Venger Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 The property118 thread is so long... Can't describe my fury how the Building Societies and Banks have lent huge sums, for people to overpay for property, who them remortgage/refinance them when they go up further in silly price, to buy again at higher prices still. Some of the most stupidest entitled people to have ever walked the earth have possession of loads of properties, to rent out, to some of the most intelligent people on earth. Just to make it more widely known: IF (and I say that with a tinge of irritation) WBBS carry in with this rise in the wake of us not being successful (but we will!) then we have no option but to sell one of the properties affected, as we just can’t afford to lose what we’re now saving to pay the mortgage off! So WBBS are actually PREVENTING us from paying the capital of this mortgage off! How ironic is that? The only way they’ll then get their money back is by repossessing, though in my view the value will be far short of the value when it was refinanced, so we’ll be in negative equity in effect, and unable to pay off the capital BECAUSE of this hike now (so money-up-front so to speak). What then? (Well I know what happens currently, but WTSHTF economically?)….. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Didn't Vanessa Warwick used to present Headbangers Ball on MTV? She was married to Ricky from The Almighty? Small world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 The property118 thread is so long... Can't describe my fury how the Building Societies and Banks have lent huge sums, for people to overpay for property, who them remortgage/refinance them when they go up further in silly price, to buy again at higher prices still. Some of the most stupidest entitled people to have ever walked the earth have possession of loads of properties, to rent out, to some of the most intelligent people on earth. I think the mistake the idiot landlord makes is that the bank at the front of the repo queue has the highest chance of getting the most money back It does seem a shame that govt is so fearful of upsetting landlords however Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomandlu Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Yes; the very same person from what I recall of forum discussions at the time. I've not got much I want to discuss even with 'good' landlords anyway - it can't be that difficult to be a good landlord. A reasonable POV, but still a shame to have driven her away unless she was outwardly trolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 I think the mistake the idiot landlord makes is that the bank at the front of the repo queue has the highest chance of getting the most money back It does seem a shame that govt is so fearful of upsetting landlords however True, then they've got other fees to apply in repo. Borrower may have equity in other BTL properties to charge it against. Some there have a few with this building society, more with others, and their own homes. I don't see the logic of allowing a zombie to keep possession of one or more BTLs at any point. Then there is the fact most lenders seem to be charging higher rates than these trackers they were on. From what I gather, even after the WB adjusted hike, it's still quite a generous competitive rate they'll find hard to beat with other lenders. Unless perhaps they have 60% LTV. If all BTL lenders were applying a squeeze, then there's loads of new money wanting to come in to buy/borrow for homes at lower prices, and that would make lenders lots of profit. Borrower repays to lender x2-x3 of capital sum borrowed over 25 years. This guy claims he is 'skint' and hasn't the increase only just started. No fall back fund whatsoever to take care of unexpected repairs with the BTL? Voids? He looks like he's in his mid 50s. Because I’m skint and would rather pay the £290 odd extra I shall be due to pay WBBS per month towards the class action fund if necessary plus survive day to day meanwhile instead of letting WBBS have it, I have virtually decided to cancel my DD and insert SO at existing rate. I know WB will trash my credit rating and go for repayment of entire mortgage. I care not. Please would any of you mortgage experts say if there is any other detrimental consequence that will follow my action? Dean I think it was warned WBBS could immediately make me a variable rate payer rather than tracker. I don’t see how but PLEASE are there any other pitfalls I should be aware of? Well I for one hope the lender can force the sale of his own residential home to recover debt/shortfalls/fees applied, which initial search suggests, but isn't absolute, was bought in 2002 and could sell for way over quarter of a million pounds today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) True, then they've got other fees to apply in repo. Borrower may have equity in other BTL properties to charge it against. Some there have a few with this building society, more with others, and their own homes. I don't see the logic of allowing a zombie to keep possession of one or more BTLs at any point. Then there is the fact most lenders seem to be charging higher rates than these trackers they were on. From what I gather, even after the WB adjusted hike, it's still quite a generous competitive rate they'll find hard to beat with other lenders. Unless perhaps they have 60% LTV. If all BTL lenders were applying a squeeze, then there's loads of new money wanting to come in to buy/borrow for homes at lower prices, and that would make lenders lots of profit. Borrower repays to lender x2-x3 of capital sum borrowed over 25 years. This guy claims he is 'skint' and hasn't the increase only just started. No fall back fund whatsoever to take care of unexpected repairs with the BTL? Voids? He looks like he's in his mid 50s. Well I for one hope the lender can force the sale of his own residential home to recover debt/shortfalls/fees applied, which initial search suggests, but isn't absolute, was bought in 2002 and could sell for way over quarter of a million pounds today. Whatever happens, once one lender repossesses I would have thought every other lender would have little choice to repossess in very short order, as there is probably no financial way back for the borrower once the first repo gets underway Edited October 31, 2013 by Si1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Whatever happens, once one