The 4 Day Week

[Tonkers]

Instead of a payrise, promised in October, I have negotiated a 4 day week, which began at the start of this year. This represents a 20% payrise pro-rata. Financially, I would have been looking at 8%.

Is this how wage inflation will work?

[jonpo]

yeah why bother working the 40% days!....

[mattyboy1973]

Instead of a payrise, promised in October, I have negotiated a 4 day week, which began at the start of this year. This represents a 20% payrise pro-rata. Financially, I would have been looking at 8%.

Is this how wage inflation will work?

It works out as a 25% rise for the days you work. I'd bite their hand of if my employer offered it - I rather suspect imposed 4 days weeks and a 20% pay cut (or lose your job) will be more common!

[TalkingSense]

Mate of mine just got a straight pay cut announced at his company. Here is his reaction

"....Yep it went just like that! Everyone looked really chuffed especially as we all worked unpaid overtime for the last project to get it out in time. Thanks for that.

I handed in my notice on the spot in front of everyone. The boss took me into a private room to try and talk me round and when we came out everyone had gone home in disgust.

LOL."

An I know as he is in hi-tech he will get another job no problem. So much for deflation. We are heading for stagflation.

[Tonkers]

It works out as a 25% rise for the days you work. I'd bite their hand of if my employer offered it - I rather suspect imposed 4 days weeks and a 20% pay cut (or lose your job) will be more common!

I don't think he did the math!

All the staff would leave if he suggested a pay cut, they are struggling already, at least the dole would get their rent paid.

[interestrateripoff]

It works out as a 25% rise for the days you work. I'd bite their hand of if my employer offered it - I rather suspect imposed 4 days weeks and a 20% pay cut (or lose your job) will be more common!

Yep I would agree this can't be too far off now, just think what that will do to govt tax revenues. Ponzi Brown is just digging himself an even bigger hole that we the people will have to pay to get out of.

[Tonkers]

Yep I would agree this can't be too far off now, just think what that will do to govt tax revenues. Ponzi Brown is just digging himself an even bigger hole that we the people will have to pay to get out of.

If I am going to get low wages I don't want to do skilled and stressful work - I don't see mass paycuts happening.

[pppeter]

Instead of a payrise, promised in October, I have negotiated a 4 day week, which began at the start of this year. This represents a 20% payrise pro-rata. Financially, I would have been looking at 8%.

Is this how wage inflation will work?

There is overcapacity just about everywhere in the economy, globally. Thanks to the huge malinvestments of the last bubble we might be able to work 4 day weeks and still afford everything we could buy before on 5 days. All of us except those who bought houses in the last 4 years for 80% mortgages, that is.

[Venger]

An I know as he is in hi-tech he will get another job no problem. So much for deflation. We are heading for stagflation.

If the staff had any loyalty, they would consider the circumstances the company are facing and consider the offer.

Good luck with walking straight in to a new job for your friend. If the company still has prospects, I'd be hanging back and giving support to it.

You don't see mass pay-cuts happening when demand for near enough everything is plummeting?

[interestrateripoff]

If I am going to get low wages I don't want to do skilled and stressful work - I don't see mass paycuts happening.

So you just see massive job losses then?

Or do you think printing money will work?

I can only see wage cuts or job losses or job losses with wage cuts.

I just can't see how the present wage levels can be sustained on present demand. Tax revenue has already fallen off a cliff and as of yet this govt has done nothing to cut costs.

Why do you think mass paycuts won't happen, what's your reasoning?

[Venger]

There is overcapacity just about everywhere in the economy, globally.

True, and falling demand, due to £$ trillions lost in real-estate/housing, stock market, and the banking sector getting hit hard from bad debts so no longer lending to poor-risks.

Economist Dean Baker doesn't think so. He explains the situation in simple terms: The media, he argues, "are blaming the economic collapse on a 'credit crunch' instead of the more obvious problem that consumers just lost $6 trillion of housing wealth and another $8 trillion of stock wealth."

It's a commonsense argument: much of the economic growth of the Bush era existed on paper only, built on the rise of a massive bubble in real estate values rather than growth in productive industries. When all that ephemeral wealth vaporized -- and with the economy shedding jobs like a dog with dermatitis -- consumers stopped buying, and businesses, anticipating a long slowdown, stopped seeking the loans that they might have otherwise tapped to expand their operations.

Edited January 17, 2009 by friday

[Tiger Woods?]

Instead of a payrise, promised in October, I have negotiated a 4 day week, which began at the start of this year. This represents a 20% payrise pro-rata. Financially, I would have been looking at 8%.

Is this how wage inflation will work?

This can be a dangerous strategy if everyone else is still working 5 day weeks. People will want to speak to you on the day you aren't there...complaints will mount...there will be vexation and bitching behind your back etc.

Have seen it happen to other people who did the same thing.

Then again...who cares, you have a 3 day weekend

[Tonkers]

So you just see massive job losses then?

