Bloo Loo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Not always Europe was everything west of the German Empire - with Russia to the East and the Ottoman Empire to the south east. The divide being a line from the German Baltic to the Black sea [pic]http://upload.wikime...ces_1914-en.svg[/pic] Some history being re-written there all this debate...just proves to me Injin is correct...Countries are a figment of the imagination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilchardthecat Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 all this debate...just proves to me Injin is correct...Countries are a figment of the imagination. Indeed. More interesting that despite the dividing lines being something that frequently changes, people assign them artificial permanence - "always" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spaniard Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 all this debate...just proves to me Injin is correct...Countries are a figment of the imagination. To a solipsist everything other than 'self' is a figment of the imagination. We each demarcate between self and non-self, subjective and objective, illusion and reality, etc. in a continuous, dynamic, idiosyncratic, error-prone attempt to make sense of the world. There is scope for much ambiguity and uncertainty. It can be a lot of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffneck Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Nonsense it won't fall down!! Buildings don't fall down just because they catch fire!! compare images of damage done to building 6 vs damage done to building 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomandlu Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 compare images of damage done to building 6 vs damage done to building 7 Compare brain of conspiracy theorist and brain of politician (this doesn't actually show you anything, but you get to remove two useless brains, so there's that...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RufflesTheGuineaPig Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Your average bonfire burns at perhaps 800-1000 degrees C.. how far away do you need to stand? Thermodynamics doesn't work like that. The amount of energy you would need to put in to heat the steel to softening point is immense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Spaniard Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Compare brain of conspiracy theorist and brain of politician The official narrative for 9/11 is a conspiracy theory - 19 young Arabs conspired ... etc. Almost all politicians publicly support this theory. Most 9/11 sceptics support no particular theory, they simply question the official narrative and point out its contradictions, anomalies, omissions etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nuggets Mahoney Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 The official narrative for 9/11 is a conspiracy theory - 19 young Arabs conspired ... etc. Almost all politicians publicly support this theory. Most 9/11 sceptics support no particular theory, they simply question the official narrative and point out its contradictions, anomalies, omissions etc. People will be inconclusively arguing the toss over the technical minutiae of the WTC collapses for years to come. Scrutiny of the Zapruder film is still going strong four decades after it was made publicly available. Conclusive results so far? Approximately nada Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluffy666 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Most 9/11 sceptics support no particular theory, they simply question the official narrative and point out its contradictions, anomalies, omissions etc. Indeed. Is is very surprising that an unprecedented and (publicly) surprise attack on multiple buildings, with fires, multiple collapses, and thousands of deaths would leave any inconsistencies in the record.. (The above statement is sarcasm, by the way. Try and remember the Tom Clancy novels are in the fiction section) The whole 'questioning the official story (or a preferred version of the official story)' line is classic crankery/denialism. You see it everywhere - from Creationists, global warming deniers, holocaust deniers, abiotic-oil freaks, anti-vax freaks, AIDS deniers, whatever.. It's just especially pronounced with 9/11 CTers because their 'alternative' hypotheses are so obviously and trivially stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corevalue Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Indeed. Is is very surprising that an unprecedented and (publicly) surprise attack on multiple buildings, with fires, multiple collapses, and thousands of deaths would leave any inconsistencies in the record.. (The above statement is sarcasm, by the way. Try and remember the Tom Clancy novels are in the fiction section) The whole 'questioning the official story (or a preferred version of the official story)' line is classic crankery/denialism. You see it everywhere - from Creationists, global warming deniers, holocaust deniers, abiotic-oil freaks, anti-vax freaks, AIDS deniers, whatever.. It's just especially pronounced with 9/11 CTers because their 'alternative' hypotheses are so obviously and trivially stupid. My, you are naive. Your list of comparables at the end there, equating holocaust deniers with those who question the official narrative of that day is quite the nastiest piece of slander I've seen on this site. The official 9/11 Commission's work and report were at best an incomplete exercise. Many people dismiss the findings of the Commission, and that includes its co-chairs [ Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton ] The words of Alan N. Sabrosky, PhD – Former Director of Studies, Strategic Studies Institute and holder of the General of the Army Douglas MacArthur Chair of Research, U.S. Army War College. Go on, tell me he's another crank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Executive Sadman Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 What did they have up on top of there to cause such a fire? Gas bottles? Illegal vodka distilling or beer brewing or something. Probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomandlu Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 equating holocaust deniers with those who question the official narrative of that day is quite the nastiest piece of slander I've seen on this site. I think it's equating the techniques* rather than the underlying beliefs, which seems fair enough. * which basically boil down to "have a gazillion questions and as soon as one is answered, move on to the next, and at no point accept that any question being answered in any way affects the strength of your argument." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBdamo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Indeed. Is is very surprising that an unprecedented and (publicly) surprise attack on multiple buildings, with fires, multiple collapses, and thousands of deaths would leave any inconsistencies in the record.. (The above statement is sarcasm, by the way. Try and remember the Tom Clancy novels are in the fiction section) The whole 'questioning the official story (or a preferred version of the official story)' line is classic crankery/denialism. You see it everywhere - from Creationists, global warming deniers, holocaust deniers, abiotic-oil freaks, anti-vax freaks, AIDS deniers, whatever.. It's just especially pronounced with 9/11 CTers because their 'alternative' hypotheses are so obviously and trivially stupid. Right on script, well done!! Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that response #394 cut-n-paste to a CT thread, it's a very good one, seen it a few times. Are there any official naratives that are not beyond reproach? What about the people who questioned the existance of WMD in Iraq - do they fall in with the Jew haters as well? You really are a tool, in every sense of the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomandlu Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 What about the people who questioned the existance of WMD in Iraq - do they fall in with the Jew haters as well? But WMD is something of an own-goal - a conspiracy so lacking in plausibility that it fell apart even as it was being acted on. They couldn't even get one CIA agent to keep his mouth shut. (of course a TRUE truther would claim that it was made deliberately inept so as to make it seem impossible that 9/11 could have been organised by the same people). BTW what's with the jew hater thing? Is there considered to be a correlation between anti-Semitism and Truthing? Genuinely curious... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBdamo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 BTW what's with the jew hater thing? Is there considered to be a correlation between anti-Semitism and Truthing? Genuinely curious... It's the subtle [sic] inference that Fluffster implies in his list of like-minded conspiriloons, or something along those lines. Given a chance he'd have got paedophile in there somewhere as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomandlu Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It's the subtle [sic] inference that Fluffster implies in his list of like-minded conspiriloons, or something along those lines. Well, he also mentioned anti-vax (sic) freaks. You could always align yourself with those... hmmm, to identify with neo-Nazis or middle-class mums in Islington... hang on, I'm thinking... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newbonic Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Thermodynamics doesn't work like that. The amount of energy you would need to put in to heat the steel to softening point is immense. Writing as a metallurgist who used to work in a rolling mill, I can state that you don't have to put 'immense' amounts of energy into steel to soften it for hot working. It's one of the main reasons why steel is so useful a material, and why it is so extremely popular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19 year mortgage 8itch Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Well, he also mentioned anti-vax freaks. You could always align yourself with those... hmmm, to identify with neo-Nazis or middle-class mums in Islington... hang on, I'm thinking... I've got a dyson but if ever I wanted a hoover cum carpet cleaner then a vax would be on the list. Don't know why they get such bad press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluffy666 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 My, you are naive. Your list of comparables at the end there, equating holocaust deniers with those who question the official narrative of that day is quite the nastiest piece of slander I've seen on this site. That's quite painfully bad logic. 'Murderers use axes. Lumberjacks use axes. Therefore all Murderers are Lumberjacks.' Or: Group X use discredited rhetorical technique A. Group Y use discredited rhetorical technique A. Morons think that this means Group X and Y hold the same beliefs. The words of Alan N. Sabrosky, PhD – Former Director of Studies, Strategic Studies Institute and holder of the General of the Army Douglas MacArthur Chair of Research, U.S. Army War College. Go on, tell me he's another crank. The investigation was incomplete - depends on your definition of 'complete'. Many people reject it - D'Oh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBdamo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Well, he also mentioned anti-vax freaks. You could always align yourself with those... hmmm, to identify with neo-Nazis or middle-class mums in Islington... hang on, I'm thinking... Sorry, if you don't accept the official narrative then it matters not that you're from Islington, a mum or middle class - you hate jews. It does however get really wierd if you are a Jewish middle class mum from Islington, surely you can't be a Jew hater then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluffy666 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Right on script, well done!! Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that response #394 cut-n-paste to a CT thread, it's a very good one, seen it a few times. It needs repeating. There are people who are extremely slow on the uptake. Are there any official naratives that are not beyond reproach? All historical narratives are provisional. Some are more provisional than others. What about the people who questioned the existance of WMD in Iraq - do they fall in with the Jew haters as well? You really are a tool, in every sense of the word. Let's hope your life never depends on the ability to use formal logic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okaycuckoo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Haven't read the whole thread. Did it fall down? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluffy666 Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Haven't read the whole thread. Did it fall down? No. (and that's a good thing..) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RufflesTheGuineaPig Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 Writing as a metallurgist who used to work in a rolling mill, I can state that you don't have to put 'immense' amounts of energy into steel to soften it for hot working. It's one of the main reasons why steel is so useful a material, and why it is so extremely popular. No you would put a lot of heat into a very small area. My point is still valid, a building fire wouldn't concentrate the heat in a small enough area fast enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GBdamo Posted April 3, 2012 Share Posted April 3, 2012 It needs repeating. There are people who are extremely slow on the uptake. Worrying ins't it? All historical narratives are provisional. Some are more provisional than others. So questioning them is not unreasonable? Let's hope your life never depends on the ability to use formal logic. Two people saw right through your 'smeer by association' trick, so don't start spouting about logic, logic has got nothing to do with it. Let's look at it again.. The whole 'questioning the official story (or a preferred version of the official story)' line is classic crankery/denialism. You see it everywhere - from Creationists, global warming deniers, holocaust deniers, abiotic-oil freaks, anti-vax freaks, AIDS deniers, whatever.. It's just especially pronounced with 9/11 CTers because their 'alternative' hypotheses are so obviously and trivially stupid. What is IT that all these groups share? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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