lender repossesses I would have thought every other lender would have little choice to repossess in very short order, as there is probably no financial way back for the borrower once the first repo gets underway Would like to see that. The landlord I quoted above (just discovered he only has one BTL, but apparently one with a huge-mortgage) does have some money to fulfil some repair/mainenantce work on his investment property. He's entertaining. Thinking that if he doesn't pay the increase and WB pursues him, a judge would find WB acting out of 'spite'. Just sell it, or your main home. You're working at the thinnest edge. Scrubbing around thinking 12 x £290 is good money to play or survive with to get through another year? That's nothing to what most of us have got saved towards a deposit, for the over-valued housing many such landlords are in possession of + their own homes too. Seems to me he thinks he'll be still in a position of strength, in what might not be the too distant future, when lenders applies for possession. I must take into account my genuine inability to pay the increase. In my case a hefty £290 per month. Inability exacerbated by a promise to my good long term tenants to redec and carry out other work early 2014. This was based on my “business decision” that B of E would not ,increase rate until after 2015 election at earliest. £290 x 12 would have left me with a fair amount of cash to play with therefore during 2014.WBBS have thrown all my plans into turmoil at short notice. If despite my writing to them before continuing to pay at existing rate explaining I shall happily pay in arrears in unlikely event of us losing our case, they go down repossession road I am encouraged by Mark’s post way back about not being frightened by such an approach. “Shall we dance” I think he said. And frankly I don’t care. I could string them along for ages while I sell the property myself at best price. Despite being skint I have sent my cheque to Justin so I am not fainthearted about our case. I repeat again that Justin’s advice about not paying increased rate would influence my decision if he thought that the court would adopt a jaundiced view of our case if any of us did that. I would not wish to damage the team effort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sancho Panza Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 'This was based on my “business decision” that B of E would not ,increase rate until after 2015 election at earliest. £290 x 12 would have left me with a fair amount of cash to play with therefore during 2014.' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybernoid Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) Idiotic scum. It is people like this that have control over where decent people can live, in what conditions, and when they are to be made homeless. What an absurd condition UK housing is in, presided over by utter utter idiot scum having a bit of an ignorant dabble in providing housing for their betters, the result of nothing more than a combination of their birthdate and a willingness to get deeper in debt than the other guy. Housing is too important to be left in the hands of financial illiterates who have done nothing more than be born at the right time. Edited October 31, 2013 by cybernoid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) What an absurd condition UK housing is in, presided over by utter utter idiot scum having a bit of an ignorant dabble in providing housing for their betters, the result of nothing more than a combination of their birthdate and a willingness to get deeper in debt than the other guy. Housing is too important to be left in the hands of financial illiterates who have done nothing more than be born at the right time. The same guy I quoted before can only see future HPI. It's all they ever expect. It's no mystery why they've pushed their way to borrow outrageous mortgage sum, and leveraged again and again to buy more homes. Absolute belief in only ever rising prices + tenants are their pension. Sounds like the guy would struggle with a single month void as well on his jumbo mortgage. Some landlords, mid 30s from piddling media careers where they've been asked to take paycuts, going on to somehow acquire 50+ homes worth £4m. I am knocking on in age and frankly need this whole thing just now like a hole in the head. My wife is joint a/c holder with me and is suffering stress related illness on other accounts. I am shielding her from the WBBS brouhaha entirely. I sadly reiterate that I am skint. and part of my thinking re withholding full payment from WBBS was/is to provide extra funds for the action if required. That is how committed I am to it. I won’t be able to find the money elsewhere.-- Were I to sell the property from financial necessity now I accept that gaining from the class action win would be virtually lost to me. Tough but that's life. Of more concern is the kissing goodbye to the increase in capital value that might accrue in coming years. I'm in a hole and that's the end of it, period. To pay the increased rate demanded by WBBS has to be funded which in short term is a big struggle. Edited October 31, 2013 by Venger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybernoid Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Were I to sell the property from financial necessity now I accept that gaining from the class action win would be virtually lost to me. Tough but that's life. Of more concern is the kissing goodbye to the increase in capital value that might accrue in coming years. I'm in a hole and that's the end of it, period. To pay the increased rate demanded by WBBS has to be funded which in short term is a big struggle. He's in a hole? What about those he feeds on, the poor tenants forced out of the prospect of home ownership by people like him who plainly can't afford to be in so much debt. What about their lack of security of tenure, a lifetime of that is stressful enough. People like this should never have been allowed to be responsible for others housing, they simply aren't up to the job. And yes, "kissing goodbye to the increase in capital value" ! Not only is that assumption interesting but the very wording shows the mindset of such people. Kissing goodbye as though it is already theirs. It is this same mindset that keeps properties on the market for years with asking prices that will never be met... as far as they are concerned its money