Or do you think printing money will work?

I can only see wage cuts or job losses or job losses with wage cuts.

I just can't see how the present wage levels can be sustained on present demand. Tax revenue has already fallen off a cliff and as of yet this govt has done nothing to cut costs.

Why do you think mass paycuts won't happen, what's your reasoning?

I will go for massive job losses - can the staff afford the paycut? My reasoning is that at least the dole will get the rent paid. It costs money to go to work. The paycuts should happen at the top end, but will it? The workers should just stay in bed while the country goes to ruin, and the managers are begging for help.

[VeryMeanReversion]

An I know as he is in hi-tech he will get another job no problem. So much for deflation. We are heading for stagflation.

Hi tech companies are laying off hundreds around Cambridge. I moved to a safe company in time before my last company went pop due to VCs cutting off funding (common). Ex-colleagues are saying both the permanent jobs and contract jobs have disappeared in the last 3 months. Only half of the ones I knew have managed to find new jobs in 3 months, some of those are only temporary positions.

Hi tech is just as vulnerable as retail. Many firms are high-risk, being funded by VCs.

Your friend should have checked the current job market before resigning.

VMR.

[911-caused-it-all]

This can be a dangerous strategy if everyone else is still working 5 day weeks. People will want to speak to you on the day you aren't there...complaints will mount...there will be vexation and bitching behind your back etc.

Have seen it happen to other people who did the same thing.

Then again...who cares, you have a 3 day weekend

I'm plucking up the courage to ask the same as I'd gladly take a 20% pay cut in exchange for a 4 day week, as I've just been given a fair amount of cash (100+ months of wages).

The company have made large scale redundacies and have issued minutes from meetings saying that they have discussed listening to people offering to work reduced work hours instead of more redundancies.

I still think that the moment I suggest I can do my job in 4 days a week the management will get arsy, even though I'd be more motivated when I'm there due to the repeated extra days rest - don't care about the bitching from fellow workers I'll just buy them a few beers from time to time, although I was going to suggest a floating either Tuesday or Thursday off to help reduce the work impact.

[Ted]

There is overcapacity just about everywhere in the economy, globally. Thanks to the huge malinvestments of the last bubble we might be able to work 4 day weeks and still afford everything we could buy before on 5 days. All of us except those who bought houses in the last 4 years for 80% mortgages, that is.

Isn't this what we were hoping for 30 or 40 years ago, easier lives?

I mean if house prices had stay low, many people could actually afford to work less and still live comfortably.

[DementedTuna]

One of the world's biggest problems right now is that technology has got to the point where most of us don't need to work.

I mean, really NEED. After food, water, shelter etc. there isn't a great deal of stuff that a human needs to exist on the planet.

It's taken social engineering on a massive scale to fuel consumerism and keep the whole bloated and pointless level of overemployment going.

That particular penny started to drop a long time ago, hence why we have had to overinflate the price of housing (and it's associated debt) as a means to absorb the excess cash.

Ideally, everyone would be employed, and would work 3 days per week, instead of our currently system of "half on the dole, half working themselves to death".

It'd result in a much happier society overall, and free up people's time to enjoy life. Unfortunately greed tends to prevent this, and we live a "WORK WORK WORK MONEY MONEY MONEY" life like mindless little worker drones instead of actually trying to enjoy our brutally short and largely pointless little lives. Speck of dust that briefly catches the light before fading into oblivion...

And on top of that, there is the "breeding like rabbits" problem... but nature will naturally decimate the human population if it get too big. Asia is just a whacking great flu pandemic waiting to happen.

Edited January 17, 2009 by DementedTuna

[rw42]

I still think that the moment I suggest I can do my job in 4 days a week the management will get arsy, even though I'd be more motivated when I'm there due to the repeated extra days rest - don't care about the bitching from fellow workers I'll just buy them a few beers from time to time, although I was going to suggest a floating either Tuesday or Thursday off to help reduce the work impact.

Completely the wrong way to suggest it - it's a cost saving measure. 4 days work for 4 days wages, instead of 5 for 5. Simply the choice is pay you 20% less for you to do 20% less.

[Tonkers]

I'm plucking up the courage to ask the same as I'd gladly take a 20% pay cut in exchange for a 4 day week, as I've just been given a fair amount of cash (100+ months of wages).

The company have made large scale redundacies and have issued minutes from meetings saying that they have discussed listening to people offering to work reduced work hours instead of more redundancies.

I still think that the moment I suggest I can do my job in 4 days a week the management will get arsy, even though I'd be more motivated when I'm there due to the repeated extra days rest - don't care about the bitching from fellow workers I'll just buy them a few beers from time to time, although I was going to suggest a floating either Tuesday or Thursday off to help reduce the work impact.

It is certainly risky, I will see how it works out. I am doing the same amount of work and I am available on the day off for some. In fact on my day off yesterday I was working on something speculative that may improve revenues, but I can explore it without any meddling.

