This does not end well

[canbuywontbuy]

2 hours ago, Locke said:

Is £1200 for a room in a 3 bed hmo in Manchester realistic? If yes and she's paying £180k, that's a yield of 24%, which is actually what you need to run a flop house.

The typical yield is 5% or less, which is pretty much bang on the £800 given by her bod in the background.

@spyguy

 

Yeah, I couldn't work it out either.  If someone rented the entire property, it's £800 a month, but if you HMO it, it's £1200 a room? Like, what?! Is she stuffing 5 people into each room? Even if it was 2 people per room, that's £600 each per month when an individual could rent out the entire property for £800? Did she low-ball the entire property rental price to make the "three point six kay" sound more dramatic?

[Locke]

50 minutes ago, Trampa501 said:

Your logic fails at the first hurdle using the figure you give of £600 rent per room pcm. Someone on minimum wage will now be earning close to £400 a week. So even after £150 a week rent, they are left with disposable income. Plus, when they gain promotion to supervisor or take on a second job, or move to a better paid job, things get even better. 

Of course £600 rent may be unrealistic; it is down here in London but wages are (slightly) higher.

Where are you getting £600 pcm from? The figure given by the slumlord is £1200 pcm

That's 70% of a £400 pw take-home.

[Trampa501]

19 minutes ago, Locke said:

Where are you getting £600 pcm from? The figure given by the slumlord is £1200 pcm

That's 70% of a £400 pw take-home.

I'm getting it from the first post in this thread. Did you read it?

Quote

Clearly, this is becoming a trend with young "entrepreneurs" because why start a business or work a normal job when credit is abundant and you can just convert houses to HMO and charge them all £600 pcm for a room in a shared property?

 

[Locke]

28 minutes ago, Trampa501 said:

I'm getting it from the first post in this thread. Did you read it?

 

To be fair, my eyes glazed over when I scrolled down and saw the length of the post, so no.

[burk]

Have called her and that fkn Abi Hookway out on IG several times as they talk utter shite about how easy it is to purchase, change the properties legal status, convert then let. 

Having more than 30 years in construction I can tell you these people don't have a fkn clue. And the fact these properties are probably housing unlimited unknowns from the 3rd world, these people should be tried for treason at some point given the problems this is now causing......

[spyguy]

5 hours ago, Unmoderated said:

Skanky chav hag.

Ticked all the way up to her cumbrella eyebrows:

https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/12312458/filing-history/MzQwODQ5OTM5MGFkaXF6a2N4/document?format=pdf&download=0

Net liabilities of over £300K and a huge amount due within 12 months.

Can't be certain what they're doing with teh properties though. Could be flipping them into an offshore holding company.

Not quite sure how you convert something worth £180K into a bedsit renting for £3,600 a month in only 8 weeks either. I would imagine if the house rents for £800 a room would be not more than £500? Somehow this gets carved into 7 dwellings in 8 weeks?

It seems like this is more a plug for her to sell her 'masterclass' to unwitting morons thinking they can do the same. 

I belive that's essentially how Samuel Leeds operates. Gets his big fat face all over social media and latches onto a handful of people that got lucky as evidence. Proceeds to sell courses instead.....

Fools and their money.........

Olivia Cheyenne Ozery .....

What a name.

What a brassy tart.

 

Find Endole graphs it nicer

https://suite.endole.co.uk/insight/company/12312458-liv-cooke-developments-ltd

In reply to the person who said Samuel Leeds --

Mutual People

Ms Olivia Cheyenne Ozery Winning Wealth Ltd, Liv Cooke Developments Ltd, W1nfluence Limited, and 2 more are mutual companies.

Mr Caan Baybutt Girls Around The World Limited and Boldr Sports Ltd are mutual companies.

Mr Samuel Luke Leeds Winning Wealth Ltd is a mutual company.

Mr Adam Wilson Boldr Sports Ltd is a mutual company.

Russell James Leeds Winning Wealth Ltd is a mutual company.

 

 

[The Angry Capitalist]

6 hours ago, Housepricecrash91 said:

Yeah, HMOs are shit. Seen a lot of them on the outskirts of London where I live. 3 bed family homes turned into 5 or 6 bed HMOs charged out at £900+ per room.

The government probably loves them, as it houses more people and keeps the cheap labour economy going to some degree. You're more likely to work a low paid NHS job if your rent is £900 per month (bills included), instead of £1300 per month for a 1 bed flat above a kebab shop or barbers

There's a lot of them in Plymouth, Devon as I work as a delivery driver so get to notice where they are and how many.