in the bank! When reality disagrees they interpret that as a problem outside of their domain, like a mortgage drought, or the young 'not working hard enough' etc. This particular circumstance is the first step in many of reality gently tapping these sorts on the shoulder and gently coughing. And they are up in arms already. Just you wait you incompetent entitled clown, its just starting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 And yes, "kissing goodbye to the increase in capital value" ! Not only is that assumption interesting but the very wording shows the mindset of such people. Kissing goodbye as though it is already theirs. It is this same mindset that keeps properties on the market for years with asking prices that will never be met... as far as they are concerned its money in the bank! When reality disagrees they interpret that as a problem outside of their domain, like a mortgage drought, or the young 'not working hard enough' etc.This particular circumstance is the first step in many of reality gently tapping these sorts on the shoulder and gently coughing. And they are up in arms already. Just you wait you incompetent entitled clown, its just starting. And their need to push younger people to HTB2 schemes because 'the market isn't working properly'. Really well made points cybernoid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19 year mortgage 8itch Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 (edited) And yes, "kissing goodbye to the increase in capital value" ! Not only is that assumption interesting but the very wording shows the mindset of such people. Kissing goodbye as though it is already theirs. It is this same mindset that keeps properties on the market for years with asking prices that will never be met... as far as they are concerned its money in the bank! When reality disagrees they interpret that as a problem outside of their domain, like a mortgage drought, or the young 'not working hard enough' etc. The assumption for many seems to be that landlords do no more than act as a conduit for passing the tenant's rent to the bank as their mortgage payment and via the miracle of inflation they get to keep the 2-300% capital gains for no more than setting up a couple of standing orders. Edited October 31, 2013 by 7 Year Itch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tomandlu Posted October 31, 2013 Share Posted October 31, 2013 Just you wait you incompetent entitled clown, its just starting. Schadenfreude is a horrible, brutish attitude that shows a callous and un-empathic disregard for people who, through no fault of their... oh, I can't keep a straight face any more. Go for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brit1234 Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/mortgageshome/article-2486295/Landlords-support-legal-action-West-Bromwich-mortgage-rate-hikes.html?login#readerCommentsCommand-message-field The landlords have set up their own campaigning article against West Brom in today's Daily Mail. From the read they are failing to get enough donations for their legal fees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 http://www.thisismon...d-message-field The landlords have set up their own campaigning article against West Brom in today's Daily Mail. From the read they are failing to get enough donations for their legal fees. Could always put the rent up I suppose Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Knimbies who say No Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 [/b] Could always put the rent up I suppose Indeed. Only 170 of 1000 Lls who expressed an interest in the action have stumped up the £240 to get started (wonder how many applicants the fee was based on?) with more to come depending on what happens, so a 'fighting fund' of £45k, seems like a lot but I guess it doesn't go far once lawyers are involved. The fact that rates are moving from historic lows is the straw that many of these people can't bear says it all really. What sort of business model us that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brit1234 Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 They are giving me a lot of red arrows for my comment on the piece. They seem not to like savers much I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 They are giving me a lot of red arrows for my comment on the piece. They seem not to like savers much I guess. They prefer renters with no savings who live month to month I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venger Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 The fact that rates are moving from historic lows is the straw that many of these people can't bear says it all really. What sort of business model us that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bland Unsight Posted November 3, 2013 Share Posted November 3, 2013 The fact that rates are moving from historic lows is the straw that many of these people can't bear says it all really. What sort of business model us that? "Leverage works both ways shock" news reaches idiots. In other news "House prices only ever go up" claim rejected by Supreme Court.We'll see what we'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blod Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Can't believe these fools. They've had years of historical low rates now they move back to were they originally were and there busines model fails. Just pure greed. WBBS and BOI should act early against these idiots as if they wait they might find it harder to dispose of their "portfolios". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
long time lurking Posted November 4, 2013 Share Posted November 4, 2013 Can't believe these fools. They've had years of historical low rates now they move back to were they originally were and there busines model fails. Just pure greed. WBBS and BOI should act early against these idiots as if they wait they might find it harder to dispose of their "portfolios". HTB 2 is there to help them find a greater fool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dances with sheeple Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si1 Posted November 5, 2013 Share Posted November 5, 2013 Merge with the mortgage express thread? Same issue, lenders will bust you now rather than go bust themselves. Its the new post Bailout Brown reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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