needle

Ehh..you dont actually pay stamp duty on less than £250k

Read your contract.

This works both ways. You only have "notional" mortgage equity to withdraw. The house is used to secure a debt. Until you sell the house the ability to repay is not realised. Similarily negative equity is a state of mind. If you are living in a house with no intention of moving then the value of the house is irrelevant. Whether or not you remortgaged is immaterial - if you can keep up the payments then it doesnt matter what the "value" of the house is. Some of the "north korean" types on this site would have you believe that a HPC can happen in isolation from the rest of the economy - it cant and it wont. These people think that they can buy into the market at lower prices once a HPC occurs. This is naive beyond belief and it also shows that they too have nothing but the market in mind. These things are states of mind, points of view. The market got out of hand because people perceived it to be something it wasnt and everyone suffered. The same will happen on the way down. I see no benefit to a HPC for FTBs/LLs/BTLs there was none the last time. But...maybe the uber-bears think "its different this time".

More valuable, coherent contributions from CIUW and zzg. You should be a spokesman for this site. People would start to take us seriously then. Imagine a journalist coming on here to get a snapshot of opinion and sees this sh*te. This muppet is a wet dream for The Torygraph and The Mail. Keep it up comrades the revolution is (nearly) here. See this right here is the problem. People viewing their homes as an "asset" in the financial sense is what started all this nonsense. zzg ranted about houses being a commodity on another thread - then raged against those who beat him to it. Its either a commodity/asset for trading or its not - I'd like to hear your opinion on this. I see this arguement as contradicting itself. Finally some sense. The problem I see here ABB is that as well as reducing speculation, the costs may be pushed on to tenants. I would see this as a tax on the mobility of labour - what you think?

Welcome to the Board Hopeful FTB. Prices going down in Brighton, you say? What a Bummer.

Buy some itching soap or blackening soap and leave it in the bathroom. You'll soon find out who is using your stuff.

Home ownership is traditionally associated with poverty. Pre-1990 the countries with the highest private home ownership in europe were Spain, portgual and ireland. Why? Because the government could not afford to build social housing so people had to buy houses. In the rich countries people were happy to rent (germany, nordics, switzerland, etc..) What your seeing is not really a HPC or a credit crunch but a gradual readjustment of the economy to the "european model". I have no opinion as to whether this is a good or a bad thing, but people should realise that this is what is happening. Please dont post that the german economy is not doing well because people dont own houses. The german economy is not doing well because (1) East germany 42k sq miles, population 20million has been successfully integrated and modernised in less than 20 years and (2) the employment laws are too strong. (If anyone thinks that britain could take a country of 15million people and modernise it in less than 20 years without entering a major recession - then feel free to post about it......and we'll just laugh at you)

This is a good thing surely? Ireland introduced a plastic bag tax recently and the volume of these eyesores ultimately blowing down the streets fell by 90%. There is another thing you have overlooked - this applies to cars too. I suggest that the clever amongst us realise that "where theres muck, theres brass". Recycling is about to become big business.

I just got told that I should NOT buy my house. "The house is TERRIBLE value for money, and you will probably regret buying it as soon as you move in." Then I got told (with the same figures) not to sell it. "The house will almost certainly go up in value over the years. Don't Sell yet!" How about one that says "Should you entrust your future to a javascript app"?

Nice to have another moderate bear esp one with life experience. welcome to the board Old Houses

Have any bulls been given this status - or are we doing a "channel 4"? Just asking in the interests of fair play.....

Maybe I'm thick, but if Prices fall and Rates increase (on anything - not just house prices) surely there is no real reduction in costs to the purchaser? Over simplified example - I can buy a £200k house and pay £1100 per month or buy the same house for £150k and pay £1100 per month - wheres the gain? My grasp of economics is limited...so type slowly

@Catch22 Yes, you are correct most of the posts are reasonable on "my" thread but there are other threads where the lunatics have taken over the asylum. Here are some small exapmles from my thread "Hit the nail on the head! This sort of "I had to work for years to bla bla" attitude really annoys me when it comes to houses. A house is a basic human requirement." I agree but people dont have the right to own a home. The remarks about crime and "you should emigrate - we're all doomed" are a tad over the top. I think there is a feeling that some people have lost the run of themselves on the boards. Thanks for the feedback though.

Hmmm dont know who you suspect - hope its not me. Shes right though - one set of stolen rims does not make a crimewave. I would have thought Sale to be a reasonable area - if not a little dull - but crime ridden? Not so sure.

Bubb, You seem to know about these things so can you tell me if my rudimentary economics holds up - If oil continues to rise, inflation will begin to increase. As inflation increases, debt gets eroded quicker (for those who own a proprerty, for example). But house purchases decline as interest rates increase to "cover" inflation. If this holds true, surely being a property owner is more secure than not being one?

Sorry cant find the link. It was actually on BBC World Service. Outlined the situation in USA. Spoke to EA from San Fransisco, the guy who wrote "bubbles and how to survive them" and a guy from "Freddie Mac" a wall street mortgage broker (or something). The consensus - from all of them - was that the market would fall, but only locally and not for 2 years. Was surprised. If you can help find the link on the BBC would be grateful....

Write to John Snow, the C4 news anchor. He's a good journo, takes an even approach to most issues. Of course if he were to surf over here and see some of the more extreme posts from the uber-bears he might conclude that this forum is as biased as the C4 site in many respects.

Succinct.

Isn't he the guy who picked a peck of pickled pepper... Or did he shell shea shells on the shea shore.......doh! Dammit!

I thought it a little bit suss too. Notice the raft of people who joined in mid August 2004 with between 2500-3500 posts. Bulls and bears. Wonder if its all some social experiment - its a great way to get market information, no? Set up a website and let the insiders, outsiders and VIs bicker. In the meantime, use the information to alter your portfolio, finish your thesis on "The Internets effect on the Housing Market" or just phish for info..... I have raised suspicions before that some of the bulls are "staff" generating traffic. But you could say the same now about the bears, I suppose.....

Its cheaper to buy 8 cans of beer in my local off licence than to buy 4!!??!!

I saw a lone magpie yesterday. 1 for sorrow, 2 for joy....... We're all doomed I tell ya.

This is what I dont get. A credit crunch will effect everyone - especially FTBs who perhaps do not have a long credit history and are a higher risk. It does not serve their ends either. As an aside, I think the renting rooms thing has to do with a tax credit introduced in the last couple of years.

Amen to that. Some people on here are doing more harm than good - but maybe thats the point.

As someone mentioned electronics are falling. There are good deals to be had on cars too (if you can afford the petrol!) The price of clothes and shoes has fallen dractically too. Food prices are right down - my local tesco is selling all of the above at prices that would make your eyes water.