6538 Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 I can't get my head around how this works. Guy was convicted in Turkey and was shipped back to serve his sentence here. How then can this Country pardon him? Surely, his conviction still stands in Turkey so what happens when Turkey joins the EU (which hopefully they never will) and gets to use the EU arrest warrant system? What happens if he ever gets asked "have you ever been convicted of an offence anywhere in the world?". If Turkey had pardoned him then he could answer "no", but they haven't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loginandtonic Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 I can't get my head around how this works. Guy was convicted in Turkey and was shipped back to serve his sentence here. How then can this Country pardon him? Surely, his conviction still stands in Turkey so what happens when Turkey joins the EU (which hopefully they never will) and gets to use the EU arrest warrant system?What happens if he ever gets asked "have you ever been convicted of an offence anywhere in the world?". If Turkey had pardoned him then he could answer "no", but they haven't. good question, i dont know this case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19 year mortgage 8itch Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Are you referring to Michael Shields and Bulgaria or Turkey and some other bloke I don't know about? Isn't Bulgaria already within Europe? of sorts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6538 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Share Posted September 10, 2009 Are you referring to Michael Shields and Bulgaria or Turkey and some other bloke I don't know about?Isn't Bulgaria already within Europe? of sorts? That's the guy. I thought he was convicted in Turkey though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6538 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Share Posted September 10, 2009 Right, checked it - it's Bulgaria. However, how can we pardon him for a conviction obtained in a different jurisdiction? Surely he still stands convicted in Bulgaria? Secondly, since when do people get pardoned on the basis of an alleged verbal confession the existence of which has come via their own family? This all seems very strange and bizzare to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 That's the guy. I thought he was convicted in Turkey though. Definitely Bulgaria Michael Shields Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daft Boy Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Right, checked it - it's Bulgaria. However, how can we pardon him for a conviction obtained in a different jurisdiction? Surely he still stands convicted in Bulgaria?Secondly, since when do people get pardoned on the basis of an alleged verbal confession the existence of which has come via their own family? This all seems very strange and bizzare to me. Yes, its Bulgaria. Varna actually. The Jail in Varna is very basic I can assure you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankief Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Is Labour looking for more votes in Liverpool or something? Apparently, Jack Straw met with the family and they told him some new evidence. He won't say what that evidence is. He won't put the evidence before a court, why bother with the old scales of justice? Shields recommended for royal pardon. Backslapping and cheers all round, let's hope Shields can also claim lots of compensation. Meanwhile the Bulgarian waiter remains brain damaged from the effects of a concrete slab dropped on his head. No mention of this. I can't help thinking that this sort of circus won't help any UK citizen much in the future, should they be arrested in Bulgaria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saver Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Right, checked it - it's Bulgaria. However, how can we pardon him for a conviction obtained in a different jurisdiction? Surely he still stands convicted in Bulgaria?Secondly, since when do people get pardoned on the basis of an alleged verbal confession the existence of which has come via their own family? This all seems very strange and bizzare to me. Yes it is odd: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conviction_of_Michael_Shields Sounds like there are many eye witnesses who saw him do it, and the confession by someone else was withdrawn (and anyway they said they used a different weapon to that actually used). Even if he didnt try to kill him, it does appear at the very least he was involved in the attack with others, so he is not some innocent bystander being locked up for years. According to wikipeadia anyway. The observer appears to claim otherwise: http://www.guardian.co.uk/theobserver/2007...ures.magazine37 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ayatollah Buggeri Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 I'd bet anyone a G & T that the same thing will happen in the case of the woman who tried to smuggle heroin out of Laos last year. There was probably a deal done with the Laotians involving international aid payments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Pint Princess 2 Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Are you referring to Michael Shields and Bulgaria or Turkey and some other bloke I don't know about?Isn't Bulgaria already within Europe? of sorts? Some papers had the online lead as Turkey and the story as Bulgaria, not sure why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Concrete Jungle Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Yes I am sure an 18 year old lad on holiday with his mates, was safely tucked up in bed with a cup of cocoa by 10.30pm the night the football team he supported won the champions league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankief Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Some papers had the online lead as Turkey and the story as Bulgaria, not sure why. They were on their way back from Istanbul, Turkey where Liverpool had just won the Champions League Cup. They were celebrating! Thank God they were in a good mood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boomer! Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Some other bloke has admited doing it ages ago Its been a f*ckin farce, why the peasant Bulgarian pricks wanted a scape goat is beyond me. Deliberately prosecuting the wrong man just to get a result is deliberately letting off the right man. and anyway Bulgaria is the holiday destination of chavs and tight tw@ts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6538 Posted September 10, 2009 Author Share Posted September 10, 2009 Is Labour looking for more votes in Liverpool or something?Apparently, Jack Straw met with the family and they told him some new evidence. He won't say what that evidence is. He won't put the evidence before a court, why bother with the old scales of justice? Shields recommended for royal pardon. Backslapping and cheers all round, let's hope Shields can also claim lots of compensation. Meanwhile the Bulgarian waiter remains brain damaged from the effects of a concrete slab dropped on his head. No mention of this. I can't help thinking that this sort of circus won't help any UK citizen much in the future, should they be arrested in Bulgaria. This did occur, to be honest. Liverpudlians seem to be irrationally sensitive on these matters so one wonders if this is a buttering-up job for a close election? Still doesn't answer my question though. How on Earth can the UK pardon someone convicted in another Country? Surely he still stands convicted in Bulgaria? I mean this is a Royal pardon and the Queen doesn't reign over Bulgaria, as far as I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cogs Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 Yes I am sure an 18 year old lad on holiday with his mates, was safely tucked up in bed with a cup of cocoa by 10.30pm the night the football team he supported won the champions league. I see you have the same standards as the Bulgarian police. It wasn't the night they won and it was 3am he was in by (the crime occured at 5.30am), not 10.30pm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1929crash Posted September 10, 2009 Share Posted September 10, 2009 I see you have the same standards as the Bulgarian police.It wasn't the night they won and it was 3am he was in by (the crime occured at 5.30am), not 10.30pm. Well said. I hope these posters never have to find out about the dubiousness of much of the world's legal proceedings the hard way. Bulgaria, remember, was a communist country for many years and has a culture of locking up innocent people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Uttley Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Still doesn't answer my question though. How on Earth can the UK pardon someone convicted in another Country? Surely he still stands convicted in Bulgaria? The Home Secretary can issue a pardon, but he cannot overturn the conviction of the Bulgarian court anymore than he can overturn the brain damage caused to Mr Georgiev. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnus Alpha Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Has Jack Straw released any more violent Scouse convicted criminals today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boomer! Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Has Jack Straw released any more violent Scouse convicted criminals today? No he hasnt released any ever. Stop being such a turd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mildura Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Has Jack Straw released any more violent Scouse convicted criminals today? Why let the facts get in the way, eh?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnus Alpha Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 No he hasnt released any ever. Stop being such a turd He released one earlier in the week. Read the papers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cygnus Alpha Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Why let the facts get in the way, eh?? Facts are he is scouse, a convicted criminal, violent and he was released by Straw. Next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goat Posted September 11, 2009 Share Posted September 11, 2009 Facts are he is scouse, a convicted criminal, violent and he was released by Straw.Next. Are you trolling for the tw@t of the day award? If so, congratulations, you've won it! Edt: for ****** sakes, I can't even call someone a twit without it changing the a! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6538 Posted September 11, 2009 Author Share Posted September 11, 2009 The Home Secretary can issue a pardon, but he cannot overturn the conviction of the Bulgarian court anymore than he can overturn the brain damage caused to Mr Georgiev. That doesn't make sense...it's a logical absurdity. How can the UK issue a pardon in a case like this? The pardon cannot possibly have any legal effect. A pardon effectively means that you no longer stand convicted yet he clearly is still a convicted person as far as Bulgaria goes. If a UK "pardon" doesn't overturn a foreign conviction it is not pardon at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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