Gordon Bashing

[JustAnotherProle]

This was first seen in 2009, but I do like to reproduce it now and then , just so we don't forget what an unmitigated and incompetent disaster Gordon Brown actually was:

In 2006, an eloquent Gordon Brown, then Chancellor of the Exchequer said that he was "ready to make the decisions for people and to work with other people to make this country the great country it is at all times." A year later he became Prime Minister, and the rest is history. Here is a list of Gordon's worst financial blunders, the screw-ups which have cost us all dearly and left economists, accountants and the rest of us scratching our heads in disbelief. Vote for Gordon's worst gaffe in the e-Poll below or make your own suggestions in the comment box.

1. Taxing dividend payments

Before 1997, dividends issued by UK companies and paid to pension funds were tax-free - that is, the tax could be claimed back via a system of tax credits. Not any more, decided Brown. Tax relief was scrapped, reducing the amount collected by pension funds by around £5 billion a year. Pension funds holding the cash that you, me and almost everyone else in the country plan to use for our retirement have lost around £100 billion over the last 12 years. That's one hell of a stealth tax.

2. Selling our gold

In May 1999 Gordon Brown had a plan to sell some gold. There were two problems with this, which concerned his economic advisers deeply. The price of gold had slumped after a decade of stagnation, but was likely to increase in the proceeding years. Added to this, the announcement of a major sell-off would drive the price down further. Little of this worried Gordon. Experts believe that the poorly timed decision to flog our national treasure has cost us all around £3 billion. Granted, that doesn't seem much nowadays, but more of that later.

3. Tripartite financial regulation

The system of financial regulation dividing powers between the Treasury, the Bank of England and the Financial Services Authority, established by Brown as Chancellor in 2000, missed what amounted to the biggest financial crisis of our lifetime. Whoops. This has led some glass-half-empty commentators to conclude that the system set up by Brown failed and should be replaced. The Commons Treasury Select Committee’s report on the collapse of Northern Rock said that the Financial Services Authority had “systematically failed in its duty” to oversee the troubled bank’s activities. Little did it realise at the time that Northern Rock was the over-leveraged tip of the securitised iceberg.

4. Tax credits

“Gordon Brown claims the tax credits system lifts children out of poverty,” says Simon Blackmore, 38, who was pursued for £6,057 in over-paid tax credits. “Maybe it does, but only to plunge them and their families into debt two years later.” Millions of low-income families have had to pay back the Treasury after receiving too much money in tax credits, putting them under huge financial and emotional strain. Meanwhile, 40 per cent of workers and families who deserved tax credits left billions of pounds unclaimed in the 2008-09 tax year for fear of being chased for the cash later on. Introduced in 1999, reformed in 2000, tax credits have been "a complete disaster zone", according to tax experts.

5. The £10,000 corporation tax threshold

In 2002, Gordon Brown introduced a new tax regime to help small businesses. He announced a new zero per cent rate of corporation tax on profits below £10,000. It was designed to boost the ability of small businesses to grow and prosper. It didn't quite work out this way. It became advantageous for sole traders such as taxi drivers or plumbers to turn themselves into limited companies to take advantage of the new rules. A Treasury Minister later commented that "the Government did not realise how many people would engage in abusive tax avoidance", despite the fact that it was "blindingly obvious" to tax experts "within 5 seconds" of the budget announcement that this would happen. Gordon scrapped the rules a few years later, raising the rate from 0 per cent to 19 per cent when he released how much money was being lost.

6. Abolition of the 10p tax rate

Mr Brown rarely apologises. In fact, he never apologises. But occasionally he acknowledges "mistakes", albeit begrudgingly. Over the abolition of the 10p tax rate in 2007, Mr Brown told Radio 4's Today programme that "we made two mistakes. We didn't cover as well as we should that group of low-paid workers who don't get the working tax credits and we weren't able to help the 60 to 64-year-olds who didn't get the pensioner's tax allowance." Experts use stronger language to describe the Budget of 2007, which was designed to produce positive headlines for the 2p cut in income tax. Accountants calculated that the scrapping of the 10 per cent tax rate, coupled with the increase in the proportion of tax credits withdrawn from higher earners, would leave 1.8 million workers earning between £6,500 and £15,000 paying an effective tax rate of up to 70 per cent.