Lived in shared accommodation myself when I was building my business and landlord decided to sell my apartment where I was renting previously.

Any place where this is common for normal people has too many living there.

Can only presume we get an exodus from this if things don't improve.

[spyguy]

From another post on here - 

https://archive.ph/vq1ut

Fake it til you make dont make it.

 

 

[Housepricecrash91]

The figures in the video don't make sense. It would make £800 p/m renting it out to one person? but converting it into a HMO will make £3.6k p/m instead?

Assuming she's turning it from a 3 bed into a 5 bed.... she's basically saying people will pay £700 p/m (probably including some bills) to live with 4 other people... instead of paying £800 to live by themselves. This is for a current 3 bed house, presumably if the house was 2 bed, then the rent for a one person would be even lower than £800.

Am I missing something?

[Unmoderated]

13 minutes ago, Housepricecrash91 said:

The figures in the video don't make sense. It would make £800 p/m renting it out to one person? but converting it into a HMO will make £3.6k p/m instead?

Assuming she's turning it from a 3 bed into a 5 bed.... she's basically saying people will pay £700 p/m (probably including some bills) to live with 4 other people... instead of paying £800 to live by themselves. This is for a current 3 bed house, presumably if the house was 2 bed, then the rent for a one person would be even lower than £800.

Am I missing something?

Nope. I am pretty sure these numbers are pure fallacy. I don't think a studio flat in central Reading would go for much more. Central Reading right by the central station (prime and actually pretty nice these days) can be had for £850. There's ones going for £1600 a month but these are really more like hotel suites with a gym onsite, state of the art evverythinng in them and pretty spacious for a studio. 

Do we know where this place is? She's speaking Manchester-Monkeyish so assume somewhere up north. From out teh window looking at her Chavarari it seems to be a council estate. Surely we can check out what bedsits go for in the area?

One, much nicer, way of making money was to buy a tumbledown place at auction, rennovate it, stick a tenant in there and remortggage 75%. If you've done it right that 75% covers your intiial investment and youve got a proeprty with a revenue stream that you've brought back into use. Then you go back to teh action house with the 75% you've taken out and repeat. 

Not a fan of property hoarding but at least these are borderline unliveable places brought back into use and it's honest work to rennovate and get something back up to modern regs and practicality. 

[Unmoderated]

1 hour ago, The Angry Capitalist said:

There's a lot of them in Plymouth, Devon as I work as a delivery driver so get to notice where they are and how many.

Lived in shared accommodation myself when I was building my business and landlord decided to sell my apartment where I was renting previously.

Any place where this is common for normal people has too many living there.

Can only presume we get an exodus from this if things don't improve.

Former colleague of mine had a lovely big victorian house somewhere and the neighbouring property (semi) got converted into HMO. Went from loving life to living a nightmare. I could only sugggest he applied for the same and flogged it off to a developer and then moved somewhere nice and rural where the economics of HMO wouldn't stack up. 

[The Angry Capitalist]

6 hours ago, Trampa501 said:

Your logic fails at the first hurdle using the figure you give of £600 rent per room pcm. Someone on minimum wage will now be earning close to £400 a week. So even after £150 a week rent, they are left with disposable income. Plus, when they gain promotion to supervisor or take on a second job, or move to a better paid job, things get even better. 

Of course £600 rent may be unrealistic; it is down here in London but wages are (slightly) higher.

Firstly, £600 pcm is about the minimum now depending on where you live.

How much in London, Brighton or York?

Secondly, what is minum wage pay? £1750 per month?

After tax and NI maybe £1400 _ £1450 net pay.

Lastly, most jobs are minimum wage. There are only a small percentage of jobs for managers etc.

I think the median is about £35k and that is heavily skewed by London high earners.

Promotion is not a guarantee and only a few will achieve it.

Furthermore, many highly paid workers are going to be made redundant for what is coming when discretionary spending contracts significantly.

If you have a car or commute to work it leaves you with very little after food and clothing and £600 pcm is your best case scenario.

[Jolly Roger]

HMO tends to be people without much other options, ex cons, alcoholics and I suppose immigrants.  Imagine sharing a kitchen and bathroom with transient strangers, unless you are lucky to get a studio room with an ensuite.

