusing other of having a chip on their shoulder! The OP was concerned about being singled out because of his accent..hence my post. But thanks for breaking down the stereotype of the Welsh having sticks up their @rses anyway... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
@contradevian Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 avoid the grey bits I do hope there is a ferry taking you from Glamorgan to Pembroke! One visited the passport office in Newport and I escaped! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuffy Chuffnell Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 (edited) avoid the grey bits You might also want to avoid the Valleys in the white part too.... "grim" is an understatement. And most towns in NE Wales are pretty grim too - eg Wrexham Basically you're left with the English part of Pembrokeshire, Swansea , Monmouthshire, Cardiff, Powys, and the nicer rural parts of the NE. Edited August 11, 2012 by Chuffy Chuffnell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 But thanks for breaking down the stereotype of the Welsh having sticks up their @rses anyway... And thank you for dispelling the stereotype of the English as being narrow minded and prejudiced..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEO72 Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Actually I'm welsh. And you're an embarrasment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Hovis Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 Careful in those valleys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Democorruptcy Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 avoid the grey bits I've had holidays in 2,3,4 & 11 in the past year and don't know what there is that needs avoiding. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 +1 OP Have you considered North East wales? Far more anglicised, quite difficult to find anyone who sounds welsh, let alone speaks it, and much better transport links (e.g. Liverpool/Manchester). What about this house (nice village too) You gave a +1 to TMT's anti-Welsh tirade and then went onto say that north east Wales was so wonderful with no Welsh being spoken and not even people sounding Welsh. Wow, and you've been accusing other of having a chip on their shoulder! The OP was concerned about being singled out because of his accent..hence my post. But thanks for breaking down the stereotype of the Welsh having sticks up their @rses anyway... 'Their' arses as opposed to 'our' arses. Actually I'm welsh. And you're an embarrasment. Finally...you say that you are Welsh and I'm an embarrassment despite be defending Wales. I think you are confused and should look at yourself in the mirror. What kind of Welsh are you that you side with those who ridicule your own country? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 I've had holidays in 2,3,4 & 11 in the past year and don't know what there is that needs avoiding. You obviously came without any prejudices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
butterflylady Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 You might also want to avoid the Valleys in the white part too.... "grim" is an understatement. And most towns in NE Wales are pretty grim too - eg Wrexham Basically you're left with the English part of Pembrokeshire, Swansea , Monmouthshire, Cardiff, Powys, and the nicer rural parts of the NE. FFS.... Read the experiences posted in the thread man - experiences of people who actually live here in Wales. I'm originally Manc. Spent most of my years in the south east, Surrey/Sussex. Found the lifestyle there to be soul destroying. Bought at auction on a whim, moved to Blaenau Ffestiniog....found the lifestyle there to be a breath of fresh air....sold 3 years later at 80k over the 60k I paid. Bought in Rhondda. Found the lifestyle here to also be a breath of fresh air, for reasons already stated. You know....for their to be a true housepricecrash, money needs to be put where ones mouth is. So, get OUT of the 'the-sheeple-say-this-is-a-*posh*-place-to-live'....and get very radical. If enough people say NO to these jumped up high priced places, the price will drop. A little story of you... My (ex) neighbour here in Rhondda is 23. He has a girlfriend and baby and works full time in a factory. He has just moved out of next doors and bought himself his own house, a small 2 bed stone cottage with a garden...for not a lot of money. It's within his budget. It's a HOME. Contrast that with the fools who are still at home at the age of 30.40.....trying to save a deposit for a house they can't afford....just because popular opinion is that *this* area to ok, and *this* area isn't ok. When my neighbour moved to his own house, I was so bloody chuffed for him and his little family. Also - lets have a little *look* at these supposed desirable areas shall we......just forgetting about the insane house prices for a while.... Where I used to live, in a village called Ifold.....yeah nice....but then you've got Billingshurst.....also chav central. Further out Crawley....hideous. Croydon, hideous. Worthing, Littlehampton.... Back in towards London you've got Camberley....not nice. Woking, not that nice.... Lots of chavs....lots of crime, drugs and so on.......farrrrr less scenic than the valleys.... The schools ain't all that either.... Let's go up to Manc. I lived in a place called Wythenshawe (google crime stats) til I was 18 and managed to miraculously get myself a place at Aber Uni.... Wythenshawe, right next to Hale - which has a 'this is where posh people live' reputation.... I wouldn't live in Hale if someone paid me.... Back down to London - no crime or scary folk there then.... As I've said previously, the people in both north and south Wales, where I have experience of living....they've been superb. Yeah, there are many, many problems in these communities....but I'd take this lot over the *neighbours* I had in Sussex....any day. You want prices to stay high in certain regions? Carry on putting alternative places down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tankus Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 If I remember correctly Tankus.....you're the one who wouldn't tell me where you lived when we crossed swords before only for me to later read that you weren't actually living in Wales at all and wanted to move to somewhere near Bridgend as long as it was south of the M4. Oh yes.....the the north of the M4 you have those awful people of 'Welsh Wales' to use your map. In that last couple of weeks....I've learnt of two new Welsh medium schools in your 'British Wales' ; one in Tenby and the other in Wrexham. The march onwards continues..........No place to hide.....LOL! eh .?...post was a bit of a piss take ....obviously rubbed a few Max Boyce wannabes up the wrong way .........................good darts ..........maps dated 1983 ..probably before you were born ............... family's from Carmarthen and Llanelli ...born in Swansea ...lived in Llanelli ......Aberavon ...Caerphilly and London ....now living in Rhoose ...... the reason why I was looking at south of the M4 was railway access along the coastal railway ....and the COAST ...so I wouldn't have to use my car just to get into Cardiff ........and within a reasonable drive for visiting relations .....didn't really know the Vale that well ...but I just love southerndown and Ogmore by sea ..... Spent my youth in Saundersfoot ...Aberavon and LLanelli .......in the 60'sand 70's ......lived for a decade in the valleys ...wanted to get back into the early morning walks in the winter on deserted beaches ..and landscape photography .......bit of a mission when living in London ......... .......from that previous post from what I can remember ....about where English speaking welsh people (majority) are treated as second class citizens in their own country as welsh speakers will get preference for public and government jobs ....to keep them in the taffia ...particularly in the upper managerial posts ..as.....its jobs for the boyos ....'tis still true Most of my extended family's children go to welsh schools ...... It would give them better job prospects on leaving ...for sure .....as in some places... public service's account for over 50% of the job market ...... ..".no place to hide lol" ...what's that about ....hmm ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caius Posted August 11, 2012 Share Posted August 11, 2012 .......from that previous post from what I can remember ....about where English speaking welsh people (majority) are treated as second class citizens in their own country as welsh speakers will get preference for public and government jobs ....to keep them in the taffia ...particularly in the upper managerial posts ..as.....its jobs for the boyos ....'tis still true Did you see my link to TMT entitled 'Forced Cymraeg'? You should read it too. ;-) Anyway, regarding what you say above.....and not including any rumors or the like.....can you provide any evidence that this is happening and where? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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