7. Failing to spot the housing bubble

Gordon Brown said he ended boom and bust, and in those innocent days before the collapse of the global finance system we believed him. In 1997, he outlined his plans. "Stability is necessary for our future economic success", he wisely informed an audience at the CBI. "The British economy of the future must be built not on the shifting sands of boom and bust, but on the bedrock of prudent and wise economic management." The other components of that bedrock including a trillion-pound debt mountain and a decade of unchecked and unparalleled house price inflation presumably slipped his mind. In 2003 a mild-mannered Liberal Democrat MP by the name of Vince Cable dared to question the mantra of "the end of boom and bust". He asked Gordon Brown: "Is it not true that...the growth of the British economy is sustained by consumer spending pinned against record levels of personal debt, which is secured, if at all, against house prices that the Bank of England describes as well above equilibrium level?" Gordon replied: "The Honourable Gentleman has been writing articles in the newspapers, as reflected in his contribution, that spread alarm, without substance, about the state of the economy..." We all know what happened next.

8. 50 per cent tax rate

Robert Chote, director of the Institute for Fiscal Studies, has said the tax hike which heralded the end the new Labour may actually end up losing the Government money. "If you look at what happened when higher rates were last changed in the 1980s, that might lead you to suggest that such a move might actually lose you revenue, rather than gain it, as people actually declare less income for tax," he said.

9. Cutting VAT

"It would be funny if it wasn’t so serious," said a tax accountant when asked about the Brown-Darling brainwave to cut VAT by 2.5 percentage points. As a nation of shoppers, rather than shopkeepers, a chopped down sales tax sounds like a good idea, providing a vital boost to hard-pressed families at a time of financial hardship. There were two problems. It costs £12.5 billion a year and it has made little discernable difference to those hard-pressed families because it is shopkeepers, rather than shoppers, who have pocketed much of the benefit.

10. Public-sector borrowing

If Gordon had only saved a little more in the good times, we might have had a little more to fall back on in the bad, economists sigh. Last month saw public-sector net borrowing hit £19.9 billion, the highest on record, according to the Office for National Statistics. The chancellor of the exchequer, Alistair Darling, has forecast that Government borrowing will reach £175 billion this year. It is forecast that total government debt will double to 79 per cent of GDP by 2013, the highest level since World War 2. Mr Chote recently warned that "the scale of the underlying problem that the Treasury’s detailed forecasts identify will require two full parliaments of mounting austerity to repair.”

Even after he leaves office in 2010, as is almost certain, it seems that we will all be paying for Gordon's gaffes for many years to come. note in 2011:How right they were eh?

[Si1]

Do Re Me Me Me Me Me Me Me.

Change the record mate.

I'm sorry you feel pi$ed off re not being able to afford a nice house. Life is unfair.

Re the bit in bold: Yes, I judge people by their actions. How many politicians uttered a word re spiraling house prices and debt expansion?

Vince Cable and precious few others.

you have a partial point, half the problem was generational, the tories were seeking the same marginal votes as labour at the time, and actually the period out of office was very good for the tory party, and in the end, after 15 years in the wilderness, some of them finally got the plot

with Labour, I'm not sure any of them have ever got it, at any time in their history

[Injin]

you have a partial point, half the problem was generational, the tories were seeking the same marginal votes as labour at the time, and actually the period out of office was very good for the tory party, and in the end, after 15 years in the wilderness, some of them finally got the plot

with Labour, I'm not sure any of them have ever got it, at any time in their history

The problem with "getting the plot" in political terms is that it means "doing what a large number of people want" and this is of course dangerous, because people are generally crack smokingly, meth scoffingly insane when it comes to their political views.

[Tomlad]

Yipeee!

Some people are starting to realise the Tory party aren't the answer to everything!

Next step, the dawning that they are just as bad.

In a few years, you'll all realise they're worse (well, apart from Si1 and top bankers)

[Si1]

Yipeee!

Some people are starting to realise the Tory party aren't the answer to everything!

Next step, the dawning that they are just as bad.