I discussed it with all my colleagues before I went to the MD.

I just had to get a pay rise, when I was looking for another job this year, my low wage was not cool, and I do not think the MD respected someone he was paying badly, in that respect it has been a political move, not a financial one.

The day off has eased my stress levels, and given me time to look after my own concerns some more.

A little later in the year I plan to study on my day off, to qualify in another skill that should help me get work, in another industry if I want.

I do worry about being seen as a part timer though.

What happens if I go back to a 5 day week, am I then forcing his wallet on that raise?

[DabHand]

I'm plucking up the courage to ask the same as I'd gladly take a 20% pay cut in exchange for a 4 day week, as I've just been given a fair amount of cash (100+ months of wages).

Several hundred grand?? Given???

Who by, the executor?

[911-caused-it-all]

Several hundred grand?? Given???

Who by, the executor?

To put it bluntly!

Edited January 17, 2009 by 911-caused-it-all

[barrabus]

One of the world's biggest problems right now is that technology has got to the point where most of us don't need to work.

I mean, really NEED. After food, water, shelter etc. there isn't a great deal of stuff that a human needs to exist on the planet.

It's taken social engineering on a massive scale to fuel consumerism and keep the whole bloated and pointless level of overemployment going.

That particular penny started to drop a long time ago, hence why we have had to overinflate the price of housing (and it's associated debt) as a means to absorb the excess cash.

Ideally, everyone would be employed, and would work 3 days per week, instead of our currently system of "half on the dole, half working themselves to death".

It'd result in a much happier society overall, and free up people's time to enjoy life. Unfortunately greed tends to prevent this, and we live a "WORK WORK WORK MONEY MONEY MONEY" life like mindless little worker drones instead of actually trying to enjoy our brutally short and largely pointless little lives. Speck of dust that briefly catches the light before fading into oblivion...

And on top of that, there is the "breeding like rabbits" problem... but nature will naturally decimate the human population if it get too big. Asia is just a whacking great flu pandemic waiting to happen.

Do we have food security? if we do, we can all be hippys life would be good

[911-caused-it-all]

It is certainly risky, I will see how it works out. I am doing the same amount of work and I am available on the day off for some. In fact on my day off yesterday I was working on something speculative that may improve revenues, but I can explore it without any meddling.

I discussed it with all my colleagues before I went to the MD.

I just had to get a pay rise, when I was looking for another job this year, my low wage was not cool, and I do not think the MD respected someone he was paying badly, in that respect it has been a political move, not a financial one.

The day off has eased my stress levels, and given me time to look after my own concerns some more.

A little later in the year I plan to study on my day off, to qualify in another skill that should help me get work, in another industry if I want.

I do worry about being seen as a part timer though.

What happens if I go back to a 5 day week, am I then forcing his wallet on that raise?

Perhaps I should suggest then that I make myself available on the day off in times of need, even swaping it for time in leui rather than suggest I can do my job in 4 days instead of 5 no sweat and that they'd be saving money withought for-going any productivity. Mentioning studying in the day off might also be a good play. It'll be interesting to hear their response.

Edited January 17, 2009 by 911-caused-it-all

[rw42]

Perhaps I should suggest then that I make myself available on the day off in times of need, even swaping it for time in leui rather than suggest I can do my job in 4 days instead of 5 no sweat and that they'd be saving money withought for-going any productivity. Mentioning studying in the day off might also be a good play. It'll be interesting to hear their response.

Will the studying benefit your employer or make you more employable to someone else?

Making yourself available on day off in any way is a bad idea IMO, you'll end up working 4 days at work and 1 day at home for 4 days pay. Any suggestion that they won't lose productivity would mean to me that either you're not working 100% at the moment, or that you're willing to in effect work unpaid overtime at home.

[911-caused-it-all]

Will the studying benefit your employer or make you more employable to someone else?

Making yourself available on day off in any way is a bad idea IMO, you'll end up working 4 days at work and 1 day at home for 4 days pay. Any suggestion that they won't lose productivity would mean to me that either you're not working 100% at the moment, or that you're willing to in effect work unpaid overtime at home.

The studying would benefit my employer but they would be concerned that it may make me move for better pay etc. I can do my job at the moment standing on my head in 4 days, in fact I spend about 3 hours a day reading this forum and other generally financial websites, I'd just need to cut down on that a little! To be honest I am well over qualified + have too much experience for my position so I make take a chance and put that to them as why I can do my job in less time + they'll be saving money. I should be paid more! The trouble is though they won't see it like that. The people who are generally in charge are in that position because they are highly motivated and aspire to work 5 days+ a week and now they've got there they couldn't go to a 4 day week, I just hope that they can see that is not the situation and aim for all, it doesn't mean the 4 dayer wanna-be won't be a good worker!

Edited January 17, 2009 by 911-caused-it-all