A.steve Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 The good news is that having bought at this stage in the cycle the unfortunate couple are unlikely to be forced into poverty for long before they default and are repossessed. The good news is that with a high LTV, they stand to loose little capital, and therefore they will be in little worse position in a few months' time. The people I feel really sorry for are those putting down 40% deposits who've been bid up by mortgages offered to those who can clearly not afford them. There are a lot of people who won't loose their houses - and these people will suffer the greatest setbacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qetesuesi Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I THINK ALL MAIN BILLS LIKE COUNCIL TAX , FOOD WERE INCLUDED BUT ITS STILL NO WAY TO LIVE. THEY HAVE OBVIOUSLY NO HOPE OF EVER HAVING KIDS I GUESS.HOW MANY PEOPLE ACCROSS THE UK ARE IN THIS BOAT NOW I WONDER ? The chilling, near-apocalyptic question. As I've posted elsewhere, it is NuLab's greatest crime in respect of the whole HPInsanity. If in any way intended, it amounts to slow genocide! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 (edited) The chilling, near-apocalyptic question. As I've posted elsewhere, it is NuLab's greatest crime in respect of the whole HPInsanity. If in any way intended, it amounts to slow genocide! Those who are having children are those who have fallen off the bottom end of the ladder and depend upon social security for all their needs. They are unaffected by HPI, and their vote can be bought relatively cheaply. Cunning plan, if you think about it. Edited November 7, 2007 by A.steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 It's not just "How many people are in this boat?", but how many people are desperately trying to hold on to their homes, putting more debt on credit cards, running down savings, etc. And now here's Christmas! Watch all the keys being handed/taken back in the new year! Yes -- it is an unmitigated disaster..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ayatollah Buggeri Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I'd have more sympathy for characters like this if they hadn't spent the years when things were (apparently, to them) going in their favour acting in a condescending way towards me; criticising me for being a 'chicken' (the exact word of a former colleague whose salary was about half mine) for not climbing onto the ladder by the tips of my fingers and a 7x salary mortgage and making fun of my older, self-maintained car, only one holiday a year and all the other economies I've made in order to try and save for a future in which I won't be reliant on the state. For that reason I won't be shedding too many tears when reality bites the bums of some of these people. But unlike them, neither will I be rubbing their noses in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nelly Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 It is sad. Tell me, do you not worry that if house prices tank severely that you'll get filthy looks and some attitude? Yes Im absolutely petrified I might get a dirty look..............................KINELL! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garry AKA Pod Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 She's having to use washing up liquid to wash her hair? Tell her to stop being a snob, and start shopping at Netto, Aldi and Lidl. You can get shower gel for 29p, shampoo for about 59p and conditioner about 79p. Or she can get a litre bottle of washing up liquid for 17p and can wash the dishes and her hair with it. I too have little sympathy for those that haven't engaged 1st gear when thinking about buying the most expensive item in their lives. Do we blame shops for selling knives that are used to murder people? No Should we blame banks for selling loans and mortgages to thick people? No Don't get me wrong, banks are scum, but to lay the blame for all of this at their doorstep is bo**ocks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Skint Academic Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 (edited) I think it's part of the British psyche I'm afraid. Mr Academic and I had this conversation last night. We were talking about how even though we missed out on this bubble entirely, it's been very useful to watch it over its entire lifecycle. There's always a bubble forming on the horizon in the UK or the US but you don't really hear of them in Germany. We decided it was because the Germans value people that can produce things, such as engineers and scientists, rather than people who can speculate and get rich off the backs of others. We've now got to the fun part of the bubble where we can enjoy being free Edited November 7, 2007 by Skint Academic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ukdaasfan Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I THINK ALL MAIN BILLS LIKE COUNCIL TAX , FOOD WERE INCLUDED BUT ITS STILL NO WAY TO LIVE. THEY HAVE OBVIOUSLY NO HOPE OF EVER HAVING KIDS I GUESS.HOW MANY PEOPLE ACCROSS THE UK ARE IN THIS BOAT NOW I WONDER ? Thats a good thing. We don;'t want more thick people filling up the world with thick little children with the IQ od a space hopper. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sikejsudjek Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 One of the problems is the lack of any politicisation of the young. When I teach teenagers, any sarcastic comments I make about politics go completely over their heads. Most seem to believe anything they are 'told'. Few realise that almost everything Govt's say to them is either spin or downright lies. With the collapse of the left, both political parties are just vehicles for rich vested interest groups. As long as apathy is maintained in the majority of the population, politics is a done deal for the VI's. Funny isn't it how restrictions on bank lending to sensible levels is NEVER seen as an option by both political parties - even though it would stop the massive social problems this unsustainable speculative boom in property has caused. Oh no - don't restrict the banks, they are in the private sector, until of course they run into trouble then its the good old UK taxpayer who has to foot the bill. Both main political parties are paid lackeys of the banks and will not do anything to stop this mess happening again. It doesn't surprise me that so many young people have been sucked into the bubble. Very few people seem to understand that there is a difference between owning a property outright and being a lifelong slave to the bank. 'I want to own my own property' seems to have been substituted for 'I want to owe lots of money for decades and risk being homeless at any time I can't meet the payments, plus risk negative equity and the inability to move house in the future'. Debt does not equate to wealth - but in Gordon's miracle economy somehow they managed to trick large numbers of people into believing it. Now comes a reality check that will be very painful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orbital Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I had a conversation about a year with a girl in the office (on another floor to me) so? You can have a conversation with me and Ill tell you I bought last year and not struggling at all. The question is, how many of each group are there and at want point is it significant? You'll find that there will alway be some who make stupid decisions in any economic climate. The repossesion rate had never been zero! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedict Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 The people I feel really sorry for are those putting down 40% deposits who've been bid up by mortgages offered to those who can clearly not afford them. There are a lot of people who won't loose their houses - and these people will suffer the greatest setbacks. How many people manage to rustle up 40% of deposit without most of that money coming from their past housing profits though, that's quite a lot . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eric pebble Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 One of the problems is the lack of any politicisation of the young. When I teach teenagers, any sarcastic comments I make about politics go completely over their heads. Most seem to believe anything they are 'told'. Deliberate brainwashing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedict Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 In a low inflation environment that loan lingers. In fairness RPI has been about 4% though so over a 25 year period that 20% goes down to about 7.5%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedict Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Deliberate brainwashing... Or maybe just that most young people are stupid, self involved and so obsessed with sex and the minutiae of their current social fads that they're not interested in politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A.steve Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 How many people manage to rustle up 40% of deposit without most of that money coming from their past housing profits though, that's quite a lot . . . I can; my close friends who want to buy have 40% at today's prices; my friends who have already bought put down 30% and have almost certainly paid off at least another 20% since. My problem with buying in today's market is neither finding the deposit, nor is it servicing the debt at mortgage rates of, say, 10%. My worry capital repayment... I don't want to waste my life-savings on a transitory dwelling that can't be re-sold for a fraction of the price I paid... the sort of property in which I'd like to live for the rest of my life seems frustratingly just-out-of-reach, and has done since 2001. BTW - I guess my friends might be the more sensible types - I chose them carefully. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soul Reaver Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 She kept saying "We just MUST hold on to the house, but with all these interest rate rises I don't know what is going to happen". Don't you just love/hate how easy it was to brainwash a whole nation with the illusion of house ownership being the ultimate life aim? And the funny/creepy thing is that NONE of them realize they have been Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lufc Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 "THEY HAVE OBVIOUSLY NO HOPE OF EVER HAVING KIDS I GUESS." This is one of the things that infuriates me whenever I read the propoganda piece "Mortgages to be 9* salary by year 2030" that seems to be printed every other month. If these people actually did the sums they would realise that the poor sods who took out these deals would either never be able to have children or never be able to pay back the capital. Bunch of wonkers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest An Bearin Bui Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Financial pain, especially the self-inflicted kind is a great teacher That's definitely true : people can tell you and tell you but if you make the mistake yourself then you'll never forget it. Unfortunately the kinds of mistakes these people are making at their age could affect them for the rest of their lives. 