In a few years, you'll all realise they're worse (well, apart from Si1 and top bankers)

the bankers who all got knioghthoods off Gordon Brown?

right you are

[Jadoube]

the bankers who all got knioghthoods off Gordon Brown?

right you are

Bankers don't get out of the dock that easily. They didn't have to accept a knighthood - or to ask for one.

In due course politicians will need to come up with something more than 'a big boy called Gordon did it and ran away' as their excuse for failing at problems they are being paid to sort out today. Especially when people remember that in the process of being elected the same politicians most emphatically claimed that they could and would sort it out quite easily. (And no caveats about it needing two or more parliaments.)

Of course that's politicians for you. None of them, of whatever stripe, ever recognise that actually getting power and responsibility can be a real b*gger.

[Jack's Creation]

Yipeee!

Some people are starting to realise the Tory party aren't the answer to everything!

Next step, the dawning that they are just as bad.

In a few years, you'll all realise they're worse (well, apart from Si1 and top bankers)

Why don't you share with everyone on the board, exactly how Labour are going to make everything better? We're all eager to know.

Another war based on lies? More torture and rendition? ( which a Labour government, that's right a Labour government allowed to happen) Another sterling devaluation? Perhaps they'll put some more cctv cameras up or allow more QE?

I know, they could allow more unscreened mass immigration or fail to plan for Black Swan economic contingencies, or they could trash Habeus Corpus, right to a Jury trial or double jeopardy, in order to support their fake Wars.

Just so you know what you as a Labour supporter and voter are responsible for. Here's a small reminder. (tough sh¡t if you find the images offensive, it is a consequence of the votes you cast)

The labour party post 1997 are Monsters- The people who support them are traitors.

No matter how much you wish to deny it, if you voted for them, you are culpable.

IMAGES REMOVED BY MODERATOR

[PopGun]

we all know theyre more or less the same...

Its just the condescending fairness, equality, we care BS from liebour that I take personally.

At least the tories dont hide the fact theyre out to screw you. I prefer to be looked in the eye while im being stabbed to death.

An interesting way of putting it, but I know what you mean.

[PopGun]

+100000000000

Nail hit squarely on head.

I was just going to +1, but feel a little inadequate now.

[pete.hpc]

Extract from Charlie Brookers latest column;

...Osborne is the naughty boy who's broken the economy.

Didn't take them long did it, though I have to admit even I'm surprised at how soon Labour revisionists assume we will have forgotten.

In fact, his whole column is worth a read for his infantile anti-Tory, class-war guff.

He may even have a point somewhere in there, but I can't get over my anger at how columnists like him sat on their hands during the appalling New Labour years and are now letting their anger explode onto less worthy targets just because it fits in with their particular political opinion.

[PopGun]

Extract from Charlie Brookers latest column;

Didn't take them long did it, though I have to admit even I'm surprised at how soon Labour revisionists assume we will have forgotten.

In fact, his whole column is worth a read for his infantile anti-Tory, class-war guff.

He may even have a point somewhere in there, but I can't get over my anger at how columnists like him sat on their hands during the appalling New Labour years and are now letting their anger explode onto less worthy targets just because it fits in with their particular political opinion.

Does Brian Reedle still write in the Mirror?

[Tomlad]

Why don't you share with everyone on the board, exactly how Labour are going to make everything better? We're all eager to know.

Another war based on lies? More torture and rendition? ( which a Labour government, that's right a Labour government allowed to happen) Another sterling devaluation? Perhaps they'll put some more cctv cameras up or allow more QE?

I know, they could allow more unscreened mass immigration or fail to plan for Black Swan economic contingencies, or they could trash Habeus Corpus, right to a Jury trial or double jeopardy, in order to support their fake Wars.

Just so you know what you as a Labour supporter and voter are responsible for. Here's a small reminder. (tough sh¡t if you find the images offensive, it is a consequence of the votes you cast)

The labour party post 1997 are Monsters- The people who support them are traitors.

No matter how much you wish to deny it, if you voted for them, you are culpable.

Right...so because I suggest the idea that the torys are as bad or worse, I'm a war criminal?

You're pathetic and you do those poor people in your images a great disservice by using them to your own political ends.

I don't recall the Torys being against war? They seem quite happy in Libya.

If anyone is a monster, you are for abusing images of injured children to your own political ends.

Shame on you.