I suppose in Victorian and Edwardian times you had lodgings like you read about in an Orwell book, renting a room off a middle aged landlady who would serve you boiled beef at six in the evening. Making sure you don't bring women into the house. Is that battleaxe situation any worse than sharing with a bunch of Somalis doing Deliveroo at all hours?

 

[Gbob]

I expect it would take more than 8 weeks just to get the planning permission through before they can even start any work.

[Sackboii]

1 hour ago, Gbob said:

I expect it would take more than 8 weeks just to get the planning permission through before they can even start any work.

Not sure how it works, but my recent checks on my in-laws’ former house revealed conversion to a HMO was ‘permitted development’ and it appeared no planning permission was required. Is this the same for all local authorities or does it differ up and down the land ?
 

Besides, I am hearing, anecdotally, of more and more work like this being carried out and then going for whatever permissions are required (if any..) retrospectively !

Edited February 23 by Sackboii

[kingstonexpat]

One near us was up for planning permission to make a former 4 bed family home into a 7 bed HMO about 15 years ago on an estate full of 1980s era 2/3/4 bed houses.  At the time it was a non-licensed 6 bed, not more than 6 person HMO.  The application was quite literally titled "Change of use to House in Multiple Occupation with 7 no. Letting Rooms".  Rejected by council due to noise, lack of parking, detriment to neighbourhood amenity, etc. 

But at some point they went ahead and did it anyway, as I noticed the other week there's was an application last year called "Certificate of Lawfulness (Existing) for use of the property as a 7 bedroom House in Multiple Occupancy (HMO)." Approved by council now despite a number of objections about guess what... noise, lack of parking, rubbish, detriment to neighbourhood amenity, etc. 

So that's 7 households with at least 8 people according to the docs, but could be up to 14 adults living there now?  On a street full of houses lived in by families.  The floor plan contained no measurements so how does the council know it meets minimum requirements for a 2 person room, and who would check anyway if there were 2 people to a room? 

The neighbours complained that their house value has plummetted and they are right.  Who wants to live next door to that?  But this could happen anywhere nowadays, right next door to you in fact.   They've already given HMOs single dwelling council tax bands to make it easier on HMO owners, now all the local councils need to do is start charging more council tax than they would get from a single family house the same size and it's a money maker for them. 

[The Angry Capitalist]

7 hours ago, kingstonexpat said:

One near us was up for planning permission to make a former 4 bed family home into a 7 bed HMO about 15 years ago on an estate full of 1980s era 2/3/4 bed houses.  At the time it was a non-licensed 6 bed, not more than 6 person HMO.  The application was quite literally titled "Change of use to House in Multiple Occupation with 7 no. Letting Rooms".  Rejected by council due to noise, lack of parking, detriment to neighbourhood amenity, etc. 

But at some point they went ahead and did it anyway, as I noticed the other week there's was an application last year called "Certificate of Lawfulness (Existing) for use of the property as a 7 bedroom House in Multiple Occupancy (HMO)." Approved by council now despite a number of objections about guess what... noise, lack of parking, rubbish, detriment to neighbourhood amenity, etc. 

So that's 7 households with at least 8 people according to the docs, but could be up to 14 adults living there now?  On a street full of houses lived in by families.  The floor plan contained no measurements so how does the council know it meets minimum requirements for a 2 person room, and who would check anyway if there were 2 people to a room? 

The neighbours complained that their house value has plummetted and they are right.  Who wants to live next door to that?  But this could happen anywhere nowadays, right next door to you in fact.   They've already given HMOs single dwelling council tax bands to make it easier on HMO owners, now all the local councils need to do is start charging more council tax than they would get from a single family house the same size and it's a money maker for them. 

Yes.

I can see that coming.

Tax per room as opposed to per dwelling/property.

But how many landlords are doing HMO without notifying the council?

Put themselves as tenant and get billed from the council directly and charge £600 pcm + per room from the peasants?

Would be much easier doing that wouldn't it?

Bills are all in for the tenants. Would assume tenants come and go frequently in HMO so avoids the hassle of changing the tenants continuously and notifying the council.

For the official HMO registered properties though it's just easy money for the council so if enough properties get converted in any particular area where the council can increase revenue significantly then it seems inevitable.

However, that will get passed on to the tenants from the landlord so they will be paying even more for their shoe box room for rent.

You see where all this leads?

Right to the bottom where you get mass poverty for all but a few who are lucky enough to own property.

Lower paying jobs for everyone and a currency down the toilet if we stay on the current path.