28 isn't all that young when you are signed up to a 40 year mortgage for a huge sum that is 10 times your income. It's not like in 1989 when people had negative equity of maybe 50k at most. The psychological inflation caused by HPI has been immense - they no longer know the value of £1000. You hear people who earn 22k talking glibly about flats priced at 220k+ as being just average. I hear this all the time from people in my age-group: oh well, if that's what I have to pay / do / work on / accept, then that's just the way it is. Younger people are digging themselves into a massive hole of lifelong debt and yet they're more concerned with resolving the "debt crisis" in Africa than they are in resolving their own debt crisis ("Bob Geldof and Bono said it's terrible in Africa because people are poor because their govts owe money to us racist people in the West!!! Let's go on a protest march!!). They have no idea that their own governments are digging them into an equally huge debt prison and they're obligingly getting themselves into huge mortgage and student debt to help the whole project along. The problem is that so many people are now used to HPI that 300k seems like peanuts to them because that's what you pay for a 2-bed flat in many parts of the UK. In reality, when most people are earning between 15k-35k, then 300k is still an awful lot of money but easy credit has blinded people to this. The fall-out could last for decades (unless there's serious inflation to wipe out people's debts). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huw Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 She's having to use washing up liquid to wash her hair?Tell her to stop being a snob, and start shopping at Netto, Aldi and Lidl. [snip] Do we blame shops for selling knives that are used to murder people? No Actually we do, if the people involved are under-age. Unfortunately, there's a lot of 'financially-underage' people around... (Agree with what you say about Lidl etc). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tenant447 Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 (edited) The problem is that so many people are now used to HPI that 300k seems like peanuts to them because that's what you pay for a 2-bed flat in many parts of the UK. In reality, when most people are earning between 15k-35k, then 300k is still an awful lot of money but easy credit has blinded people to this. The fall-out could last for decades (unless there's serious inflation to wipe out people's debts). "Serious inflation" can happen only if there is a massive increase in the money supply. Since we have 97% privately-issued, debt-based money this entails a corresponding increase in total debt. So, this generation's debt can be paid off only if the next one borrows even more. This inflationary treadmill merely delays the overall debt-servicing problem and ensures that when inevitably it re-emerges it will be even worse. The alternative is for massive amounts of existing debt to be written-off, as is now happening to sub-prime mortgage debt. This entails a corresponding loss of assets to those holding the debt, e.g. your bank or your pension fund or your investment trust. To paraphrase Dickens, you issues your money (or not) and you takes your choice. The slippery slope towards hyperinflation or a huge deflationary recession/bust/depression. edit: Not Dickens, earliest use of the phrase is 1846 issue of Punch Which way will the BoE take us? See: http://www.moneyreformparty.org.uk/ Edited November 7, 2007 by love Mises to pieces Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lets get it right Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 Her own fault for being stupid, end of. If she had done her research before purchasing the biggest expense (by far) of her life like any sane person should then she would have found out about the reality of it all. Not true and not fair. Not everyone is bright and financially savvy. Many are like lambs to the slaughter. Do you think she thought up for herself that she would be priced out. No! Everywhere she turned the telly was full of dipshites like Sarah Beanbag and Kirsty Allslop telling her how property was just going up and up and UP and what a total, withering, tosspot you'd be if you didn't get your nose in the trough. It is because not all people can look after themselves we have laws to protect them from the wolves. Unfortunately, there are no laws to stop morons saying 'people can borrow forever and property will always go up'. There should be, but there aren't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
It is different this time Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 She said (and I could NOT believe this) that after they have payed mortgage and Gas/electric etc she is left with £60 a month for 'luxuries' and her boyfriend about £70 a month. so thats about £130 a month to spend on ..... Did you ask her how they would cope if & when she got pregnant? The combination of greed & stupidity has serious consequences as they will find out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CommonSense Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 "Girl In The Office Struggling To Pay Her Mortgage" er, diddums, my heart it doth bleed, Aw there - there, Oh- how I feel her pain, her anguish only goes to twang the heart strings of my sympathy, oh woe is the poor orchin who ..... etc-etc-blah-blah-whatever Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Objective Developer Posted November 7, 2007 Share Posted November 7, 2007 I THINK ALL MAIN BILLS LIKE COUNCIL TAX , FOOD WERE INCLUDED BUT ITS STILL NO WAY TO LIVE. THEY HAVE OBVIOUSLY NO HOPE OF EVER HAVING KIDS I GUESS.HOW MANY PEOPLE ACCROSS THE UK ARE IN THIS BOAT NOW I WONDER ? Found ‘Caps Lock’ then… Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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