Edit - to remove the pictures.

Edited August 1, 2011 by Tomlad

[Jack's Creation]

Right...so because I suggest the idea that the torys are as bad or worse, I'm a war criminal?

You're pathetic and you do those poor people in your images a great disservice by using them to your own political ends.

I don't recall the Torys being against war? They seem quite happy in Libya.

If anyone is a monster, you are for abusing images of injured children to your own political ends.

Shame on you.

Edit - to remove the pictures.

Don't bother attempting to shame me, won't work - I didn't vote for the people who did this. ( if you voted for Labour and it sounds like you did , then you are partly responsible for the injuries you see in the photos, I'm sorry if you don't like it- but that's the truth; you believed and backed a bunch of lying psychopaths).

Parliament was presented with false information by the Labour party, that's right, the Labour party. The same guys who promised us no more boom and bust and reintroduced Torture as a method of interrogation.

My ends aren't political, they are legal.

I'd like to see Blair, Campbell and Brown stand trial in the Hague.

Now, again- why don't you share with everyone on the board, exactly how Labour are going to make everything better? We're all eager to know. ( and please, try not to use as many logical fallacies in your reply as you did in the last one)

Edited August 1, 2011 by Jack's Creation

[Injin]

Don't bother attempting to shame me, won't work- I didn't vote for the people who did this. ( if you voted for Labour and it sounds like you did , then you are partly responsible for the injuries you see in the photos, I'm sorry if you don't like it- but that's the truth; you believed and backed a bunch of lying psychopaths).

Parliament was presented with false information by the Labour party, that's right, the Labour party. The same guys who promised us no more boom and bust and reintroduced Torture as a method of interrogation.

My ends aren't political, they are legal.

I'd like to see Blair, Campbell and Brown stand trial in the Hague.

Now, again- why don't you share with everyone on the board, exactly how Labour are going to make everything better? We're all eager to know.

I believe his point is that the tories would have done all that - minus the NHS spending etc so it's a worse deal for most people.

And he'd be right if that's his line of attack.

[Jack's Creation]

I believe his point is that the tories would have done all that - minus the NHS spending etc so it's a worse deal for most people.

And he'd be right if that's his line of attack.

He wouldn't be, because they didn't.

Wishful thinking is different from reality.

Edited August 1, 2011 by Jack's Creation

[Tomlad]

Don't bother attempting to shame me, won't work- I didn't vote for the people who did this. ( if you voted for Labour and it sounds like you did , then you are partly responsible for the injuries you see in the photos, I'm sorry if you don't like it- but that's the truth; you believed and backed a bunch of lying psychopaths).

Parliament was presented with false information by the Labour party, that's right, the Labour party. The same guys who promised us no more boom and bust and reintroduced Torture as a method of interrogation.

My ends aren't political, they are legal.

I'd like to see Blair, Campbell and Brown stand trial in the Hague.

Now, again- why don't you share with everyone on the board, exactly how Labour are going to make everything better? We're all eager to know.

If you believe that the Torys wouldn't have done the same or worse, you are very, very naive.

With regard to war, it is ludicrous to suggest that the Torys would not have done the same.

With regard to the economy, we have a chancellor who thought Ireland was an example of a model economy.

The Labour party can't make everything better because the problem is global, and in my opinion a painful reset is needed.

As for my personal politics - I'm a floating voter if anything - though having seen what the current government have done to my School's budget, I don't think I'll be floating over to the Torys anytime soon.

I'm not naive enough to think that labour wouldn't have had to make cuts, but I don't think they would have been quite so brutal.

It will take a long time for me to trust the Lib Dems again, so my choice is limited. In future I will vote for either a smaller party or Labour.

Labour have many, many faults. But I believe the Torys have *slightly* more.

[Si1]

As for my personal politics - I'm a floating voter if anything - though having seen what the current government have done to my School's budget, I don't think I'll be floating over to the Torys anytime soon.

I'm not naive enough to think that labour wouldn't have had to make cuts, but I don't think they would have been quite so brutal.

brutal to your personal wealth in other words

selfish

selfish

selfish

[Tomlad]

brutal to your personal wealth in other words

selfish

selfish

selfish

If wanting decent resources for the children I teach and those in comparable schools makes me selfish, then yes.

Edit to add:

Given that the younger generations have been coompletely shafted, I think the least we can do is offer them a decent education.

Edited August 1, 2011 by Tomlad

[Si1]

If wanting decent resources for the children I teach and those in comparable schools makes me selfish, then yes.

Edit to add:

Given that the younger generations have been coompletely shafted, I think the least we can do is offer them a decent education.

the particular generation that is shafted is the current twentysomethings

do keep up at the back and stop using children as human shields for your own greed

[Tomlad]

the particular generation that is shafted is the current twentysomethings

do keep up at the back and stop using children as human shields for your own greed

Being patronizing doesn't make you right and me wrong.

I am aware of how shafted the 20 somethings are, I am one.

How am I using children as human shields for my own greed?

I am arguing for more money to be spent on childrens education, not on me personally.

Do you really think that 16 year olds aren't just as shafted, if not more?

I'm just locked out of the housing market. The next generation have zero job prospects AND are locked out of the housing market.

It is the teenagers that deserve the most sympathy, even more than 20 somethings.

Are you a 20 something by any chance?

[mranderson66]

I'm just glad that since the Tories got in to power they've withdrawn the troops from Afghanistan and trimmed public spending

Oh wait

Hold on

No, they've signed us up for another war, increased spending and left the top rate of tax alone.

All politicians are equally as bad, get with the messafe folks.

[Si1]

I am aware of how shafted the 20 somethings are, I am one.

How am I using children as human shields for my own greed?

I am arguing for more money to be spent on childrens education, not on me personally.

Do you really think that 16 year olds aren't just as shafted, if not more?

I'm just locked out of the housing market. The next generation have zero job prospects AND are locked out of the housing market.

It is the teenagers that deserve the most sympathy, even more than 20 somethings.

Are you a 20 something by any chance?

someone who is 16 now will likely be seriously entering the jobs market in 2 to 5 years' time, when I anticipate (and hope) the economy will have recovered and rebalanced away from the public sector and banking substantially and job prospects will be better and more varied, and their key working years, roughly around the age of 40, will be in the 2030s, after Gordon Brown's debt is largely paid off, plus they will have sensible house prices during their 20s. There is the risk of spiralling costs of the elderly but I suspect this will be minimised as the democratic balance adjusts and govts attend to the young.

I empathiose with you on the plight of the current 20-somethings who have been given a sh*t sandwich and told to work harder, bearing the brunt for earlier mistakes

Edited August 1, 2011 by Si1

[Milton]

If you believe that the Torys wouldn't have done the same or worse, you are very, very naive......

.....In future I will vote for either a smaller party or Labour.....

If you are telling me that I have to accept that a fictional Conservative Government from 97-2010, would have done exactly the same as Labour did, then I'm telling you

that if you vote Labour at the 2015 election, and they were in power for two terms, then they will make exactly the same policy decisions, as what a Tory Government would do, if they won 2015 election, and were in power for two terms.

Which is utter balls....

You cannot argue a hypothetical.

You cannot use a fictional argument, to support your own prejudice, but not accept the same argument, if it goes against your own prejudice. Either in the past or future tense.

People who do this must watch a lot of Doctor Who

Edited August 1, 2011 by Milton

[mranderson66]

If you are telling me that I have to accept that a fictional Conservative Government from 97-2010, would have done exactly the same as Labour did, then I'm telling you

that if you vote Labour at the 2015 election, then they will do exactly the same as what a Tory Government would have done if they won 2015 election.

Which is utter balls....

You cannot argue a hypothetical.

You cannot use a fictional argument, to support your own prejudice, but not accept the same argument, if it goes against your own prejudice. Either in the past or future tense.

People who do this must watch a lot of Doctor Who

That's it in a nutshell!

[DTMark]

brutal to your personal wealth in other words

selfish

selfish

selfish

But, isn't that what people generally do when they vote?

"Which party will be best for me and my family"

Alternatively expressed as

"Which party will shaft me the least"

Kind of a "tribal" allegiance. Indeed this was what Brown was about - building the tribe, so as to get re-elected.

If the Green Party came out with a manifesto that involved sorting out the environment *and* cutting the taxes for a big enough "tribe" of people, they'd win the election.